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Rifles, Reloading, Optics, Equipment
Reloading
Beating The Powder Companies....- Substitute Powders???
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<blockquote data-quote="Veteran" data-source="post: 2499600" data-attributes="member: 118038"><p>Ok, from time to time, we have discussed substitutes for Retumbo, and substitutes for Varget, etc. </p><p></p><p>My thought is to focus on what powders are made in the United States, as substitutes if it gets really worse.....</p><p>That rules out all Hodgdon powders, all Alliant Powders, All Vihtavuori powders and most everything except Accurate, Ramshot, and Winchester Powders.</p><p></p><p>So here is a chart I made using Quick Load of all the Burn Rates of some popular powders mixed in with some lesser known Accurate, Ramshot, and Winchester Powders. It might be a nice project for someone in the LRH community to test some of these close burn rate possible or potential substitutes for velocity difference, and sensitivity to temperature. I'm just suggesting if you ever can't find a specific Hodgdon, Alliant, or Vihtavuori Powder, you might look over this ranking and try one of the Accurate, Ramshot, or Winchester powders made here in the USA. They will not be temperature protected but otherwise ought to perform well in moderate climates. </p><p></p><p>I put a T out beside the powders I know are temperature protected or advertised as so. I may have missed a few, so chime in if so.</p><p></p><p>I didn't list some of the Enduron powders as they are IMR and may be just as hard to find as Hodgdon since they are not made in the US either, </p><p>but in Canada as I understand it. </p><p></p><p>Some may claim that Hodgdon and IMR are US powders but as far as I know they are all made in Australia and Canada and imported in bulk to be </p><p>packaged and distributed here by Hodgdon. Hodgodon also distributes Winchester, but they are made in St. Marks, Florida.</p><p></p><p>The powders below are ranked by burn rate Ba value out of QL. Fastest to slowest. Who has tried Accurate 8700 in place of N570 for example?</p><p>Any results?</p><p></p><table style='width: 100%'><tr><td>Varget</td><td></td><td><div style="text-align: right">0.615</div> </td><td>T</td></tr><tr><td>N140</td><td></td><td><div style="text-align: right">0.61</div> </td><td></td></tr><tr><td>IMR4320</td><td></td><td><div style="text-align: right">0.592</div> </td><td></td></tr><tr><td>IMR 4166</td><td></td><td><div style="text-align: right">0.589</div> </td><td>T</td></tr><tr><td>IMR4451</td><td></td><td><div style="text-align: right">0.575</div> </td><td>T</td></tr><tr><td>Win 748</td><td></td><td><div style="text-align: right">0.565</div> </td><td></td></tr><tr><td>H-4895</td><td></td><td><div style="text-align: right">0.5571</div> </td><td>T</td></tr><tr><td>SW Precision</td><td><div style="text-align: right"></div> </td><td>0.528</td><td></td></tr><tr><td>acc2230</td><td></td><td><div style="text-align: right">0.523</div> </td><td></td></tr><tr><td>RS Big Game</td><td><div style="text-align: right"></div> </td><td>0.522</td><td></td></tr><tr><td>H4350</td><td></td><td><div style="text-align: right">0.513</div> </td><td>T</td></tr><tr><td>acc2700</td><td></td><td><div style="text-align: right">0.506</div> </td><td></td></tr><tr><td>acc2460</td><td></td><td><div style="text-align: right">0.488</div> </td><td></td></tr><tr><td>acc2520</td><td></td><td><div style="text-align: right">0.485</div> </td><td></td></tr><tr><td>RS Hunter</td><td></td><td><div style="text-align: right">0.458</div> </td><td></td></tr><tr><td>Win 760</td><td></td><td><div style="text-align: right">0.4529</div> </td><td></td></tr><tr><td>H4831 SC</td><td></td><td><div style="text-align: right">0.4301</div> </td><td>T</td></tr><tr><td>Win 780</td><td></td><td><div style="text-align: right">0.421</div> </td><td></td></tr><tr><td>acc 4064</td><td></td><td><div style="text-align: right">0.4025</div> </td><td></td></tr><tr><td>Win WXR</td><td></td><td><div style="text-align: right">0.386</div> </td><td></td></tr><tr><td>RL25</td><td></td><td><div style="text-align: right">0.384</div> </td><td></td></tr><tr><td>N560</td><td></td><td><div style="text-align: right">0.371</div> </td><td></td></tr><tr><td>H1000</td><td></td><td><div style="text-align: right">0.366</div> </td><td>T</td></tr><tr><td>acc3100</td><td></td><td><div style="text-align: right">0.347</div> </td><td></td></tr><tr><td>Ramshot Mag</td><td><div style="text-align: right"></div> </td><td>0.345</td><td></td></tr><tr><td>RL26</td><td></td><td><div style="text-align: right">0.3397</div> </td><td></td></tr><tr><td>Retumbo</td><td></td><td><div style="text-align: right">0.337</div> </td><td></td></tr><tr><td>Acc Magpro</td><td><div style="text-align: right"></div> </td><td>0.3342</td><td></td></tr><tr><td>N565</td><td></td><td><div style="text-align: right">0.3109</div> </td><td>T</td></tr><tr><td>IMR8133</td><td></td><td><div style="text-align: right">0.3</div> </td><td></td></tr><tr><td>N568</td><td></td><td><div style="text-align: right">0.3</div> </td><td>T</td></tr><tr><td>Ramshot LRT</td><td><div style="text-align: right"></div> </td><td>0.285</td><td></td></tr><tr><td>N570</td><td></td><td><div style="text-align: right">0.277</div> </td><td></td></tr><tr><td>acc8700</td><td></td><td><div style="text-align: right">0.2713</div> </td><td></td></tr><tr><td>RL33</td><td></td><td><div style="text-align: right">0.267</div> </td><td></td></tr></table></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Veteran, post: 2499600, member: 118038"] Ok, from time to time, we have discussed substitutes for Retumbo, and substitutes for Varget, etc. My thought is to focus on what powders are made in the United States, as substitutes if it gets really worse..... That rules out all Hodgdon powders, all Alliant Powders, All Vihtavuori powders and most everything except Accurate, Ramshot, and Winchester Powders. So here is a chart I made using Quick Load of all the Burn Rates of some popular powders mixed in with some lesser known Accurate, Ramshot, and Winchester Powders. It might be a nice project for someone in the LRH community to test some of these close burn rate possible or potential substitutes for velocity difference, and sensitivity to temperature. I'm just suggesting if you ever can't find a specific Hodgdon, Alliant, or Vihtavuori Powder, you might look over this ranking and try one of the Accurate, Ramshot, or Winchester powders made here in the USA. They will not be temperature protected but otherwise ought to perform well in moderate climates. I put a T out beside the powders I know are temperature protected or advertised as so. I may have missed a few, so chime in if so. I didn't list some of the Enduron powders as they are IMR and may be just as hard to find as Hodgdon since they are not made in the US either, but in Canada as I understand it. Some may claim that Hodgdon and IMR are US powders but as far as I know they are all made in Australia and Canada and imported in bulk to be packaged and distributed here by Hodgdon. Hodgodon also distributes Winchester, but they are made in St. Marks, Florida. The powders below are ranked by burn rate Ba value out of QL. Fastest to slowest. Who has tried Accurate 8700 in place of N570 for example? Any results? [TABLE] [TR] [TD]Varget[/TD] [TD][/TD] [TD][RIGHT]0.615[/RIGHT][/TD] [TD]T[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]N140[/TD] [TD][/TD] [TD][RIGHT]0.61[/RIGHT][/TD] [TD][/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]IMR4320[/TD] [TD][/TD] [TD][RIGHT]0.592[/RIGHT][/TD] [TD][/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]IMR 4166[/TD] [TD][/TD] [TD][RIGHT]0.589[/RIGHT][/TD] [TD]T[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]IMR4451[/TD] [TD][/TD] [TD][RIGHT]0.575[/RIGHT][/TD] [TD]T[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]Win 748[/TD] [TD][/TD] [TD][RIGHT]0.565[/RIGHT][/TD] [TD][/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]H-4895[/TD] [TD][/TD] [TD][RIGHT]0.5571[/RIGHT][/TD] [TD]T[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]SW Precision[/TD] [TD][RIGHT][/RIGHT][/TD] [TD]0.528[/TD] [TD][/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]acc2230[/TD] [TD][/TD] [TD][RIGHT]0.523[/RIGHT][/TD] [TD][/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]RS Big Game[/TD] [TD][RIGHT][/RIGHT][/TD] [TD]0.522[/TD] [TD][/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]H4350[/TD] [TD][/TD] [TD][RIGHT]0.513[/RIGHT][/TD] [TD]T[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]acc2700[/TD] [TD][/TD] [TD][RIGHT]0.506[/RIGHT][/TD] [TD][/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]acc2460[/TD] [TD][/TD] [TD][RIGHT]0.488[/RIGHT][/TD] [TD][/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]acc2520[/TD] [TD][/TD] [TD][RIGHT]0.485[/RIGHT][/TD] [TD][/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]RS Hunter[/TD] [TD][/TD] [TD][RIGHT]0.458[/RIGHT][/TD] [TD][/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]Win 760[/TD] [TD][/TD] [TD][RIGHT]0.4529[/RIGHT][/TD] [TD][/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]H4831 SC[/TD] [TD][/TD] [TD][RIGHT]0.4301[/RIGHT][/TD] [TD]T[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]Win 780[/TD] [TD][/TD] [TD][RIGHT]0.421[/RIGHT][/TD] [TD][/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]acc 4064[/TD] [TD][/TD] [TD][RIGHT]0.4025[/RIGHT][/TD] [TD][/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]Win WXR[/TD] [TD][/TD] [TD][RIGHT]0.386[/RIGHT][/TD] [TD][/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]RL25[/TD] [TD][/TD] [TD][RIGHT]0.384[/RIGHT][/TD] [TD][/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]N560[/TD] [TD][/TD] [TD][RIGHT]0.371[/RIGHT][/TD] [TD][/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]H1000[/TD] [TD][/TD] [TD][RIGHT]0.366[/RIGHT][/TD] [TD]T[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]acc3100[/TD] [TD][/TD] [TD][RIGHT]0.347[/RIGHT][/TD] [TD][/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]Ramshot Mag[/TD] [TD][RIGHT][/RIGHT][/TD] [TD]0.345[/TD] [TD][/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]RL26[/TD] [TD][/TD] [TD][RIGHT]0.3397[/RIGHT][/TD] [TD][/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]Retumbo[/TD] [TD][/TD] [TD][RIGHT]0.337[/RIGHT][/TD] [TD][/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]Acc Magpro[/TD] [TD][RIGHT][/RIGHT][/TD] [TD]0.3342[/TD] [TD][/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]N565[/TD] [TD][/TD] [TD][RIGHT]0.3109[/RIGHT][/TD] [TD]T[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]IMR8133[/TD] [TD][/TD] [TD][RIGHT]0.3[/RIGHT][/TD] [TD][/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]N568[/TD] [TD][/TD] [TD][RIGHT]0.3[/RIGHT][/TD] [TD]T[/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]Ramshot LRT[/TD] [TD][RIGHT][/RIGHT][/TD] [TD]0.285[/TD] [TD][/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]N570[/TD] [TD][/TD] [TD][RIGHT]0.277[/RIGHT][/TD] [TD][/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]acc8700[/TD] [TD][/TD] [TD][RIGHT]0.2713[/RIGHT][/TD] [TD][/TD] [/TR] [TR] [TD]RL33[/TD] [TD][/TD] [TD][RIGHT]0.267[/RIGHT][/TD] [TD][/TD] [/TR] [/TABLE] [/QUOTE]
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Beating The Powder Companies....- Substitute Powders???
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