What do you make of this ?

Discussion in 'Long Range Hunting & Shooting' started by Down Under Hunter, Jun 21, 2009.

  1. Down Under Hunter

    Down Under Hunter Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    912
    Joined:
    May 10, 2007
    Watched a friend fire at a large sambar stag yesterday evening from 950 yards .

    The deer was perfectly broadside and when the bullet got there the deer jumped and lurched about 4 ft in the air. He then made a mad dash in a semi circle from where he was facing and went out of site.

    Being as it was 20 min till dark we backed out and walked back in hoping to recover him this morning.

    Found the spot he was standing and confirmed with the rangefinder.

    Did I forget to mention that it had rained overnight aswell !!

    Eventually found his running mark and followed for about 30 yards when we found the first blood. Spotting and bright red. More or less spotting for about 30 yards then when we got in the open from under the tree canopy we lost the marks and blood together. We had a slight wind drift coming off the hill above and could smell a strong stag scent drifting to us. We cast around for some hours with no luck as it was extremely thick and nasty where he had gone. So far no good !

    At the shot the deer made this huge high leap and lunge forward. I have generally felt this indicated a hit through the lungs or heart area.

    He was bleeding out the entrance side and as the Matchkings make tiny entrance holes I feel he could well have been bleeding internally with no exit ?

    Hard to say. We have not givin up but feel disappointed after what appeared to be a well placed shot judging by the deers reaction.

    Penny for your thoughts...

    DUH
     
  2. ICANHITHIMMAN

    ICANHITHIMMAN Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    4,380
    Joined:
    Jan 31, 2008
    I might be way off but when they jump on me like that its beacuse I shot to far back.
     

  3. trueblue

    trueblue Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    2,127
    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2008
    Based on the discription, I would say the animal was shot to far back. I hope you find your animal.
     
  4. happylilcuss

    happylilcuss Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    163
    Joined:
    May 2, 2008
    I agree with the others.. Most of the time when I see an animal lurch like that it has been hit too far back. Keep looking and watch for birds! Most of the time I have had luck following the birds to animals that clients made poor shots on and we couldnt find right away. Also the lack of blood or spottyness of the blood seems to me to be the case with a shot back out of the vitals.
    Good luck. I sure hate leaving an animal because my lack of skill prevents being able to track it down.
     
  5. bigngreen

    bigngreen Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    5,840
    Joined:
    Nov 24, 2008
    I've also seen that reaction if you hit to far forward missing bone but getting some of the veins and windpipe low at the base of the neck, they jump way high usually with there hind end way higher than the front end. Usually get real marginal blood, if hit back most animals if not pushed bed up quickly. Can you tell about where on the animal the blood was dropping from based of the tracks, how close to the front track is the blood spot, this can really help if you can?
    Most of my shooting is in snow so that makes the tracking way easier than in a green time of year. Good luck
     
  6. trebark

    trebark Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    3,475
    Joined:
    Jan 16, 2008
    +1.....

     
  7. LRSickle

    LRSickle Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    614
    Joined:
    Jun 8, 2009
    I'll have to agree, I too believe you have a gut-shot on your hands. The rain won't help you tracking either. Good luck mate.
     
  8. Down Under Hunter

    Down Under Hunter Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    912
    Joined:
    May 10, 2007
    Appreciate everyones opinions ! Thanks

    I tend to think in a different direction.

    1. The blood is bright red arterial blood with small bubbles, no signs of stomach contents and not green or brown.

    2. After a mad rush the deer sliped and went to a slow walk with the blood trail starting immediately.

    3. Definitely bleeding through the entry hole and anyone with experience using the smk through the edge knows how small that hole will be... tiny.

    4. Highly likely the bullet did not exit and if it did at those velocities it would not have opened up much and pinholed.

    5. Deer did not show signs of hunching up like they usually do when hit too far back.

    6. Have also spoken to a couple of very well known guys on the forum with edge experience and they are thinking likewise. At a grand little blood trail is found normally with the 300 smk.

    To me I am thinking high hungs or over the heart.

    Deer was left overnight till 9 the next day and with a cold night I feel he would have bedded up quick.

    We are going back in over the weekend so we will see what we will see I quess ?

    DUH
     
  9. LRSickle

    LRSickle Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    614
    Joined:
    Jun 8, 2009
    Considering the color of blood and the absence of stomach matter, I believe you may be right.
    Maybe a hit on the edge of the lung?
    Be sure to update us on what you find. Chuck
     
  10. kiwi3006

    kiwi3006 Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    674
    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2007
    Hope you find him. I had a similar experience, dropped a red stag at 475 yards, he kicked on the ground for several seconds then got up and ran into the bush. Came back next day and grid searched for several hours with my dog, no sign. There was no blood on the ground though, switched from 30/06 to 7mm mag after that.

    I agree with you, bright red and bubbles means arterial, especially lung (bubbles) to me.

    Have you got access to a dog?

    stu.
     
  11. HUAINAMACHERO

    HUAINAMACHERO Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,080
    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2008
    DHU

    Dont consider myself an expert tracker but after reading your post got me thinking a couple of things.

    You mention bright red arterial blood with bubbles, after a complete night of being there with RAIN, I dont think that blood was from the day before, just after the shot. Maybe as you state he bedded quickly, and in the morning you guys pushed him away while hiking to where he was, that is why you found bright red arterial blood with bubbles as you mention. I dont think that the bright red arterial blood you describe was from the night before.
    It you were able to smell it maybe you were very close to where the buck is bedded. I once found a bear shoot the day before, that was dead in a water hole, and the only thing that could be seen was a little segment of black fur. Never give up in this search you guys are going through. If you keep looking for the animal and found it, you will have a lot of questions solved: where you hit it, bullet holes, bullet performance, distance from the place he was shoot and many more.
    Keep up with the search, maybe the dog idea is a very good idea.
    Good luck, your friends at this webpage are supporting you. Let us know how it ended.
     
    Last edited: Jul 24, 2009
  12. Down Under Hunter

    Down Under Hunter Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    912
    Joined:
    May 10, 2007

    Stu,

    May go that way if we have no luck.

    Problem he is a no dog area ?

    I still believe he's in there somewhere, just got to turn him up.

    Considering that 4/5 of the blood would have been washed away, I feel that a unfair picture was presented to us. Without rain I am sure there would have been alot more blood and we would feel more upbeat.

    As far as the blood from the morning after I dont think so considering the blood had clotted up and small fatty deposits could be seen in it. Blood goes like this when it cools down and has been sitting for a while.

    The search is ongoing..

    Thanks for the supportive words boys..

    DUH
     
  13. Down Under Hunter

    Down Under Hunter Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    912
    Joined:
    May 10, 2007
    Still no luck.

    Here is a pic of a sambar stag.

    Keep in mind that this stag is not standing perfect broadside but I have highlighted the area I belive the strike was.

    See below.

    [​IMG]

    My thinking is that the bullet has gone in high under the spine in the rear of the lungs or liver.

    The question is at a grand what effect is the stag going to feel from it.

    I just dont feel that he is bleeding from a muscle hit only and if the bullet had gone in higher we would have spined him on the spot ? Where could a non fatal shot into this area go ? The blood clearly indicates he is not his in the paunch.

    If he is hit in the rear of the lungs high or liver how long do you think he would have stayed on his feet before bedding ? Keeping in mind he was walking after a 5 second mad dash over 50 yards.

    I just know that this shot was good but we have been screwed by circumstances. I have placed trail cameras on his scrapes in the immediate area which I will leave for a couple of weeks. If I find he is not pictured and the area has shutdown for stag sign then I will launch a large scale grid exersize. The smell will be a huge assistance.

    I found one a few years back that made it 400 yards. We looked all the next day with a great dog and believe it or not we were standing within 30 yards of him, just the wind was wrong ?

    Anything is possible though as I have shot enough myself to know they are one tough beast !

    DUH
     
    Last edited: Jul 5, 2009
  14. J E Custom

    J E Custom Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    7,307
    Joined:
    Jul 29, 2004
    +1
    There is a spot in the middle that is shaped like a triangle surrounded by the heart,lungs and
    liver. I have hit quite a few hear with a bow because they drop to duck the arrow. And there
    reaction was almost always the same.

    The blood was a mix of bright and dark red some times having bubbles in it if I clipped the
    lungs. These deer always went a long ways and did not leave a very good blood trail because
    the body cavity caught most of the blood.

    It will take 6 to 8 hours for him to die so you did the right thing by leaving him until the next
    morning. To bad it rained though.

    J E CUSTOM