Seating bullet problem... need help

[SteveLM]

The very first thing I'd look at is your seater stem, in particular if the center is deep enough for the point / meplat. If the seater doesn't sit squarely on the ogive, you'll get concentricity issues like the ones you are describing...

 

[Paulstarr]

I'm having inconsistent bullet seating in regards to runout. Different bullets, dies, and presses.

Total runout varies from .001-.01.

Seating depth is fine, neck tension is .002.

Neck runout after sizing is under .002.

I've floated shell holders, rotated cases in steps when seating... doesn't seem to help a whole lot.

Using the sinclair concentricity gauge.

Anyone solve this problem?

Thanks
John

It's easy John,put the concentricity gauge back in the box and leave there.

 

[Paulstarr]

It's easy John,put the concentricity gauge back in the box and leave it there.

 

[Carlos88]

Consider change your seating plug to accommodate the shape of the bullet and acquire a precision seating die such as Reading Micrometer seating die. You'll eliminate most all your runout

Here's how to do it on the cheap. Can't afford match dies anymore so decided to fix runout on some standard Redding two die set for my 7x57.

Took awhile because runout was just horrible (130gr Interlocks). After numerous attempts found a dummy with the 139s that I measured at. 001. Removed the seating stem and placed it in a soft jaw wise. Grabbed drill and 1/8" bit and drilled a pocket at the bottom of the stem 1/16" deep or so. Scratched the side of the cup. Clean the whole mess with alcohol.

Mixed up a dab of Acraglas (green/blue box). Took a toothpick filled the pocket and sides with a small amount. About size of an eraser head worth. IMPORTANT: Spray the dummy round with Hornady One Shot case lube. Then do it again and let it dry. Spray inside of the die as well. DON'T SPRAY THE STEM.


Screw stem back in, screw die into press, place the dummy round in the shell holder and raise the ram. Feels like a little squishy. Let the weight of the arm do the squishing. Don't stand on it!

Let dry for at least 4 hours.

Lower ram. Remove stem then clean up around cup with a small metal file.

You just bedded your seating die. Yes, it works, albeit with only 139s but they're meat and potatoes for a 7x57. It doesn't make a match grade die but it will consistently get it in the .003" or less.

Caveat: I only shoot hunting rifles. One or two custom barrels, the others all factory. None over 8 1/4lbs. I also bed my AR15 uppers and lowest. What do I know.

Hope it helps someone.

 

[GLTaylor]

FWIW
Look up a guy named Eric Cortina on you tube he also go's by the nick name "Speedy Gonzalez" He is a national champion competitive shooter.
In one video concerning reloading techniques for obtaining maximum accuracy he said he cares nothing about run out up to IIRC 0.004" or 0.005" and considers only 5 shot 100 yard groups at or BELOW .25 MOA acceptable accuracy if his rifle shoots above. 25 MOA he he pulls that rifles barrel.
Mr Cortina produces IMO great common sense reloading video content.
Check him out

Just for the record, Eric and ""Speedy" are 2 different people. Eric shoots F Class and does well. "Speedy Gonzalez" is a benchrest shooter and gunsmith. He is a multiple time national BR champion and innovator for extreme accuracy. As a side note, Type S neck bushing dies by Redding are named after Speedy. He invented the concept.

 

[Dragoon300]

I have seen the expander ball cause bullet runout the most. It is worst when its dry, making a squeeze when pulling out.

 

[DartonJager]

I've watched most of his stuff... both he and F class John are pretty good.

I'm not denying that "if things shoot good who cares?"

It bothers me that i get so much variation.

We worry about shoulder bump, ES single digits, powder charge to .02...etc. yet i can't get a bullet seated straight consistently?

I need to get another seating stem. Then find my most straight round and I will mold the seating stem to my bullet.

I appreciate everyone's input, i have a few things to try and a few things to not worry about... haha

Did you by chance watch his video where explains how most reloaders over complicate the process and how he simplifies reloading?

 

[nksmfamjp]

I neck turn all my cases for my long range rifles to get runout as low as possible and neck tension as consistent as possible. My grandson runs an expander through everything instead of neck turning. We both use high end seating dies, Redding comp for me, and I seat bullets in three stages pushing it down about 1/3 and turning the case about 1/3 each time. We also use the appropriate seater stem for the bullet profile. I'm usually seeing runout in the range of .001-.002 total runout. Without turning the cases I see about double that. Is it making my ammo more accurate... not that I can tell, but I'm trying to squeeze out all the accuracy I can.

How are you measuring your runout?

 

[COBrad]

I have a jig for measuring runout. Measuring behind the ogive maybe .1 in front of the case mouth.

 

[jedimonkey]

Does any one use a Wilson type seating die??

 

[nwmnbowhunter]

So I got out tonight. 300 prc 199 hammers. 700 yards. Shot three 3 shot groups.

3 with .006 runout, then 3 with .001 runout, then 3 with .006 runout.

5 minutes between shots, 10 mph or so wind [i didn't put any correction].

All six .006 runout were shot at same spot.
1.46 MOA

Here's the .001 runout group.
.356 MOA

Also shot my 270 win at 170 yards. 116 absolute hammers.

Three .006 runout
1.522 MOA

Three. 002 runout
.874 MOA

No this isn't a huge sample size, but interesting to say the least.

 

[Dragoon300]

So I got out tonight. 300 prc 199 hammers. 700 yards. Shot three 3 shot groups.

3 with .006 runout, then 3 with .001 runout, then 3 with .006 runout.

5 minutes between shots, 10 mph or so wind [i didn't put any correction].

All six .006 runout were shot at same spot.
1.46 MOA
View attachment 265832

Here's the .001 runout group.
.356 MOA
View attachment 265833

Also shot my 270 win at 170 yards. 116 absolute hammers.

Three .006 runout
1.522 MOA
View attachment 265835

Three. 002 runout
.874 MOA
View attachment 265834

No this isn't a huge sample size, but interesting to say the least.

Good job!
Nice work.
Runout is important to address, like most other things involved in precision reloading, all are critical at longer ranges and on smaller targets.

 

[GLTaylor]

Does any one use a Wilson type seating die??

Yes. I have them for many calibers. For wildcats you buy a blank for your caliber and have the smith ream the blank with the same reamer he uses for your chamber. Perfect allignment for seating bullets.

 

[ButterBean]

FWIW
Look up a guy named Eric Cortina on you tube he also go's by the nick name "Speedy Gonzalez" He is a national champion competitive shooter.
In one video concerning reloading techniques for obtaining maximum accuracy he said he cares nothing about run out up to IIRC 0.004" or 0.005" and considers only 5 shot 100 yard groups at or BELOW .25 MOA acceptable accuracy if his rifle shoots above. 25 MOA he he pulls that rifles barrel.
Mr Cortina produces IMO great common sense reloading video content.
Check him out

Survey Say's , Not on the board, as GL stated they are two entirely different people and what does this have to do with the OP's question ?