Long Range Rig Guidance please ???

Discussion in 'Long Range Hunting & Shooting' started by robbobsam, Jun 2, 2011.

  1. robbobsam

    robbobsam Well-Known Member

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    Hiya Guys,

    I am in the market for a new custom rifle in .223 for long range varminting and the spec is as follows.

    Accuracy International stock.
    26" 1 in 8 Lothar Walther Barrel.
    Lawton Action
    Jewell trigger
    20moa Picatinny rail
    5-25 x 56 PMII

    My main concern is the barrel, I have always wanted a custom rifle and always though the barrel should be a "Cut" barrel, but my local gunsmith is pushing the button cut Lothar Walther barrels.

    Are they any good ???

    I will be using this rifle for long range paper punching and long range varminting (Rabbits up to 600yds) What do you think of the spec ???

    Your thought would be very much appreciated.
     
  2. Rocky Mountain

    Rocky Mountain Well-Known Member

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    Sep 13, 2010
    The 223 improved is a reall performer with a 1-8 barrel and 70g-80gr bullets no reall difference in barrel life with some improved velocity over the 223.lightbulb
     

  3. long450

    long450 Well-Known Member

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    Get the barrel you want! I would go Kreiger if it was me. I would not bother with the AI for the 223 Rem.
     
  4. liltank

    liltank Well-Known Member

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    How does 1/4 MOA tickle your fancy? I have a Lothar Walther barrel in a 28" 1:12 .308 barrel. I have a 200yd 3 shot group target measuring .555" (.265 MOA), 4 shot group .75" group at 300yds (.25 MOA), and just shot a 6 shot string yesterday measuring 3" at 645yds (roughly .430MOA). So this thing has been great. After break in it cleans up well too. The load I am currently shooting will put the cold bore next to the following shots. The guy that suggested this barrel manufacturer owns several barrels. He and his wife have won some F-class shoots in .260 Rem and .308 Win. All three rifles are built on Savage actions. I would say they are good barrels. The are made with 550 Stainless shipped straight from Germany. That is harder than the 416 Stainless used here in the states. I really like my barrel and they are comparable in cost with other barrel makers.

    Give it a shot. I did and couldn't be happier!:cool:

    Tank
     
  5. joseph

    joseph Well-Known Member

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  6. trebark

    trebark Well-Known Member

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    223 is nice, but why not move up to 6mm or 6.5mm? you can get better BC bullets and shoot farther with much less wind drift than the 223.

    If you stay with the 223, 1:8 twist is where you need to be so that you can shoot the 77+grain bullets.

    Although button rifling is accurate (I have a Hart that is button rifled), generally speaking, cut riflig is the go-to rifling for accurate barrels. Look at Brux, Krieger and alternatively, Broughton 5C (canted rifling)
     
  7. sp6x6

    sp6x6 Well-Known Member

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    I agree with others, for investment, I would up the caliber to min. 6mm, youll like better in wind and range capability
     
  8. liltank

    liltank Well-Known Member

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    He already owns a 243. From his posts, he is quite accomplished with it.

    Tank
     
  9. robbobsam

    robbobsam Well-Known Member

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    Yes as Liltank said, I already have a .243Win and I am changing it as I would prefer a rifle with less recoil when shooting at very small targets at long distances. a .223Rem with a 1 in 8 twist will give me 1/2 the recoil with a 75 grain AMax and a better BC than an 87 grain V-Max in 6mm with a similar velocity.

    I think the .223rem is a better option for the vermin I have in mind.

    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VWRgAdKSVI4"].223rem in action at 570yds.[/ame]

    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=66zG5TckXb8"].223 in action again.[/ame]

    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iHHNgm7E95M"]Taking a fox with it.[/ame]
     
  10. joseph

    joseph Well-Known Member

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    Well it looks like robbobsam has his mind made up for the .223. They didn't even get out to 600 yds. When shooting High Power competition you shoot out to 600 yds. with open sights. Scopes are not permitted.

    6mm Norma BR. has very long barrel life even with the Berger 105 gr. VLDs that I use and almost no more recoil than the .223 with 80 gr. bullets.

    http://www.6mmbr.com/6mmbr.html

    I went the .223 route for a while until I couldn't compete at the longer ranges.

    Oh well live and learn,

    joseph

    PS: The velocity of the .223 with a .75 gr. bullet is close to 2,700 fps and the 105 gr. VLDs are close to 3,000 fps. Berger .75 gr. Match have a BC of 217 G7 and the 105 gr. VLD BC 272 G7.
     
    Last edited: Jun 3, 2011
  11. joe0121

    joe0121 Well-Known Member

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    I agree.

    Cut barrels give you more options but turn around is longer. Button rifled barrels are fine as long as they are stress releived. Leija would be my first choice for a button rifled.

    I love Kreiger tubes plain and simple, long wait though. For 800 bucks I sent them my rifle and they installed the barrel chambered it and blue printed the action.

    Lieja would be my second choice and I would imagine a shorter turn around. Some other names are Hart, and Brux. All make excellent barrel and in reality there is no compelling difference other that personal preference.

    I can tell you that krieger will sit with on the phone for 45 minutes while you decide on what contour/twist stainless vs chrome that means something to me. I can also tell you that with the bore all marred from using a cheap cleaning rod and 3000 rounds down the barrel in 90 degree heat a Krieger barrel will print a 7/8 group at 185 yards. This tell me two things. They use good steel and KG bore polish works as advertized. Almost zero POI shift from warm or hot bore. Shoots even cheap wal mart ammo at 1.2 MOA