Ladder Test vs QuickLoad - What do you prefer and why

[asd9055]

I have been scouring through the reloading posts, both here and other boards and it seems that more and more people swear by the Ladder Test method. I am probably stirring up a hornets nest, but If I have QuickLoad, calibrated to my case capacity and powder burning rate, isn't it better than the Ladder Test?
With ladder test you are looking for a "node" with load increments and chrono. Once you find the general load for the node, you try to fine tune it.
With QL, you start very close to the node by modelling, you get closer after you have actual data with chrono and "trigger" time and get back to the range for fine tuning.
Both methods, used correctly, require trigger time, chrono and iterations. I think both methods work.
I would like to hear your comments/experiences, but I would be mostly interested to hearing from people who have used both as they are meant to be used

Thanks in advance
Good shooting!!!

 

[L.Sherm]

Quick load isnt gonna take into consideration harmonics of the barrel, every barrel is different no matter the caliber.
Ladder test every time.

 

[Buck Fever]

If you are smart about it, an OCW ladder gets you to a node quickly. You still have to tune for jump with Quick Load so it's not much faster.

There is also powder variability by lot and storage conditions that QL can't model so the best you get is an educated guess. Great for new wildcats, less important for established cartridges with relevant load data available.

 

[asd9055]

Sherm,
Do the harmonics change the muzzle velocity?

 

[asd9055]

If you are smart about it, an OCW ladder gets you to a node quickly. You still have to tune for jump with Quick Load so it's not much faster.

There is also powder variability by lot and storage conditions that QL can't model so the best you get is an educated guess. Great for new wildcats, less important for established cartridges with relevant load data available.

Doesn't powder variability affect the ladder test?

 

[Buck Fever]

No it does not because once you have found your load, you are going to be using the same powder (until you run out, 8lb jugs are your friend).

That question makes me think you have a lot to learn.

Beside the difference between lots that you can see, temperature is going to change your velocity to a certain extent. If you develop a load in winter cold, shooting it in summer heat might be a proof load. Do the opposite and your summer load might be really slow in the winter.

You need to know what your load is and how it will react in any conditions. You also need to consistently produce identical ammo every time. That means keeping track of your process and understanding all the variables.

Read a couple reloading books and then read them again to make sure you understand.

 

[L.Sherm]

Sherm,
Do the harmonics change the muzzle velocity?

Harmonics are about the barrel whip, not velocity.

 

[asd9055]

Yes, I know that, but the ladder test is looking for the initial node based on muzzle velocities. Harmonics do not play a role. The same with QL. Once you have an idea of where a node might be, you fine tune, and that is where harmonics come into play. Apply equally to both methods.
I understand both methods, I am looking for comments from people who have experience with both.
Speaking of harmonics, I am one of the few believers and users of the BOSS system. I believe someone recently posted their new harmonic tuner on this forum last week
Anyways, I appreciate your input Sherm

 

[L.Sherm]

A Ladder test is not based on muzzle velocity it's based on grouping of loads.

 

[L.Sherm]

There was a thread a few days ago on this exact thing do a seach

 

[L.Sherm]

I'll post this again you'll notice no velocity even written on the ladder test.

 

[asd9055]

Sherm,
I am just an amateur when it comes to reloading. I had developed three loads back and the 80's, the old way of 5 rounds for each load, and none since then. So far for my new rifles I fine tuned loads from my friends to work on my rifles.
Yes, I saw the articles a few days ago, that is why I started thinking about it. I have used QL for initial node, calibrated and then fine tuned the same way as it is done with Ladder test method.
In the ladder test, the initial load depends on muzzle velocities. I spent a load of time watching the videos and reading various publications on it. The fine tuning depends in grouping.

 

[asd9055]

I'll post this again you'll notice no velocity even written on the ladder test.

I could show you several examples where they actually graph the muzzle velocities and looking for a "flat" area in the graph. Maybe I am wrong. The latest variation of the ladder test I was reading was by Scott Satterlee. He definitely uses muzzle velocities.

I am not trying to be argumentative, I am trying to learn. Again, Thanks Sherm

 

[asd9055]

Here is one of the articles I was referring too. They surely show velocities as initial criterion.

Creighton Audette’s Ladder Test

Creighton Audette came up with a method for developing precision rifle handloads that has been refer...

precisionrifleblog.com