Can nickel plated brass take more pressure?

Discussion in 'Rifles, Bullets, Barrels & Ballistics' started by dwm, Feb 8, 2006.

  1. dwm

    dwm Well-Known Member

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    I'm thinking there is a lot of nickel plated factory loaded ammo out there and there must be a reason.

    I have noticed that the Remington RSAUM and Ultra Mag brass seems a bit on the soft side.

    Does anyone know how and have the equipment to test this?

    Anyway back to my point. I have been considering switching to nickel plated brass for the Remington RSUAM and Ultra Mag catridges.

    I would be running the pressure right under the point where ejector marks and flattened primers occur. Then only neck sizing the cases to 0.001 or 0.002 tension.

    I am thinking I may be able to squeeze a bit more out of the Remington nickel plated brass than the seemingly soft regular brass.

    Anyone tried this?

    I have never messed with nickel plated brass, what are the draw backs?
     

  2. uncleB

    uncleB Well-Known Member

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    dwm,
    can niclel plated brass take more pressure NO but it can cause more pressure because of reduced case capacity. the reason that you speak of is so ammo manufacturers can call it "premium" or SPECIAL and charge you 20 more bucks a box. if you do get sucked into this marketing propaganda back off your powder charge 1-2grns or more and work up.
    UB
     

  3. Jimm

    Jimm Writers Guild

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    Hey DWM,

    Is more pressure the thing you want or accuracy ? Questions like this can always be pointed to the bench resters , that is to say , " do they use nickel plated brass " I almost forgot to say that corrosion is a factor for those going into excessive enviroments ( salt water ) and perhaps this would justify the nickel

    Jim B.
     
  4. remingtonman_25_06

    remingtonman_25_06 Well-Known Member

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    I heard that remingtons nickel plated brass was about the worst for consistency. I use to buy it for my 22-250's and 25-06's, but since have switched to winchester brass. That being said, I have no custom guns or barrels for that matter, and I still had under .5" loads with the Rem nickel brass.
     
  5. Bart B

    Bart B Well-Known Member

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    Several ammo makers have offered nickel plated brass cases. They are no stronger than plain brass ones. Their hardness can be measured at a machine shop that has a hardness tester; you'll need a couple of flat pieces of the case body wall to test.

    Brass starts to extrude at about 70,000 ppsi. The thin coat of nickel on the brass is meaningless as far as strength is concerned.

    The only advantage of nickel plated brass cases is they have less resistance to sliding out of a magazine so the make rapid fire with a bolt gun a bit easier. If sizing dies are a bit too rough on the inside, they will soon wear the nickel plating off.
     
  6. LRHWAL

    LRHWAL Well-Known Member

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    Bart is right. The pistol guys get slightly better relaibility with nickel because of the slicker finish.

    How do you preform various of the precision relaoding steps on nickel plated caese? Neck turning (if you do that)being a prime example.

    What I don't like is that the finish comes off / sometimes peels and scratches and leaves sharp edges (although the modern stuff is no doubt slightly better).

    If you scratch nickel, chances are it'll scratch your dies. In that vein check this out: http://www.redding-reloading.com/techlinepages/scratchedcases.htm

    (see point 5).

    Wim
     
  7. LB

    LB Well-Known Member

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    It has been mentioned, above. The only justification I know of is a salt water or corrosive environment. Like, you make up a large quantity of special loads and expect them to store for a long time, like for your AR on a boat trip to Tahitti, etc. (not Mexico, BTW, they still fear the coming revolution)

    Otherwise, you cannot trim your brass, necks, etc. all the operations we normally do to rifle cases. Pretty much worthless for precision handloading, dulls all your cutting edges, peels off, cut your finger on shrapnel, etc.

    It's great for any handgun....

    Good hunting. LB
     
  8. Bart B

    Bart B Well-Known Member

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    [ QUOTE ]
    dwm,
    NO but it can cause more pressure because of reduced case capacity.
    UB

    [/ QUOTE ]

    First time I've heard or read about nickel plated cases having less capacity. I've measured body and neck wall thickness as well as case capacity and weight between Federal .308 Win. all brass and nickel plated cases. Zero difference. So, these two types will produce the same pressure with the same reassembly techniques.
     
  9. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Bart B, are you any relation to the famous bartb@hpfcla.fc.hp.com (Bart Bobbitt)
     
  10. uncleB

    uncleB Well-Known Member

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    [ QUOTE ]
    [ QUOTE ]
    dwm,
    NO but it can cause more pressure because of reduced case capacity.
    UB

    [/ QUOTE ]I have only used nickel plated cases in 2 guns one was a 300WM ,I had Fed Nickel plated cases and Fed regular brass cases the necks were .0005 thicker and the cases held 3grns less water in the nickel than the all brass cases , same story on gun #2 270win only with Win nickel and all brass cases and 2 gr difference. did you measure cases of the same manufacturer?????????
    UB

    First time I've heard or read about nickel plated cases having less capacity. I've measured body and neck wall thickness as well as case capacity and weight between Federal .308 Win. all brass and nickel plated cases. Zero difference. So, these two types will produce the same pressure with the same reassembly techniques.

    [/ QUOTE ]
     
  11. Ridge Runner

    Ridge Runner Well-Known Member

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    Bart, federal brass has on average 3% more case capacity than other brands.
    Nickel brass is brass coated inside and out with nickel plating, this nickel plating is harder than your dies, or your chamber. on resizing the soft brass in between the hard plating flexes much more, gradualy and usualy around the necks the nickel comes loose and flakes off.
    Nickel is good for what its intended for, to load up and carry for months in harsh climates and not corode, thats why its popular with PH's in africa, its not for everyday reloaders/shooters.
    RR
     
  12. Bart B

    Bart B Well-Known Member

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    No, I'm not related. I'm the same person.

    I retired from Hewlett-Packard eleven years ago.
     
  13. Bart B

    Bart B Well-Known Member

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    James, gotta comment on your comments.....

    "Bart, federal brass has on average 3% more case capacity than other brands."

    I don't know what your experiences have been, but in my .308 Win. cases, the Federal brass I've reloaded (nickel plated and naked) has less capacity than Remington BR (small rifle primer) cases, Winchester commercial and 92 Palma cases and Western Cartridge Company WCC58 cases (WCC58 being the finest .308 Win. cases ever made; only 150 grain weight). And Federal ones weighed more, too.

    "Nickel brass is brass coated inside and out with nickel plating, this nickel plating is harder than your dies, or your chamber. on resizing the soft brass in between the hard plating flexes much more, gradualy and usualy around the necks the nickel comes loose and flakes off."

    I know that. But in my six .308 Win. full-length sizing dies, the ones with smoother insides didn't wear off the nickel plating through 40 or 50 reloads as fast as the ones with rougher insides.

    Maybe I just do wierd things when I reload.