last year i started loading the 35 whelen with remington brass winchester large rifle primers cfe 223 speer250 hot core from speer book number 15. rifle is a ruger haweye 24 1-12 twist book max is 67 grains at2788 got there without pressure but best group was at 66 grains at average vel of 2690. my question about that is same book shows the 358 norma mag same bullet at 2732 with 76 grains of imr 4350that just does not seem right to me. is the 358 pressure that much lower? or is the book not right?
35 whelen
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Lefty7mmstw
Well-Known Member
nope... the 338 Norma runs the same pressure as a 300win or 338win... As to real world speed with a 35 whelen, I also have a Hawyeye in 35 whelen. She runs 2700 fps with rl15 and 220 speer pills. To push over 2700 fps with 250's is rather much a pipe dream without beating things up. Certain barrels may be a bit fast, but it's still a stretch.
He said 358 Norma not 338 which is a slightly shortend and improved 338 Laupa case.
Not difficult at all to hit 2700 FPS in the 35 Whelen with Power Pro 2000MR or CFE223.
These new progressive powders change the game dramatically
Lefty7mmstw
Well-Known Member
So I had a typo, still runs at the same pressure... You can run a 250 at 2700 in a 35 whelen if you want to, but I will not... I don't like beating up my rifles...
| MR | IMR 8208 XBR | OUT OF STOCK | 0.358" | 3.290" | 49.0 | 2,311 | 44,000 CUP | 54.3C | 2,515 | 50,300 CUP |
You should take a look at the new Speer data and they are showing 2700 with 200MR which means pressure is within SAAMI specs. Not beating my gun up anymore than you are with the older powders at slower velocity with equal pressure.
LaHunter
Well-Known Member
Are you actually achieving the stated book velocities (labradar / magneto)? I recently started loading for a new CVA 35 Whelen (24" barrel). With 225 grain Nosler AB loaded with 56 grains of IMR 4064, I am slower by more than 100 fps than the Nosler book velocity. I'm not sure how much more I can load in the case before I start compressing the powder.
I have an 1885 Highwall in 35 Whelen which has a 28" barrel I am using Power Pro Varmint & CFE223 in mine depending on bullet weight. I exceed factory load claimed velocities in mine. So yes I am achieving more than the claimed velocities.
4064 isn't going to give you the velocity that Power Pro Varmint. 2000MR or CFE223 will give you
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Lefty7mmstw
Well-Known Member
so you have about 2600 fps on tap if you don't want to run ball powder... good to know...I never run ball powder in a load I will hunt... I'd bet rl16 would do well, but the speer data doesn't have it...
You are missing out on some excellent powders, better than the old standbys. My accuracy is excellent and so far I've taken 2 deer and a hog.
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LaHunter
Well-Known Member
The Nosler Manual states 225 gr AB velocities of 2737 fps with 56 gr of IMR 4064 and 2800 fps with 58 gr of IMR 4064. Their testing was with a 26" pacNor barrel. The IMR 4064 & Varget had the fastest velocities in the Nosler Manual. The powders you list were not included in their 225 AB data. I was able to find the IMR 4064, so that was a determining factor for me using it
I have found Speer loads in their latest manual to be a bit on the hot side in other cartridges. Speer shows 2700 fps but thats in whatever rifle they used and a 24" barrel and a max load according to them. In a computer simulation, that 66.2 gr load shows 86,000 psi. It depends on the rifle. While I dont shoot 35 Whelen, I have shot some speer data in various cartridges and as I approached max I got stiff bolt lift and ejector marks and the computer sim agreed with my rifle. As always, books and computers are reference and not cut and dried, just simply what speer found in their lab with whatever they were shooting.
Different cases also have different capacities among other differences. I've found Nosler load data velocities to be very optimistic
