Deerhntr71
Well-Known Member
I am kicking around the idea of a long range rifle in a Browning X-Bolt Long Range Hunter carbon fiber in 300 Win or Remington Sendero II in 300 Rum or a 30-378 Weatherby in a Mark V Carbon fiber. Any thoughts. Thanks.
300 Win vs 300 RUM vs 30-378 Weatherby
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smithstation
Member
I have a sendero II in 7mm rem. and I love it. Also have a Rem. 700 with HS 2000 stock. Its in 300RUM, I love it as well. I was going to rebarrel the RUM but it shoots .5 MOA at 200yds so why change it. The sendero will do the same. I have been really happy with both.
Lefty7mmstw
Well-Known Member
The win will net you a bit better bbl. life; the rum will be 200 fps faster give or take with a given bullet, and the roy just burns more powder than the rum for little gain in standard barrel lengths. All are good rounds with cost effectiveness going to the win and rum. You'll have to line roy's pockets if you go there.
I shoot both the 300 win in a lh browing a-bolt ss boss and the 300 rum in a lh m700bdl.
Fiftydriver
Official LRH Sponsor
Go with the Remington RUM, if the other two do not shoot, your pretty much screwed as far as rebuilding. Can be done but the outcome can be tricky compared to rebuilding a Remington 700.
Plus, in a 26" barrel length, the 30-378 will not outperform the 300 RUM by ALOT if loaded to the same pressures. But you will pay through the nose for extremely expensive brass that really is not the best quality as far as strength goes. Plus, your burning about 15 grains more powder for 50 fps more velocity.
I would not look at the Browning, just to many issues lately with Browning rifles to recommend, stick with the Rem.
Better yet, if you can afford it, start custom from the ground up. May surprise you what it would cost for a full custom rifle on a budget.
Plus, in a 26" barrel length, the 30-378 will not outperform the 300 RUM by ALOT if loaded to the same pressures. But you will pay through the nose for extremely expensive brass that really is not the best quality as far as strength goes. Plus, your burning about 15 grains more powder for 50 fps more velocity.
I would not look at the Browning, just to many issues lately with Browning rifles to recommend, stick with the Rem.
Better yet, if you can afford it, start custom from the ground up. May surprise you what it would cost for a full custom rifle on a budget.
R.Morehouse
Well-Known Member
Another vote for the RUM....Go with the non-belted case, just seems a bit more 21st century. gun)
Trickymissfit
Well-Known Member
I wouldn't consider any of the three, but head strait to a .300 WBY mag, or a .300 Ackley
gary
Broz
Well-Known Member
I have owned, loaded for and shot all 3. I am happily back to my 300 win and with 215 Bergers, it is a very nice set up. Good brass available as well a factory match ammo.
I would definitely go with the Sendero. I have probably set up a dozen 300 win Sendero's for 1000 yard rifles and they all have been able to hold 1 moa at 1000, some better.
If you want to hunt elk past 1000 then go 300 rum or 30-378 with 230 Bergers.
For elk to 1000 and deer to 1300 and steel or rocks to a mile the 300 win Sendero is a good rifle.
Jeff
lloydsmale
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dont own a 30-378 but do own a 300 ultra, 300 win, 300wsm a 300 h&h and a 300 wby and out of the 5 if i had to pick a favorite it would be the 300 wby mag.
Fiftydriver
Official LRH Sponsor
Nothing wrong at all with the 300 Wby, 300 Ackley or 300 Jarrett but I think he is looking to get into a factory rifle first so that eliminates all but the 300 Wby.
The 300 Wby is a great round no doubt but it has issues as well. The 300 RUM will easily match 300 Wby loads in performance is you want to take a bit off the throttle, or it will add 150 fps to what the Wby will do in spite of what is claimed by many that the 300 Wby will match the RUM. That is not correct unless the Wby is loaded to very high pressures.
The RUM case is just a better all around case design and not TO BIG for a 26" barrel length, in fact the 300 RUM does extremely well in a 26" barrel length just as the 300 Wby does.
The 30-378 is much better suited to 28" or longer barrels to allow it to actually show a significant advantage in velocity over the 300 RUM.
So while I would agree with your comments that those to 30 cals are very good chamberings, for a factory option or for a custom rifle, in my opinion, they would be ranked well below the 300 RUM for all around performance and function.
MontanaRifleman
Well-Known Member
Of the 3 rifles, the Sendero is definitely the best LR platform. Of the 3 cartridges, I would pick the RUM for long range work for reasons already stated. Not the best brass available but you can work with it.
A few years back I bought a used Sendero with only a box of ammo through it. Got a good deal on it and it was a good shooter. That and anothe Sendero in 25-06 were my LR learning platforms for everything from reloading to shooting.
Once you shoot the barrel out, you have a good platform to build with. You can true and upgrade the 700 action or sell it for a custom. I would do the custom action route.
A few years back I bought a used Sendero with only a box of ammo through it. Got a good deal on it and it was a good shooter. That and anothe Sendero in 25-06 were my LR learning platforms for everything from reloading to shooting.
Once you shoot the barrel out, you have a good platform to build with. You can true and upgrade the 700 action or sell it for a custom. I would do the custom action route.
Trickymissfit
Well-Known Member
not a flame, as I really don't car that much.
Virtually all the big mags are overbore from the start. the Ultra mag and the 30-378 are borderline ridiculous. Lots of powder for maybe 170fps at best. The Op never said what kind of bullets he was thinking about using, and I just grabbed two manuals for a quick scan.
In the Hornaday manual using 190 grain bullets (I didn't have any load data on the Sierra 220 and 240 grain bullets to go by), I was kinda stunned at what I saw in there:
* .300 Rem short action ultra mag will do 2900 fps with 62 grains of 4350 in
a 24" barrel!!
* .308 Norma mag will do 3000fps using 73 grains of RL22 in a 24" barrel
* .300WSM will do 2900fps with 74 grains of Magpro and a 24" barrel
* .300 Win mag will do 2900fps using 68.6 grains of 4831 and a 25" barrel
* .300 WBY mag will do 3100 fps using 75.7 grains of 4831 in a 26" barrel
* .300 Ultra mag will do 3200 fps using 92.3 grains of H1000 and a 26" barrel
* 30/.378 will do 3200 using 114 grains of 8700 an a 28" barrel
now what we see here is that when the barrel lengths are somewhat close to being equal the only thing that's happening is making Hogdons and AA richer! Maybe if you had a 34" barrel you might pick up 250 to 300fps, but you'll also need a number one gun bearer to carry that thing! The .308 Norma mag just steps out and says "I can!" Of all these rounds it's common knowledge that the Norma mag thru the .300 WBY are by far the most accurate in very long distance shooting. The short action Remington looks to be a fairly good case design, and also very efficient. Same could be said of the .300WSM. The .300 WBY, .300 Ackley mag, or the Jarrett are the best in case design, but starting to show some serious overbore unless you move up to the 220 thru 250 grain bullets and a 28" barrel. All three are known to be very accurate in the right chambered barrel. Plus they have by far the best shoulder neck design (throw the WSM in that mix as well). The ultra mag beside burning a bunch more powder has the issue of the T.P. point out on the lip of the case. Meaning a short throat life. Still if your somebody like Dan Lilja (a fine gentleman I might add) this means little. For me it would.
The .300 Win mag would be the cheapest of the bunch to get into as cases are cheaper. Still you could make Norma cases out of Win mag brass! The Ackley and Jarrett can easily be formed from either necking up 7mm STW brass, or necking down 8mm mag brass. Easy enough to do. The .300 WBY brass is a go from the start. But once again I'd start with a .300WSM, or do a low free bore chamber in the WBY (all will have free bore in a factory barrel!)
What we see is very diminishing returns for as much as 33% more powder in the big cased mags.
gary
Deerhntr71,
You might want to refine your intentions, desires, and uses some more. Are you only interested in a factory round and a factory rifle? Are you going to reload your own ammo, and therefore, are wildcat cartridges an option? What's the maximum distance you hope to be able to shoot game, and what type/size of game? What weight bullets are you intending to shoot? Is there an upper weight limit on your rifle? How much to you shoot your rifles, and how concerned are you about barrel life? Are you happy to replace a barrel that's shot out after 900 rounds, or do you want 1500 rounds fired before your barrel needs replaced?
Some presume you're only interested in a factory rifle, which limits you to factory cartridges. Others are presuming all non-factory wildcat cartridges as possible options. Might better provide some additional details on your preferences to funnel the recommendations toward your primary interests.
If you're only interested in one of the three cartridges identified in your Thread title, reinforcing that will help focus the recommendations to solely those three cartridges.
You might want to refine your intentions, desires, and uses some more. Are you only interested in a factory round and a factory rifle? Are you going to reload your own ammo, and therefore, are wildcat cartridges an option? What's the maximum distance you hope to be able to shoot game, and what type/size of game? What weight bullets are you intending to shoot? Is there an upper weight limit on your rifle? How much to you shoot your rifles, and how concerned are you about barrel life? Are you happy to replace a barrel that's shot out after 900 rounds, or do you want 1500 rounds fired before your barrel needs replaced?
Some presume you're only interested in a factory rifle, which limits you to factory cartridges. Others are presuming all non-factory wildcat cartridges as possible options. Might better provide some additional details on your preferences to funnel the recommendations toward your primary interests.
If you're only interested in one of the three cartridges identified in your Thread title, reinforcing that will help focus the recommendations to solely those three cartridges.
MontanaRifleman
Well-Known Member
Gary,
You can't go by the manuals to know the true capabilities of a cartridge. I have loaded for the 300 WSM and the 300 RUM. The WSM (24 3/8ths barrel) could shoot a 180 gr bullet to 3000 fps with 67 gr of H4350. The RUM (26" barrel) could shoot the same bullet to 3400 fps with 98 gr of Retumbo.
Now, with RL17 I could boost the WSM velocity to 3200 fps bringing it much closer to the RUM.
With the development of RL33, the RUM will gain some efficiency. It should easily be able to push a 230 Hybrid to over 3100 fps. The 300 WM might be able to push a 215 gr bullet to 3000 fps in a 26" barrel with 75% of the powder. But the RUM is definitely going to reach farther and hit harder.
Yes, there is always going to be a loss of efficiency when stepping up in the same cal. The overall cost difference in shooting a 300 WM and a 300 RUM will be about $1.25 per shot vs $1.65 per shot including barrel cost.
If I was into the shooting game strictly for efficiency I would be shooting a 223 and 308 only. Ya gotta pay to play the game.
You can't go by the manuals to know the true capabilities of a cartridge. I have loaded for the 300 WSM and the 300 RUM. The WSM (24 3/8ths barrel) could shoot a 180 gr bullet to 3000 fps with 67 gr of H4350. The RUM (26" barrel) could shoot the same bullet to 3400 fps with 98 gr of Retumbo.
Now, with RL17 I could boost the WSM velocity to 3200 fps bringing it much closer to the RUM.
With the development of RL33, the RUM will gain some efficiency. It should easily be able to push a 230 Hybrid to over 3100 fps. The 300 WM might be able to push a 215 gr bullet to 3000 fps in a 26" barrel with 75% of the powder. But the RUM is definitely going to reach farther and hit harder.
Yes, there is always going to be a loss of efficiency when stepping up in the same cal. The overall cost difference in shooting a 300 WM and a 300 RUM will be about $1.25 per shot vs $1.65 per shot including barrel cost.
If I was into the shooting game strictly for efficiency I would be shooting a 223 and 308 only. Ya gotta pay to play the game.
