Which rifle is worth spending on

[86alaskan]

Have several tikka rifles, so that's the route I would prefer. They all wear limbsaver pads, it's usually the very first thing I do. I've also been running the Beast brake from muzzle brakes and more. If you're on a budget, and want the best brake for the money, look no further. They are very nicely priced and are as good or better than most brakes on the market. Have a smith chop the WSM to 22 in and install a 3 port beast, you'll be in business.

 

[edward hogan]

Here's The Deal...
Lots of ways to throw money at "improving" a rifle you already own. If this is just a whimsical "wouldn't this be a fun hobby" sort of investigation, AND if dropping $1500 you'll never get back isn't a concern; then, Go For It!

But, IF you're really bitten by the longrange accuracy Bug, then... Unless funds are No Concern... You want to evaluate ALL Your Options and Choose a rifle & cartridge platform that is an Immediate Solution...

I would also recommend evaluating other cartridges. While everyone "loves" the 6.5 Creedmoor, the .260rem offers a bit more oomph and allows use of any .308win derived brass. 6.5mm bullets are about the optimum for Ballistic Performance until you get to the heavies in .338cal. There's also much better barrel life.... This matters only if spending $600 for a custom barrel install every 1000rds isn't a concern. Also, the .260rem generates much less recoil. The 6.5wsm & saum are very highly touted by longrange magnum guys.

You study the loading data and then play with the ballistics software and questions get answered. The 7mm family offers "more" in terms of bullet selection, but 6.5 is about optimum for target work. 7mm-08 and the factory available 7mm wsm & saum are worth considering; but... The .280rem (especially when Ackley Improved) is about Optimum for ease of loading and performance. But.... if you want hot-rod velocities and 1mi capabilities, then 6.5/284 is the proven performer, or maybe you'll like the .284win for more bullet flexibility...

The hardware: your rifle is less critical than your ctg & loading abilities. The BEST Solution to learn longrange is choose a rifle made especially for longrange... Because doing so eliminates lost time and money. With a rifle that other shooters acclaim as a "turn-key package" you're set to focus on finding your load and learning to deal with wind.

The turn-key solution advice also applies to scopes and mounting systems; use what others have discovered "works" so your time is spent on improving bullet flight rather than hardware. One other thing about turn-key solutions, there's no waiting a year or more to start shooting. Gunsmith work is always a waiting proposition, many times well over a year; and it doesn't always go smoothly...

As to the Browning rifle being a bonafide platform for longrange... Get a Brownell's catalog and see what custom parts makers offer gear for the Browning, or Weatherby for that matter. While these rifles can shoot, they are seldom Chosen because they don't offer the basic design features that lend to accurizing.

The Sako TRG is a great value, (as is an Accuracy Intl rifle if $6k is no big deal.) The Sako is The World's Best value for an out of the box precision rifle. The heavy-barrel Tikkas and the FN-H Patrol and Police are the other "solutions". To make best use of your time and money, buy a proven solution. Then, don't skimp on loading gear and scope setup. With proven gear, you have isolated as many variables as possible and you're shooting right away and learning what works, rather than investigating all the variables that a hodge-podge of gear opens-up...

A sporter Tikka and a sporter Browning should bring enough funds to get you a proven solution; but choosing either to build on is opening yourself up for a money pit that will never return what funds you spent on your gear. A lot of guys in the precision game like Savage. They offer several turnkey solutions and good pricing. Never been interested in or owned a Savage.

Study the loading manual and do the ballistics investigation before you buy.

 

[therifleman556]

^^^Yikes. Easy to spend someone else's money I guess. Don't sell a rifle you genuinely like and know well. How many truly long range shots will the op be taking in which the difference between a WM and WSM will come into play? Seems like a "flip a coin" type of question personally.

 

[operator1]

Sell 'em both and find a used Sako TRG-42 in .300win mag.

The action is better than any "custom", great barrel, very fine stock system and many accessories. Already threaded for a brake, and might come with one.

The VERSATILE thing about the TRG rifles is THE ACTION... With spare bolt bodies, one rifle can take any standard .476 ctg, the .533 standard magnum, and the .588 super-mag ctgs. Easy to switchbarrel. Without a scope, probably about $2400 in good used condition.

Really need a brake for a WSM ctg? Using one to beat the recoil just blinds you to the fact that heavy loads will fire-bomb your throat. A stainless barrel erodes in crocodile type gaps compared to a CM barrel that erodes by cracking. Barrel life isn't that good if you're not watching the temps your charge generates.

Neither the Browning or Tikka T3 is comparable to a built longrange rifle. Trying to make it one will cost you well over a thousand bucks, likely more than $1500 and still haven't bought a scope...

The Tikka T3 Varmint and Tactical models are excellent values for their heavy barrels (Sako quality) and integral Picatinny rail (Tactical). The Tikka competition rifle w/laminated stock at about $1600 is another "built" option; if you can live with the laminated stock. It's kind of gawdy looking, but that's why we use Krylon paint.

Another Superb Option is the FN-H Police or Patrol rifle with chrome-lined match barrel. Some were made in .300wsm if you're committed to that chambering. Actually, though... Go .308win or .260rem and learn to compensate. A used FN-H (basically an accurized match quality Win 70 Classic) is really The Sleeper of precision rifles. Comes with a Near Mfg Picatinny rail, or it should... The Police model has McMillan stock choices, the Patrol you can restock with an H-S Precision for about $300, or you might like the Hogue with full alum bedding block. Buy one for around $800 and see how it shoots before you buy a new stock...

All the recommendations of buying used are made with the understanding that you will order a new custom barrel within weeks of getting your rifle. Shoot it till the barrel is shot out and then you'll KNOW your gun. I would study the hell out of the better Loading Manuals and get some ballistics software for comparisons. The Sierra book & software pkg is a good value.

The problem with those ideas is my wallet. It won't stretch that far. For what I use them for, hunting, I think the accuracy of both the x-bolt or the tikka will fil the bill very well. As for the I've been shooting the 300 wm caliber for 40 years and never had a problem until shoulder surgeries on both left and right and don't want to subject them to undue stress. Thank you for your ideas.

 

[Muddyboots]

Personally, I would go with the 300WSM and consider dropping down in bullet weight a bit. There are some really nice bullets in the 165 grain level that will still kill elk nicely out to reasonable yardages. I have an older friend in 70's that is slight build, recoil sensitive and we have developed a really nice load in his 300WSM with the Nosler 168 LRAB that is accurate and hits pretty good to moderate yardages. I plan on trying the new Sierra 165 gr Game Changer as well. Recoil can be reduced dramatically with lower bullet weights and still get good performance. If you did same with the X-Bolt, the recoil would be reduced even more with heavier weight of the rifle to start with. But the amount of powder burn will still contribute to recoil. My recommendation would be to try some lower bullet weights as part of the stepped approach to reduce recoil. The brake would be the last step in recoil reduction equation just based upon economics.

 

[Muddyboots]

BTW Operator1, I have been in a hard bolster sling for past 7 weeks for right shoulder. I hope to be in regular sling in 10 days. Started PT and that has been really fun. Basically complete overhaul of shoulder. Bone cyst detached the rotator, so it is now attached on either side of the cyst hole, bone spurs, bicep tendon repair. I hope to be able to shoot sometime starting in June with 300WSM and my Sendero 300WM. I may have to buy a lead sled for a while. I am so protective of the shoulder and the thought of my 300WM full boat load behind 200gr AB makes me wince just thinking about it.

 

[86alaskan]

Hope your shoulder heals well. I can vouch for the bullet weight drop advantage. I run a 10lb 300wm sako trg. My long range load is a 200gr eldx at about 3k. Not light recoil by anyone's standards. When I deer hunt, ranges rarely exceed 4 to 500yds. My drop dead point and shoot deer load is a 153gr hammer bullets sledgehammer. I shoot that bullet at almost 3400fps. Even with the high speed, the recoil is a good bit lighter than the 200gr. I attribute this directly to the lighter bullet. People kill elk with 140gr 6.5s. If you run a copper 150gr 300wsm with a brake, you'll he in business out to mid range.

 

[manitou]

I have two stock 26" barreled X-bolts that will shoot 1/2" groups regularly. I see no reason to spend more, especially since the X-bolts have a nice recoil pad and I like the stock design as-well-as the weight.

 

[edward hogan]

If you're shooting 1/2 groups routinely, and if these are 5 shot groups fired from an offhand position, supported by a sling, then You're Right! What more do you need? If you don't shoot offhand, unless you just dig burning powder from a bench, then it matters. Not many shooters can do 5rd into .5" from the bench and way fewer from offhand.

Always the question of "improving" the marginal sporting rifle comes up. Usually, throwing money at any sporter is a losing proposition. Might be "affordable" when you do it; but you wind up having lots of $$$ in a platform that has minimal interest to another shooter, so it's a giveaway in terms of what it brings if you have to sell it to upgrade.

Saw a FN-H SPR w/McMillan stock on GB for about $1000. In .308win it's a great choice, or rebarrel (eventually) to .260rem and a lighter profile. Match quality, chrome-lined barrel is gonna last 10-20k rounds. Shoot the 175 SMK or 180 Berger and don't sweat the 'lost' velocity. The velocity really don't matter. The Near Mfg base that comes with is The Best Going. Not terribly lightweight, but being built on the Win 70 SA action, can fit a Featherweight or standard barrel and then you're under 9lbs with the great stock. and essentially custom tactical action. Or you sell the McM stock, and the FN-H barrel and detach floorplate, and go Bell & Carlson, Williams, and Pac-Nor. There were complete FN-H actions available couple years back for under $500, but an SPR is a collectible and a built system rifle that sold new for over $2k. A used one is A Deal...

Just all how you look at it. Tikka Tactical in .260rem would do the job nicely, about $1000; or buy used... You buy used and the savings gets you a new custom barrel. You got $1200 in both your plainjane sporters now. Maybe you find a used Rem varmint in fluted stainless with H-S Precision stock for $700... Don't have to do anything to it; but you're stuck with a not so safe safety.... The Win 70 Classic Stainless guns are collectible, as are the Win Laredos. There out there.

The varmint and tactical Tikkas are Made To Perform, not so much the sporters. Look at a Brownells catalog and see what gear is made for what platform. Figure the cost to upgrade versus buy a built specially rifle. Lowest cost is to buy used and update the barrel eventually.