scope questions

Discussion in 'Long Range Scopes and Other Optics' started by milanuk, Sep 8, 2003.

  1. milanuk

    milanuk Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    806
    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2002
    Ok. This one has me fuming, but I'll try to calm down enough to type this out in a coherent manner...

    Let's say that you have a 6-24x scope, 1" main tube, about 40MOA total adjustment range for windage and elevation. Lets also assume that you have a variety of other scopes, such as a SS10x42, an old steel tube Weaver T-6 HBR, newer Weaver V-16, some Leupold Vari-X III LR/T scopes (6.5-20x and 8.5-25x).

    Suppose you mainly use scope bases of the Weaver/Picatinny style, and therefore any windage adjustment during initial scope mounting must come from the scope tube, rather than the base/rings.

    So if you were to put said 6-24x 1" scope on a gun (zeroing the turrets by counting clicks beforehand then slipping the scales so the turrets are set to zero), and peer thru the collimator, and see that the crosshairs are way off to one side (like off the grid scale and then some), and then attempt to adjust the scope back to center, and find that in doing so, you have used up all 20 or so MOA windage available on the scope, and you now are against the tube wall.

    Being somewhat perplexed at this, lets just say that you swapped the scope around to several other guns, most of which have a Weaver type mounting system, and see pretty much the same thing on all your guns. Then out of desperation you try using a Redfield type mount, the one w/ the front dovetail and a rear windage adjustable base, and find out that if you center the mechanism, then jack the rear ring over using the windage screws, you can at last at least 'use' the scope.

    Where would you conclude the problem lies, based on the above (other than the screw loose btwn the Peltors)? Would you surmise it was the scope, or that it was rather, entirely in the bases not being aligned to the bore? This is basically what the manufacturer's product rep told me over the phone, even after I made it very, very explicitly clear that I had swapped the scope, bases, and rings around on a variety of guns, using NF, GG&G, Leupold, and Badger Ord weaver/picatinny bases, both one piece rails and two piece bases, on a variety of guns, same as I had w/ every other scope mentioned above. Seems more than slightly odd that while I never had any problems w/ the above scopes/bases/rings on any of my guns, that I suddenly have a problem w/ my bases being about 20+ minutes out of whack w/ the bore.

    Am I missing something here? Is the product rep blowing smoke, or is this even feasible?

    Thanks,

    Monte
     
  2. Jeff In TX

    Jeff In TX Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    408
    Joined:
    Aug 10, 2003
    Monty,

    I went out of my mind trying to figure out what was going on with my scope, rings & mounts on one of my rifles. I was having a similar problem.

    For years, I've only used Badger Ordnance mounts and rings. The mounts are the Picatinny style. When I had that rifle rebuilt and rebarreled the smith said the new scope I purchased had no windage left and was off the collimator scale.

    He did some measuring and checking and found out the reciever screw mount holes weren’t tapped straight. My gun was a LH Rem. 700. By the time I got to his shop the next day, he had realigned and retapped the receiver with 8/40 screw threads. Everything then lined up perfectly.

    My smith said it happens quite a bit with Rem. 700 and Win. 70’s, but most people don’t check it with a collimator and just sight the rifle in the best they can.

    From that point on, I’ve always kept track of how much windage and elevation I have dialed in on the scope. This way I can always return the scope reticle back to dead center if I need to.

    Not sure if that helps, but it’s something to check into.

    Best of luck!
     

  3. milanuk

    milanuk Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    806
    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2002
    I had a Rem700VS in .223 that I had that kind of problem with. Found it the hard way when trying to mount a scope using weaver bases one time. Ever after that, I've kept a pretty close eye on such things on my guns.

    Just to make sure I wasn't doing anything grossly wrong, I took the latest acquisition, a Ruger M77VT in .22-250 in to the shop, and had *them* try and center the 6-24x scope on it, since they are a dealer for that particular brand. As I expected, when the crosshairs were centered on the collimator, the turret was just about 5 clicks from being completely out of windage. We discussed possibly shimming the scope mounts enough to offset this problem, but weren't sure if it'd do anything for the parallax problem (product rep has suggested on the phone earlier that the reason the parallax was b0rked was 'cuz the erector tube was jammed up against the side). Ended up deciding to put it in the box and send it back to the manufacturer, and wait for a replacement.

    Monte