New bullet with Smokeless

[Bullmark]

Hello all....so I'm really bored and looking to try something new with my Muzz. I have a few nice custom rigs in the safe and my smokeless is the one I shoot with the most confidence....but I shoot it less than any other. It's silly accurate and the current load is ballistically mind boggling....considering I grew up shooting an old Hawken .54.
To be thorough, it's a McWhorter built....Borden action, Brux barrel.@26" plus brake, McMillan stock, jewell trig. I was running a Swaro z6 but recently switched out to a Leica Magnus.
Current load is 74gr of H-4198 pushing a 325 gr Pittman at 2900fps.
I've never shot it at distances longer than 400yd, but it holds .5moa or less so far.
Why on earth would I want to change anything? I really don't.....but I would like to play around with a lighter bullet.
I don't shoot the rifle very often, b/c the recoil is stiff. I've let deer walk just so I wouldn't have to get pounded...lol
Seriously, I have a good supply of 4198 and quite a few different .45 bullets....so why not.
I have 2 questions: 1) would the muzz bullets that come with a sabot be suitable to shoot WITHOUT the sabot? My muzz is bullet to bore, so I have a die and have to size the Pittmans for my barrel. I realize I'd have to size any projectile but I didn't know if the saboted ones required the sabot to fly properly......
And 2) how would I determine the safe starting point for the load with a much lighter bullet?? I have a bunch of 250gr Hornady .45s, and have some that are lighter. I know it wouldn't take 74gr but would it be safe to shoot the lighter bullet with the same charge as I'm using with the current 325s??
Anyway, any advice or experience shared is greatly appreciated. My current load might make my shoulder sore but that's a lot better than losing the side of my face....
Thanks again.

 

[ENCORE]

ALL THE FOLLOWING LOAD INFORMATION IS FOR A .... CUSTOM BUILT RIFLE.... NOT FOR A PRODUCTION RIFLE.

1st........... I would HIGHLY recommend a quality muzzle brake, such as the LR Customs T-Rex. Outstanding brakes.
I run 88.25grs of IMR8208XBR and 88grs of Benchmark and never notice recoil and can shoot all day with 300gr XLD's. If I switch over and shoot BH209 at 110grs W, I can shoot all day, same, 300gr XLD's. The LR Customs brakes are really great brakes.

Yes you can shoot the 45cal bullets without the sabots, providing they are sized properly
Always start with lighter charges and work up looking for any pressure signs.

 

[Bullmark]

ALL THE FOLLOWING LOAD INFORMATION IS FOR A .... CUSTOM BUILT RIFLE.... NOT FOR A PRODUCTION RIFLE.

1st........... I would HIGHLY recommend a quality muzzle brake, such as the LR Customs T-Rex. Outstanding brakes.
I run 88.25grs of IMR8208XBR and 88grs of Benchmark and never notice recoil and can shoot all day with 300gr XLD's. If I switch over and shoot BH209 at 110grs W, I can shoot all day, same, 300gr XLD's. The LR Customs brakes are really great brakes.

Yes you can shoot the 45cal bullets without the sabots, providing they are sized properly
Always start with lighter charges and work up looking for any pressure signs.

Mine has a McWhorter brake....I can't speak to its effectiveness.....although I can't imagine it doesn't compare reasonably well. I've never removed it but I'm sure I could. This is the second smokeless I've owned from them...the first was 9-10 yrs ago and required a sabot. When they started making the bullet to bore I sold the first one and actually ended up with Allan's, McWhorter's owner, personal rifle....long story there, but he'd put 25-30 rounds through it, and I've put maybe 20.
Don't get wrong, the recoil is stiff, but I haven't shot anything larger than a .280ai for years.....as I've aged I've moved away from the big boomers.
So if I tried a 250gr bullet, where would u start with the same powder I'm shooting?
Would the same charge of 74gr be too much for the lighter bullet?? Or is the weight of the bullet irrelevant to pressure?
Thanks for reaching out. Maybe one day when I have some time I'll tell about when I bought 4 different Savage smokeless muzz's, and wasted an entire summer.
When I discovered a custom smokeless I thought I'd died and gone to heaven.
thanks again.

 

[ENCORE]

For my build, which is a Rock Creek Heavy Varmint barrel and Rem700 action, it may be much different for your rifle. So my data may or may not be safe in your rifle.

I do not have information for 250gr bullets, as I never shoot bullets that light from my custom. However for 275gr bullets using H4198, charges are from 68grs to 73grs MAXIMUM. I have H4198 but its all unopened. I prefer the other SML propellent I mentioned earlier. I prefer 300gr bullets.

 

[Bullmark]

thanks for jumping in. I really don't intend to switch bullets for hunting or long term. The Pittman 325gr flies great and packs a whollup......it's bang-flop city with the deer I've shot. I was more curious than anything, and wanted to get a little guidance before I tried something I might regret.
Those heavy bullets really perform well as the distance gets greater. High BC wind bucking missiles.

 

[ENCORE]

thanks for jumping in. I really don't intend to switch bullets for hunting or long term. The Pittman 325gr flies great and packs a whollup......it's bang-flop city with the deer I've shot. I was more curious than anything, and wanted to get a little guidance before I tried something I might regret.
Those heavy bullets really perform well as the distance gets greater. High BC wind bucking missiles.

Love the high BC bullets.

I have 300 Pittman bullets in 275 and 300grs but they are only .015" jackets. A friend made a trade with me which is how I obtained them. They're more for competition while using BH209, specifically at Friendship.
As far as I'm capable of shooting now, 600yds, the Arrowhead 300gr XLD bullets with a BC of .400 shoot lights out. These SML rifles will astonish others at the clubs range
Good luck working things up.

 

[1000yrd plate pounder]

Bullmark. I shoot 250 hornydaddy fxt bullets out of a smokeless using imr 4198 69-70 gr and shoving them 2800-2850 fps kinda more of a shotgun shove than a mule kicker also have a brake on it have a savage with a brux on it and a remage setup same way for the old girl to use . Both rifles are within a grain of each other for accuracy

 

[Bullmark]

Bullmark. I shoot 250 hornydaddy fxt bullets out of a smokeless using imr 4198 69-70 gr and shoving them 2800-2850 fps kinda more of a shotgun shove than a mule kicker also have a brake on it have a savage with a brux on it and a remage setup same way for the old girl to use . Both rifles are within a grain of each other for accuracy

Gotcha....maybe I'm just getting soft in my old age....I did just turn 50. Mine isn't all that bad....it's just a noticeable increase from my .280ai, which I shoot all the time and has a really soft kick....but it weighs a few oz more than my smokeless.
I may run a few 250s through and see how she likes it.

 

[1000yrd plate pounder]

Swage your bullets as normal with your pittman bullets i use a wool wad under the bullet tried to shoot them naked without wad and would only shoot about an inch and a half @100 used wool wad (smells like burnt hair) and shoots same load **** near into one ragged hole i dont think it has much recoil buuttt i also shoot lapua mags and a 375 cheytac for practice

 

[Chromeslayer]

Not sure what barrel contour you have but on a #17 brux with a 1.25 shank for 5in can shoot 78g of either H4198 or Imr4198 as a max charge with a 275g Pittman that should put ya close to 3000fps depending on barrel length

 

[Kmccord]

Have you contacted McWhorter to see what they recommend? That would be who I would contact to see what they have to say.

 

[Bullmark]

Have you contacted McWhorter to see what they recommend? That would be who I would contact to see what they have to say.

I agree....if and when I actually find the time to experiment w/ possibilities. As it is now, I am barely able to practice with the set ups that I know are good to go.
Every time I talk to Allan (at McWhorter) I seem to end up making another major purchase.....so I figured it would be less costly to ask the forum...lol. Plus it lets me see and hear what others are doing and might give me an idea. This forum is really impressive with the volume of knowledge and expertise present from a relatively small number of folks.

 

[Kmccord]

They make some very fine rifles, I enjoy there show they put on each week. I know it is useless to possibly build one, but states that only offer ML only, I wonder why no one has built one in traditional smokeless calibers? I would think it to be cool to make one in 7mm, 30cal, 6.5mm. I am no expert, maybe it is not possible, but if so, the high BC on those projectiles would be neat to see.

 

[Bullmark]

Believe it or not I was just thinking about contacting them and asking about a smokeless muzz smaller than a .45. I certainly don't want to be the one to fund the research and dev required to build and test the prototype. It would be a very cool rifle to have.