Kestrel 5700 for hunting.

[Canhunter35]

Well, I just went to JBM and calculated the difference at 1000 yards using a 300 Berger at 2830 - going from 2750 to 8750 results in 1.8 MOA less elevation. At 715, the difference is .8 MOA less.

If we keep elevation the same but go from 50 deg to 100 degrees, the figures are:
715: .3 MOA less
1000: .6 MOA less

My experience matches JBM - elevation is far more important than temperature. But the SIG 2400ABS and BR7 account for both, assuming you don't leave them out in the sun to overheat - I have seen that cause weird results at 1400 in AZ.

I assume you are using something with a lower BC than a 300 Berger; environmental changes change the BC, and the farther you are out on the BC curve, the less you are affected by changes in elevation and temp.

Type in -20degrees and plus 80degrees and u will see a bigger change. Like I said, you're not shooting in enough of a differential of temps

 

[Greyfox]

I have used a 5700 Elite with AB for PRC competition as well as for LRH, the latter Blue-toothed to my Terrapin X. Out to 1000 yards, ballistic outputs and results are comparable to those obtained from both my Sig 2400 and G7 ballistic RF's when programmed with the same inputs.

 

[LRNut]

Type in -20degrees and plus 80degrees and u will see a bigger change. Like I said, you're not shooting in enough of a differential of temps

I did; a 100 degree temp change does not have as much of an effect as a 6000 elevation foot change - to say nothing of a 10000 foot elevation change.

"Type in" hmmm....I am basing my conclusions on actual shooting as well. In the past year I have shot from -5 to 114 deg and from 2750 to 8750 feet in elevation. Just reporting what I have seen.

I have pretty much shot the planet, and never shot anything at -20 - but hey, I haven't shot a Polar bear - maybe you have. But I will admit 0 to 100 is certainly possible.

In the past two days I have shot at 715, 910 and 1054. Be back at it tomorrow. And the next day. And the next...

 

[Recon$$]

Not trying to jump into an argument, I have seen almost 1 mil changes at 1000 with a .308 in normal conditions at a range +- 30 degrees and weather conditions. For what's that's worth.

 

[Canhunter35]

I did; a 100 degree temp change does not have as much of an effect as a 6000 elevation foot change - to say nothing of a 10000 foot elevation change.

"Type in" hmmm....I am basing my conclusions on actual shooting as well. In the past year I have shot from -5 to 114 deg and from 2750 to 8750 feet in elevation. Just reporting what I have seen.

I have pretty much shot the planet, and never shot anything at -20 - but hey, I haven't shot a Polar bear - maybe you have. But I will admit 0 to 100 is certainly possible.

In the past two days I have shot at 715, 910 and 1054. Be back at it tomorrow. And the next day. And the next...

Yes, I've shot in as low as -30 hunting coyotes, if I didn't shoot in -20 I wouldn't shoot for most of the winter.
Not everyone lives in the mountains and sees huge elevation changes, which is why I initially stated, if ur hunting one elevation, a couple cards for different temps and you'll be good to go. U came and said nah, it doesn't change.
On my coyotes gun, average temps I hunt in top to bottom, grabbing my range cards not even the extreme cold(where u won't believe this but even Extreme line of powders will lose velocity) but on avg temps, at 700 yards there a 3/4 moa difference. At 1k it's 2 moa. I actually want to hit my targets, so i account for all the variables, and I'm not always killing steel so the first shot counts.

to the op, sorry for the weirdest argument I've had in awhile. If you don't have many elevation changes, temp is easy to account for u prolly don't need a kestrel, but if you climbing hills while hunting and the temp changes throughout the day, I've seen quite swing in bullet drops. Then you will know with a kestrel, u should be on while u puzzle the wind out

 

[Greyfox]

In my early days of LR hunting, using cartridges with a G7 BC of .3 and MV of 3000FPS I used a simple correction off of my baseline of 4500Ft(altitude) and temperature of 45F. Over a range of 500-1000 yards 1-2 clicks (.25MOA per 1500ft change in altitude, and the same or a bit less per 20 degree change in temperature. This approach was generally sufficient for hitting the vitals of deer sized game at distances from 600 to 1000 yards…given a bit of practice/experience. The more exacting measurements of today's Ballistic calculators surely enable the capability to extend the range, and/or hit smaller targets.

 

[LRNut]

I did; a 100 degree temp change does not have as much of an effect as a 6000 elevation foot change - to say nothing of a 10000 foot elevation change.

"Type in" hmmm....I am basing my conclusions on actual shooting as well. In the past year I have shot from -5 to 114 deg and from 2750 to 8750 feet in elevation. Just reporting what I have seen.

I have pretty much shot the planet, and never shot anything at -20 - but hey, I haven't shot a Polar bear - maybe you have. But I will admit 0 to 100 is certainly possible.

In my early days of LR hunting, using cartridges with a G7 BC of .3 and MV of 3000FPS I used a simple correction off of my baseline of 4500Ft(altitude) and temperature of 45F. Over a range of 500-1000 yards 1-2 clicks (.25MOA per 1500ft change in altitude, and the same or a bit less per 20 degree change in temperature. This approach was generally sufficient for hitting the vitals of deer sized game at distances from 600 to 1000 yards…given a bit of practice/experience. The more exacting measurements of today's Ballistic calculators surely enable the capability to extend the range, and/or hit smaller targets.

Yes, I've shot in as low as -30 hunting coyotes, if I didn't shoot in -20 I wouldn't shoot for most of the winter.
Not everyone lives in the mountains and sees huge elevation changes, which is why I initially stated, if ur hunting one elevation, a couple cards for different temps and you'll be good to go. U came and said nah, it doesn't change.
On my coyotes gun, average temps I hunt in top to bottom, grabbing my range cards not even the extreme cold(where u won't believe this but even Extreme line of powders will lose velocity) but on avg temps, at 700 yards there a 3/4 moa difference. At 1k it's 2 moa. I actually want to hit my targets, so i account for all the variables, and I'm not always killing steel so the first shot counts.

to the op, sorry for the weirdest argument I've had in awhile. If you don't have many elevation changes, temp is easy to account for u prolly don't need a kestrel, but if you climbing hills while hunting and the temp changes throughout the day, I've seen quite swing in bullet drops. Then you will know with a kestrel, u should be on while u puzzle the wind out

I used to live in northern MN and shot quite often at -30 (not long, as my trigger finger would freeze pretty quickly). I noticed my .220 Swift shooting 55 gr bullets would drop substantially more at 700 yards compared to a 7RM shooting higher BC bullets. That was my first lesson in dealing with temperature changes: shoot as high a BC as you can. I rebarreled my Swift so it would shoot 80-90 gr bullets and the difference dropped dramatically.

I thought some more about this topic this morning. If you shoot year round, the impacts of temperature are not very dramatic, simply because one summer or winter day is very likely similar to the others. More importantly, you can moderate temperature impacts fairly easily by establishing your zero in the middle of your temperature range. In the -20 to 80 spread you point out, 30 degrees means you would see a maximum temp change of 50 deg. On the other hand, it is difficult to establish a zero at 4000 feet if you live in Florida.

 

[dfanonymous]

Funny thing about the kestrel and all this BC talk…CDMs are more accurate than BCs. And the kestrel AB gives you that option.

 

[LRNut]

Funny thing about the kestrel and all this BC talk…CDMs are more accurate than BCs. And the kestrel AB gives you that option.

SIG 2400ABS can use custom drag models as well, but so far G7 BCs have worked well for me out to 1400 yards.

The Kestrel started life as an anemometer and over time has become a ballistic solution provider. I can't believe many shooters use the anemometer if they can read mirage - they use if for the AB software. Nowadays, laser rangefinders have the same AB software the Kestrel has had for a while. Personally, I would rather have my RF provide the solution.

 

[dfanonymous]

SIG 2400ABS can use custom drag models as well, but so far G7 BCs have worked well for me out to 1400 yards.

The Kestrel started life as an anemometer and over time has become a ballistic solution provider. I can't believe many shooters use the anemometer if they can read mirage - they use if for the AB software. Nowadays, laser rangefinders have the same AB software the Kestrel has had for a while. Personally, I would rather have my RF provide the solution.

Like I said, it gives you that option. To be clear, I never said it was exclusive. You can get CDMs on the AB app too. That said, lol these anemometers are not exclusive to wind reading either. It's be easier way of consolidating dope. Especially for those that have a ton of rifles and shoot across the country.

Mirage is not a great indicator of wind speed but more so than wind direction. You can estimate wind speed into a range if you have mirage AND your good...but you still won't get it to the mph you need, and I doubt you're looking up at your max ord where your bullet is touching a different wind gradient. Hard to be precise with cold bore accuracy if mirage is the only thing being considered.

 

[Canhunter35]

Like I said, it gives you that option. To be clear, I never said it was exclusive. You can get CDMs on the AB app too. That said, lol these anemometers are not exclusive to wind reading either. It's be easier way of consolidating dope. Especially for those that have a ton of rifles and shoot across the country.

Mirage is not a great indicator of wind speed but more so than wind direction. You can estimate wind speed into a range if you have mirage AND your good...but you still won't get it to the mph you need, and I doubt you're looking up at your max ord where your bullet is touching a different wind gradient. Hard to be precise with cold bore accuracy if mirage is the only thing being considered.

I haven't done enough extreme range but at 45moa of elevation I add half again wind value to compensate for winds at the apogee of the shot and over 60moa of elevation I double my wind call. But that's pretty crude calculating lol

 

[dfanonymous]

I haven't done enough extreme range but at 45moa of elevation I add half again wind value to compensate for winds at the apogee of the shot and over 60moa of elevation I double my wind call. But that's pretty crude calculating lol

At least you get the point. For us who understand the nuances of precision wind call, can agree is would need its own thread to unbox fully.

 

[Canhunter35]

At least you get the point. For us who understand the nuances of precision wind call, can agree is would need its own thread to unbox fully.

It should be the biggest thread on the forum, lol, but wind discussion is vast, hard to articulate and the more you learn you realize the less you know

 

[LRNut]

Like I said, it gives you that option. To be clear, I never said it was exclusive. You can get CDMs on the AB app too. That said, lol these anemometers are not exclusive to wind reading either. It's be easier way of consolidating dope. Especially for those that have a ton of rifles and shoot across the country.

Mirage is not a great indicator of wind speed but more so than wind direction. You can estimate wind speed into a range if you have mirage AND your good...but you still won't get it to the mph you need, and I doubt you're looking up at your max ord where your bullet is touching a different wind gradient. Hard to be precise with cold bore accuracy if mirage is the only thing being considered.

I think mirage is the best indication of wind speed and direction - ridiculously better than holding up an anemometer. I use my spotting scope but when I am ready to shoot I use my side parallax to focus near, mid, and far to see the mirage. If it is drifting slightly, wind is 2-4 depending on the angle. Less than 30 but not flat, 4-6. Flat but wavy, 6-8. Fast and flat, 8-10. Fast, flat, and hard to see, 10-12. Washes out - at least 12 mph.

I keep a log of every shot I take at long range. I put them into three buckets: calm to mild wind, mid range wind, and wind where mirage washes out. I am extremely confident on the first two buckets out to 1000 (haven't missed more than 5" from center lately); I have not shot 1200 or farther since April. Bucket three is fun to shoot, but it is pretty much a guess - I have a shock corded wind flag I plant in front of me and tend to rely on that more than anything if the mirage washes out. Faster and more accurate IMO than holding up an anemometer but crude to say the least.