HELP WITH SATERLEE VELOCITY TEST

[25WSM]

I may have left this part out but when I picked the node for this combo I was looking at the impact points of the bullets compared to each other. If you look at that node and superpose the dots the group is not bad. So by adding in a little ocw knowledge I picked that node. I agree that the seating depth test showed a ton of change. Looks very sensitive to seating changes. And it very well could be attributed to neck tension or primer choice. Some bullets are very tolerant to seating changes and some are very picky. If this combo does shoot great it will be a chase the lands load to keep it in tune. Not a big deal on a hunting rifle. Not great for a compatition rifle.
Shep

 

[asd9055]

I may have left this part out but when I picked the node for this combo I was looking at the impact points of the bullets compared to each other. If you look at that node and superpose the dots the group is not bad. So by adding in a little ocw knowledge I picked that node. I agree that the seating depth test showed a ton of change. Looks very sensitive to seating changes. And it very well could be attributed to neck tension or primer choice. Some bullets are very tolerant to seating changes and some are very picky. If this combo does shoot great it will be a chase the lands load to keep it in tune. Not a big deal on a hunting rifle. Not great for a compatition rifle.
Shep

Shep,

Thanks for the explanation. I don't know how much the magneto affects the POI.

 

[25WSM]

It does effect the impact point but since you had it on for all the shots it should be consistent. I used tuners on my compatition rifles and it's amazing how little you need to move them to see a change in group size.
I'm not a fan of the mag speed but it will get you the numbers you need. I use a 35p and can look at my speeds and target together for info on my load. Really helpful when doing long range ladders.
Shep

 

[MTbackwoods]

Just shot this. I did 2 round groups and fired 1 of each charge weight over my magneto. I see good groups and the velocity flat spot in the same place. Call me crazy. Speeds are;
66- 2879
66.5-2896
67-2928
67.5-2955
68-2978
68.5-2986
69-3000
From 68-69 gr my groups were .4, .59, and .48 respectively. This was shot with a brand new, untested scope and it was not tracking well. However, the data shows a relation between velocity nodes and accuracy. At least for me with my rifle

 

[asd9055]

It does effect the impact point but since you had it on for all the shots it should be consistent. I used tuners on my compatition rifles and it's amazing how little you need to move them to see a change in group size.
I'm not a fan of the mag speed but it will get you the numbers you need. I use a 35p and can look at my speeds and target together for info on my load. Really helpful when doing long range ladders.
Shep

Its interesting to hear more and more people using tuners. I am an early user of the BOSS system, though most people hate it. Tuners work!

 

[asd9055]

Its interesting to hear more and more people using tuners. I am an early user of the BOSS system, though most people hate it. Tuners work!

What distance? I would probably have at least a 10 shot increment string. If I had to make a decision with what you have right now, I would probably pick 68.5 as center load 3 each 68.3, 68.5 and 68.7 and try again. But thats me, a student. I want to hear the more experienced ones.

 

[Beluebow]

Just shot this. I did 2 round groups and fired 1 of each charge weight over my magneto. I see good groups and the velocity flat spot in the same place. Call me crazy. Speeds are;
66- 2879
66.5-2896
67-2928
67.5-2955
68-2978
68.5-2986
69-3000
From 68-69 gr my groups were .4, .59, and .48 respectively. This was shot with a brand new, untested scope and it was not tracking well. However, the data shows a relation between velocity nodes and accuracy. At least for me with my rifle

Couple questions....How far was this test shot at? And what are you calling a velocity flat spot?......68.5-69?

 

[Beluebow]

Its interesting to hear more and more people using tuners. I am an early user of the BOSS system, though most people hate it. Tuners work!

I've used tuner for about 7 years with my competition rifles......also like you, I have a load development regime that seems to work well for me....But I'm always interested trying to learn something new or possibly even better.

 

[NW Hunter]

You are almost there

Yep!

 

[MTbackwoods]

Couple questions....How far was this test shot at? And what are you calling a velocity flat spot?......68.5-69?

100 yards. From 68-68.5 is only an 8 FPS increase. Then 68.5-69 is only 14. So from 68-69 shows a bit of a flat spot. I will load in .2 gr increments around the middle and see what it does. It's the same method I've used on other loads that came together quite well

 

[NW Hunter]

I may have left this part out but when I picked the node for this combo I was looking at the impact points of the bullets compared to each other. If you look at that node and superpose the dots the group is not bad. So by adding in a little ocw knowledge I picked that node. I agree that the seating depth test showed a ton of change. Looks very sensitive to seating changes. And it very well could be attributed to neck tension or primer choice. Some bullets are very tolerant to seating changes and some are very picky. If this combo does shoot great it will be a chase the lands load to keep it in tune. Not a big deal on a hunting rifle. Not great for a compatition rifle.
Shep

I agree Shep.
I may test at .019 and .015 off, but the hunting season is getting close.
I may just load it and use it for my back up rifle.

 

[Bob Wright]

With Labradar and doing a ladder with a common POA at 300 yards, it's easy to see and correlate velocity to vertical dispersion and find the flats.
It's my version of a Satterlee test.
It takes me 10 shots to find the various nodes and pressure signs in step 1. Then, I go for the various .2 gr groups of 3 rounds either for seating or looking at where in that node does it have repeatability.
Hammer bullets aren't very sensitive to seating depth in my last test.
I also found in one test that neck tension signs (erratic pressure/velocities) was actually a donut forming and getting worse with each test.
So, I always record speed and a ladder, or fine tuning together. Magnetospeed in my opinion throws in a variable.
It's just my way of doing a modified test version of just looking for speed flats in Saterlees test.
I ended up after donut nightmares, at +/- 2 fps with the last shot of 5 dropping 8 fps. Marking that brass would have been a great idea but I failed to do so.

 

[asd9055]

With Labradar and doing a ladder with a common POA at 300 yards, it's easy to see and correlate velocity to vertical dispersion and find the flats.
It's my version of a Satterlee test.
It takes me 10 shots to find the various nodes and pressure signs in step 1. Then, I go for the various .2 gr groups of 3 rounds either for seating or looking at where in that node does it have repeatability.
Hammer bullets aren't very sensitive to seating depth in my last test.
I also found in one test that neck tension signs (erratic pressure/velocities) was actually a donut forming and getting worse with each test.
So, I always record speed and a ladder, or fine tuning together. Magnetospeed in my opinion throws in a variable.
It's just my way of doing a modified test version of just looking for speed flats in Saterlees test.
I ended up after donut nightmares, at +/- 2 fps with the last shot of 5 dropping 8 fps. Marking that brass would have been a great idea but I failed to do so.

Personally I like this variation of ladder the best (It has both Satterllee and Audette elements as I understand them)

 

[NW Hunter]

Amazing the 25 off you started with shot in the 3s with the load I recommended. That was easy. But I always do the powder charge changes first. Once I pick the one I'm going to use I load up 3 of it plus 3 on each side of it by 2 tenths. Then the one that shoots best is the one I do the seating depth test with. I'm sure it will work either way. But it seems that the 25 off is a good spot. Once you try the powder charges do a velocity test on the final load and I bet your sd and es are very good.
Shep

Sounds like a good plan Shep.
I'll give it a whirl.