First or second focal plane?

[dfanonymous]

I think the question has been answered. If you don't need the reticle and subtension values to remain the same through out different magnifications then SFP will work just fine. If you still use or run a mil reticle for range verification...the whole T(inches)x27.78/mils or T(yards/meters)x1000/mils then you'll have more accuracy in that with a ffp. Since most of you don't need to be worried about being shot by some ******* wearing nightvision, I'm sure it's unnecessary to mill when you can just use a laser rangefinders. There can be a accuracy run off with a ffp depending on how you zero, as the reticle gets larger and takes up more of a target space. I've aways zerod at max mag and naturally I only use enough mag to see the target itself. That's to avoid mirrage, trace the shot, finer reticle, less overcorrection in natural tremble etc. but when milling a target I crank that reticle up.

 

[lancetkenyon]

Again....as a FFP reticle "grows" with magnification, it still covers NO MORE of the target at 25x than it does at 5x. The target grows with the reticle.
And HOW MUCH the reticle covers is dependent on the reticle itself. The SKMR has a .036 MIL center dot, or about .1" @ 100 yards. Or 1" @ 1000 yards. Not too many SFP reticles that cover less than that. Several other FFP scopes have a .05 MIL dot or line thickness.

A SFP reticle actually covers more of the target @ 5x than it does at 25x at any distance.

 

[FIGJAM]

FFP scopes suck for hunting. Tried it, hated it, went back to SFP...talked myself into trying it again, hated it. If you are using your reticle as a rangefinder to determine distance, I get their usefulness...but seriously, who does that anymore? I use a laser rangefinder and dial with a SFP scope.

On low power it is sooo hard to see the crosshairs with a dark background or low light. Plus, those christmas tree reticles are way too busy for a hunting scope imo...

I can see in some of these PRS type timed competitions shooting at different ranges where a FFP is the way to go, but outside of that I just don't get it.

 

[lancetkenyon]

FFP scopes rock for hunting. Love them. Will never go back to SFP.

SFP scopes suck for hunting. Who want a duplex? Or a reticle that the subtensions are only accurate at one magnification? Or have to figure out exactly where half magnification is and double values?

Not every FFP scope has a "Christmas Tree" reticle. SKMR, H2CMR, EBR-1A, SCA, MSR, etc.

Are they for everyone? No. For hunting under 300 yards, I would suggest a SFP scope. And something like a 1-8, 2-10, 3-9.

 

[xsn10s]

Here's my thoughts for a 300-500 yard scope. Most hunting rifles will have a 200 yard zero so what around 9 inch drop at 300 yards depending on the cartridge/ load. After that you'd either dial in the dope, use a ranging reticle, or Kentucky windage. My rifle has around those range limitations and has a 2.5-8X VariXIII with premier Reticle Mildots SFP on it. 30-06 Model 70 pushfeed FWT so it's your basic hunting rifle, nothing special. I hit steel out to from 300 to 800 yards. I've never shot at big game over 125 yards but I've also hit small water bottles at 450 yards, I'd shoot varmints with it if the ricochets weren't so bad.

 

[dfanonymous]

FFP scopes suck for hunting. Tried it, hated it, went back to SFP...talked myself into trying it again, hated it. If you are using your reticle as a rangefinder to determine distance, I get their usefulness...but seriously, who does that anymore? I use a laser rangefinder and dial with a SFP scope.

On low power it is sooo hard to see the crosshairs with a dark background or low light. Plus, those christmas tree reticles are way too busy for a hunting scope imo...

I can see in some of these PRS type timed competitions shooting at different ranges where a FFP is the way to go, but outside of that I just don't get it.

There's just a few reasons to use the reticle these days. Confirmation of distance if you think the rangefinder is erroneous, if for whatever reason a laser will give away your position to an enemy at night for those that that applies to, and lastly if your batteries or unit dies and it's a last resort. Then the old dope book comes out with the page of "common target measurements" for reference.

Most of which don't apply to competition or even hunting really. If my batteries die hunting, I'll kick myself for not checking my gear prior by walking five miles back to the truck and head to the general store for batteries and grab a Mountain Dew while I'm at it. I'm not going to mil out a 4 inch mule deer ear or assume the deer is a 38 inches tall average or whatever it is.

 

[Rich Coyle]

I was thinking of a scope for shooting 300-500 yds. I've only got scopes with reticles in the second focal plane. What would be the advantage of the first focal plane?

None.

 

[gusd]

Question for those of whom use FFP for hunting? You say you use the reticle for finding distance correct? How do you determine the size of said animal,target,rock,trees.whatever you are using for finding that range with the reticle?
Say you are using the animal itself how do you know the exact dimensions?
For example deer in the same age group come in different sizes. Big head small ears, big ears small head, long body, short body,deep thick chest, short narrow chest you know things like that. Those things easily vary from an inch to six eight inches.
I am assuming you need exact measurements for and exact range calculation?

 

[lancetkenyon]

Never use my reticle in my FFP scopes for range estimation. Just for wind holds. And occasionally for elevation hdover if there is not enough time for dialing. No "Kentucky windage" here. I use my subtensions.

Seriously, for 300 yards, just about any scope will do. FFP, SFP, MOA, MIL, 1-8, 3-24, straight 4x, etc. Heck, even open sights would be probay be fine if you know how to use them.

 

[xsn10s]

Heck, even open sights would be probay be fine if you know how to use them.

Yup I've hit steel gongs out to 650 yards with my FAL and open sights. As far as range estimation it really depends on how far and how critical the shot is when it comes to knowing the dimensions of the object you're using to range. In any case what works best is up to personal preferences. Many hunters are going back to SFP. But really it's all up to the shooter's preference and task.

 

[lancetkenyon]

I guess here is one of the big reasons why I really like FFP for my hunting scopes. I shoot about 3000+ rounds a year period from 500 to 1700+. Out of those 3000+ rounds a year, maybe 40 or 50 are at game. Hunt with what you practice with.

 

[Rich Coyle]

Again....as a FFP reticle "grows" with magnification, it still covers NO MORE of the target at 25x than it does at 5x. The target grows with the reticle.
And HOW MUCH the reticle covers is dependent on the reticle itself. The SKMR has a .036 MIL center dot, or about .1" @ 100 yards. Or 1" @ 1000 yards. Not too many SFP reticles that cover less than that. Several other FFP scopes have a .05 MIL dot or line thickness.

A SFP reticle actually covers more of the target @ 5x than it does at 25x at any distance.

When you can't see the reticle on low power and you turn up your scope the reticle DOES cover more of the target.

 

[Lasiter]

Question for those of whom use FFP for hunting? You say you use the reticle for finding distance correct? How do you determine the size of said animal,target,rock,trees.whatever you are using for finding that range with the reticle?
Say you are using the animal itself how do you know the exact dimensions?
For example deer in the same age group come in different sizes. Big head small ears, big ears small head, long body, short body,deep thick chest, short narrow chest you know things like that. Those things easily vary from an inch to six eight inches.
I am assuming you need exact measurements for and exact range calculation?

You look for a known size object, like a fence post you have measured in the past. Failing that, you quietly approach the deer with a tape measure, then run back to your shooting position before he moves.

 

[gusd]

So when you use your sub tensions for adjustments are you spotting your shot and adjusting from there?
If I understand correctly any scope with a christmas tree style reticle would work as long as you don't adjust the magnification of the scope correct?
Or are you figuring what the value of the sub tension is? If I understand this correctly [said target is 875 yards so an each MOA hash on your reticle is valued at 8 3/4" ]
So at 875 if you wanted to hit 20" in any one direction you would have to hold 2.25MOA?
I can understand this working great in a target shooting situation when you know your target for example is 24" wide, but don't see a great advantage in a hunting situation.Because I am not great at knowing what 12" 14" 16" 18" is at 874 yards.
I am a huge believer in."Hunt with what you practice with."
I know either style works great if you practice either way.