338cal 225 Cutting Edge .64bc

[Long Time Long Ranger]

I have tested this bullet for a year now in several 338 caliber rifles on the range and in the field and watched it take game from 400-1130 yards also in several different rifles by several different shooters. I have seen it shoot clear through two 6x6 elk at over 700 and 900 yards and another bull at 1130 yards dropping them flat. Also I have shot 1000 yard groups with it from the 4" range to the 8" range which in some cases were the best 1000 yard groups fired in that rifle. I put a three shot group through the chest of an elk cutout at 1500 yards shooting 3510 fps muzzle velocity out of a 338-378 WBY. I feel like I have enough data on this bullet now to make a determination on it. Basically this bullet is one wicked SOB. And I rarely give a bullet that high a rating. Following are some of the things I learned about it.

I am always looking for products that will give me a ballistic advantage when hunting at the ranges I typically encounter game and that suits the rifles I hunt with. My rifles are lightweight hunting rifles that were built to be the best I can get for hunting animals to a half mile and a little beyond. The heaviest rifle I hunt with is a 338-378 Weatherby that weighs 10.75 pounds scoped out. They are light so I can move fast through the mountains without tiring covering far more ground glassing than the average hunter. The light rifles limit me for extreme range shooting however are the best for my type of hunting. Several will hold there own with most at extreme ranges busting rocks but that is not what they were designed for. The 225 grain D62 Cutting Edge bullet gives me a step advantage ballistically at the ranges my rifles were designed to shoot.

Accuracy is as good or better with this bullet than with any bullet I have shot in any of the test rifles.

Average velocity gain with best accuracy loads in all the test rifles over the 300 grain bullets was 460-580 fps. This gives this bullet at .64 bc a ballistic advantage over the 300 grain bullets out to well over where 99.99% of all game is taken and beyond where most hunters should be shooting at game.
These are velocities for top accuracy in the test rifles for 300 grain bullets and the 225 CE.

28" barrel 338-378 wby 300 grain bullet 3060 fps, 225 CE 3510 fps
26" 338 Lapua 300 grain 2780 fps, 225CE 3360 fps
28" 338-300 RUM 2812 fps- 3375 fps
26" 338 RUM 2750 fps-3330 fps
24" 338 SIN no data on 300 grain-225 CE 3120 fps.

By running these results on a ballistics computer the advantage is clear with this 225 grain bullet to 1000+ yards. That is why I have converted my 338 rifles to this bullet with the exception of the 338-378 which has been converted now from the 225 CE to shooting the 260 grain Cutting Edge .76 bc at over 3300 fps. Comparing it with the 300 grain bullets at 3060 fps the advantage again is obvious.

I think everyone understands that I do not recieve any financial support for endorsements from Cutting Edge or any other manufacturer for any product. All my tests are completely independent and I prefer to keep it that way so everyone understands I am not influenced in any way posting my results.

As throughout the last several years with top products being introduced by different companies the best change but for right now this is the best I have found if a guy is like me wanting that extra edge when hunting to up the odds when that trophy of a lifetime appears.

With my hunting style to give me the best odds when I encounter game I want the flattest trajectory and least windage effects I can achieve for quick shots to 600 or so yards on animals that are there now but may not be in a few seconds. I want the ability to fold down my bipod and hammer that animal quickly without turning clicks. For long range shots where I have time to set up I still want the flattest trajectory and least wind effects so I am in the kill zone for the maximum yardage possible as the bullet drops through it at long range. This is an aspect many do not realize but a combination of velocity and bc like this bullet can keep you in the kill zone 20+% longer making range estimation, group sizes, environmental conditions, etc less a factor and giving you a better opportunity to engage that target.

I will finish this in stages as i have work to do.

One of the key benefits of the 225 grain bullet in light 338 rifles is the recoil is very light allowing for more accurate shooting and seeing the hits on game through the scope. I really got tired of getting the snot knocked out of me with the 300 grainers in a light rifle.

 

[SHRTSHTR]

Here are a couple pictures that "Dan" from Cutting Edge sent me. I have not been able to test past 1k yet as work has been hectic the last few months.

I hear from a lot of folks that these bullets do not shoot very well for them and they are not a real good hunting bullet. Still sitting on the fence with these bullets until I can shoot at distance. It does not really matter what I hear these bullets do....It matters what I see them do.

 

[Scot E]

LTLR,

I can sure relate to your concept of shooting lighter weight bullets out to the distances you discuss. You are correct, too many guys get caught up in the high BC, high bullet weight talk and miss the point that there may be better options at the shorter distances that 95-99% of animals are shot at (1/2 mile or less).

As much as I wish it weren't the case I shoot lighter bullets better. I think much of this is due to the fact that like you I like carry weight LR rigs so the lower recoil associated with lighter bullets make for a more forgiving platform. Some of it may also be that I don't like a lot of recoil. It doesn't bother me per se but I don't enjoy it as much to be sure and my guess would be that any mental recognition of that concept is going to require much more mental focus to overcome form inconsistencies.

I have been following your many CE threads religiously and you have some great ones going right now, from the EOL reviews to the CE results.

From this LR guy, thanks for being willing to share your knowledge and expertise with the rest of us. It takes a lot of extra time for you to get everything written up and on this site but it is much appreciated! I personally don't know very many guys that shoot as much as you do and are as capable as you are to get repeatable results that are worthy of mentioning here are semi-scientific. Your info saves many of us a lot of time, money and research!

One question, I know you mentioned you haven't recovered a CE bullet but can you tell from the tissue damage how the bullet is performing? How much expansion? Does it shed its pedals creating multiple wound paths?

Thanks,

Scot E.

 

[Long Time Long Ranger]

Thanks Scot, I appreciate that very much. It takes an enormous amount of time loading, shooting, gathering data and then putting that data together on here. I couldn't possibly do it without owning a lot of good shooting rifles and being retired. I am a retired rocket Scientist so I am accustomed to minimal tolerances and exacting scientific repeatable results. Also pushing the limits like working the Star Wars program from it's infancy through all the test missiles to actually deploying a viable ICBM interceptor. I have fun with this now as a stress relief. I know it is difficult for some on here to see a guy that tests so much stuff with actual success with some of it. But I played sports in high school and college with and against guys who went on to become NBA and NFL stars. Their level of talent and being able to accomplish things was so far beyond the average college or high school player it is staggering and just seemed to come natural to them. That got a lot of jealousy from some guys trying to beat them and couldn't. Shooting has been a hobby I have worked on for over 50 years and early on as a five year old kid with a BB gun and later with a 22 rimfire I was making shots that was amazing for anyone. I just continue taking it to new levels and refining my skills. I don't claim to be a pro under any circumstances because I have never shot competition with rifles. I am just an average guy who always had a knack for getting a rifle to shoot well and put an aweful lot of effort into it.

Appreciation from guys like you help keep me going to test another.

The exit wounds from the 225 CE have all looked like the Barnes exit wounds to me. Larger than caliber exits with no jagged exits or smaller exit holes that would show the bullet came apart however the larger than caliber showing that it did expand. I am a scientist though with one of my degrees in applied mathematics and can say the sampling data is just to small for a scientific determination with only between 15-20 kills by me and my friends. I am shooting them soon through lined up water jugs to try and recover one and will post how that goes on this thread probably.

I just got to put this little story in here about shooting the 22 rimfire in high school. I did well for a little while betting a dollar a shot at shooting blackbirds out of the sky in flight with my 22. Then the word got around not to bet. But I got a little cash to buy some bullets and fishing tackle with it.

Also Scot, some are calling all the 225 grain CE bullets the same which they are not. I have only shot the D62 MAX-AGG. It is the one with the highest BC and is so long it requires single shooting unless you have a aftermarket long magazine and seat them deep. Many order the other 225's because of this. I have not tried those and can not comment on them. Which ones do you have?

 

[Scot E]

Thanks Scot, I appreciate that very much. It takes an enormous amount of time loading, shooting, gathering data and then putting that data together on here. I couldn't possibly do it without owning a lot of good shooting rifles and being retired. I am a retired rocket Scientist so I am accustomed to minimal tolerances and exacting scientific repeatable results. Also pushing the limits like working the Star Wars program from it's infancy through all the test missiles to actually deploying a viable ICBM interceptor. I have fun with this now as a stress relief. I know it is difficult for some on here to see a guy that tests so much stuff with actual success with some of it. But I played sports in high school and college with and against guys who went on to become NBA and NFL stars. Their level of talent and being able to accomplish things was so far beyond the average college or high school player it is staggering and just seemed to come natural to them. That got a lot of jealousy from some guys trying to beat them and couldn't. Shooting has been a hobby I have worked on for over 50 years and early on as a five year old kid with a BB gun and later with a 22 rimfire I was making shots that was amazing for anyone. I just continue taking it to new levels and refining my skills. I don't claim to be a pro under any circumstances because I have never shot competition with rifles. I am just an average guy who always had a knack for getting a rifle to shoot well and put an aweful lot of effort into it.

Appreciation from guys like you help keep me going to test another.

The exit wounds from the 225 CE have all looked like the Barnes exit wounds to me. Larger than caliber exits with no jagged exits or smaller exit holes that would show the bullet came apart however the larger than caliber showing that it did expand. I am a scientist though with one of my degrees in applied mathematics and can say the sampling data is just to small for a scientific determination with only between 15-20 kills by me and my friends. I am shooting them soon through lined up water jugs to try and recover one and will post how that goes on this thread probably.

I just got to put this little story in here about shooting the 22 rimfire in high school. I did well for a little while betting a dollar a shot at shooting blackbirds out of the sky in flight with my 22. Then the word got around not to bet. But I got a little cash to buy some bullets and fishing tackle with it.

Also Scot, some are calling all the 225 grain CE bullets the same which they are not. I have only shot the D62 MAX-AGG. It is the one with the highest BC and is so long it requires single shooting unless you have a aftermarket long magazine and seat them deep. Many order the other 225's because of this. I have not tried those and can not comment on them. Which ones do you have?

One of the reasons I have been following your threads on the CE bullets is because I am trying to decide if I want to give these guys a try. I shoot what I consider inexpensive but very good performing bullets like the A-max and STS. so for me to go this route I wanted to hear some feedback first. So I haven't bought any yet. I typically like a bullet that sheds some weight and wreaks havoc on the internals as multiple pieces rip the vitals to shreds. Moving to more of a premium bullet design will be a change for me as I really like the more frangible bullets for LR duty out to 6-800 yards. But the consistency, accuracy and their apparent lack of seating depth sensitivity has me wanting to give these CE bullets a try. I was hoping to hear that the petals from the bullets expanded violently or even tore off creating additional wound channels similar to what is described on their site. I will be interested to see what your expansion tests show.

Thanks for the info.

Scot E.

 

[Long Time Long Ranger]

Scot, I just have no idea what they do since I haven't recovered one. I know the chest cavity is a mess after being hit by one. I know it leaves a good hole on the backside of whatever it hits. The petals may all tear off or stay on there I just don't know until I recover one. Hopefully when I shoot some through the water jugs it will shed some light on this. The petals could be shed when it leaves that exit hole or they may still be on. Just can't tell. Basically to me looks like something hit with a Barnes tsx if you ever saw that.

I shoot both the Amax and SST depending on which rifle I am using. I shoot about everything out there in one rifle or another. We were unpacking boxes into my new loading room and we found enough stuff to load 15-20 thousand rounds in there. Look for a big sale in the want adds for bullets, etc. later this summer. That is after I sold a couple thousand bullets three or so months ago on here.

 

[Dr. Vette]

The exit wounds from the 225 CE have all looked like the Barnes exit wounds to me. Larger than caliber exits with no jagged exits or smaller exit holes that would show the bullet came apart however the larger than caliber showing that it did expand. I am a scientist though with one of my degrees in applied mathematics and can say the sampling data is just to small for a scientific determination with only between 15-20 kills by me and my friends. I am shooting them soon through lined up water jugs to try and recover one and will post how that goes on this thread probably.

LTLR,

Ever think about using these instead of water jugs?

Ballistic Technology - Bullet Performance and Research

 

[motoxno53]

What twists are your barrels? Are you using a 1-10 or are you using the recommend 1-9.5 or faster twist?

 

[Long Time Long Ranger]

All barrels I have shot them in were 1-10. I have shot some very good groups with 1-10 barrels.