250 Scenar or 300 SMK for 338 Lapua?

Discussion in 'Rifles, Bullets, Barrels & Ballistics' started by Guest, Jun 14, 2003.

  1. Guest

    Guest Guest

    For Elk and Moose inside 500 yards....


    Opionions wanted as to which is better?

    Also, how do scenars perform on game compared to SMK's.

    Thanks!
     
  2. Brent

    Brent Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    2,537
    Joined:
    Jun 12, 2001
    Hi John, where ya been?

    I haven't used the Scenar but will be trying it too over the next winter in the 338 LI.

    Good luck. [​IMG]
     

  3. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Howdy John...Inside 500 yards I would absolutely go with the Scenars and integrate with the reticle.
     
  4. Brent

    Brent Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    2,537
    Joined:
    Jun 12, 2001
    What cartridge John?

    I've killed several Moose with 250 X bullets but nothing like a match bullet, or up real close with the 338wm. Most shots were 350-450 yards with MV on the real high side.

    If I was worried Grizz might be around the corner, shoulder shot may be an only option, or something that the 300grs extra weight would be a blessing to have, I'd use it without a doubt. Integrating the 250gr with the R2 would be the best choice for faster no hastle shots and 600 yards and under would be a breeze to reasonably integrate and memmorize.

    My 178gr load in the 300 Ultra at 3230 fps when zeroed at 600 yards is also zeroed at 100 and only 4" high at each 200, 300, 400 and 500 yards. Plenty good enough for Moose there! [​IMG] After 600, the integration don't work at all, and needs more speed and higher BC to integrate.
     
  5. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Thanks, Brent and S1.
    Just to cloudy up the mix again....

    What about 225 Accubonds in side of 500? Exbal shows that load intergrating best with the NP-R2 reticle.

    Also Brent, since you have shot them - How do you think they will do on game?

    Thanks A lot guys!!!!
     
  6. Brent

    Brent Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    2,537
    Joined:
    Jun 12, 2001
    John,

    For closer LR shots like that on Moose, Bear or whatever large like that, the 225 AB would be the way to go I'd think, good placement or bad.

    Considering the 225gr AB would be going quite a bit faster than the 300gr SMK and weighs substantially less, those would be good ones to test and compare at various ranges in water, then in sand/clay. The 300gr may penitrate farther at LR and it's reduced terminal velocity could even out the two in alot of ways. Wish I had some Moose shoulders to shoot through for this test!
     
  7. David P. Herne

    David P. Herne Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    95
    Joined:
    May 4, 2001
    John,
    I find this a compelling question, especially since I've only seen what happens when the subject Lapua projectile strikes a game animal, but heard volumes about what happens in the same instance with the subject Sierra projectile. Of course, you're initial velocity with the former will be (safely) as much as 200 fps greater than with the latter when fired from a .338 Lapua rig - assuming the barrel is 28" long. Consequently, you will require less adjustment of your settings during those crucial moments. The thing is, Lapua bullets appear to be really soft. The copper and lead of which they are constructed is like clay compared to that of other exceptional match projectiles. I suppose that's why they disintegrate shortly after splashing into mammalian tissue masses. You should have seen the wound I saw this bullet make in an Aoudad - initial velocity was 3050 fps and the animal was lasered at 350 yards. I'm relieved to be able to say I wasn't the one who took the animal even though it was my rifle that was used to do the killing. The tissue destruction was great enough that the shoulder mount ended up looking like s*@#!

    Regards,
    Dave
     
  8. Perkules

    Perkules Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    179
    Joined:
    Dec 11, 2002
    Well... I´m back.

    I never got those MK:s after all and the season is here and today was the moment of truth: that orphan calf was needed to be taken. I had been tracking him for 48 hours to see where he is going... I live where I hunt. Open fields this time, I decided to go with the factory Scenar with my Sako TRG-S 338 Lapua Mag. Just because I knew I can hit exactly where I intend with it up to 500 yds. Also because they are the only rounds I have for the rifle. [​IMG]

    I knew the distance would be 200 to 400 yds so 45-70.. nope... 30-06 nope (been there)... 338 Lapua yes. About 280 to 300 yds, 250 Scenar, a basic sideways lung shot and nobody can tell it was not a "premium" hunting bullet. It didn´t explode but expanded, the wound was very controlled and the exit wound is about the size of an egg. So much blood in the moose when we opened him, no wonder the kill was fast and final.

    The moose went 30 yds,fell down and died without a need for a finishing shot. We have four other moose hanging in our cottage right now and they were taken with 308:s at 30 to 100 yds... this one was the absolutely fastest and cleanest kill and nobody could guess which one was taken with a "target bullet". It destroyed the lungs,came out from the opposite shoulder and I can´t wait to see what happened in there but it looks very clean.

    I know this may sound a little irresponsible but the calf was orphaned by an accident and had to be taken so I volunteered for the dirty job and did some real life bullet testing as well. [​IMG]

    For this distance,Scenar more than passed the test. Note: The big bones were hit at exit.
     
  9. Dave King

    Dave King Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    2,362
    Joined:
    May 3, 2001
    Petander

    Good to hear from you again and thanks for the Scenar info... I have a box of them waiting to be tested (still have a bunch of 300 SMK's to use too).

    What's up with your 300 SMK's... shipping problem? I'll send you a box if you need, I know it's too late for this hunt but you'll perhaps be able to get something done later.
     
  10. Perkules

    Perkules Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    179
    Joined:
    Dec 11, 2002
    Hi Dave,

    Well,the SMK:s... a friend got banned from a forum where I´ve been a regular for quite a while. So bunch of us built a new forum, basically to help him out.I´m still in the staff in the other forum where he basically made himself banned. He is a nice geezer but obviously needs to see a doc. I´m not a doc, I´m a gunnut hunter and simply couldn´t help him anymore,neither stand the destructive behaviour.

    The new forum turned out to be just another "revenge plattform" for him, bashing people , flames, something I never thought would happen. But it did happen -again- and I simply quit and he still has those Matchkings. I did lots of graphic stuff, studied EZboard controls inside out and just got tired of that... Net for me is guns,hunting and fun. Always sad to lose a friendship but I had to ban him. As an admin you know what I mean.

    Back to the business:

    The Scenar shoulder exit was very good,I am still surprised. It sure would work on deer too... must see when I have the time for that. On the contrary to some reports I find Scenar not soft at all,rather the opposite. The impact velocity was 2600 fps or so,the bullet worked very good. And it´s a pleasure to shoot as well -even these factory rounds are okay for these distances. Maybe I´m just lucky?

    We cleaned the critters today. Some mince/freeze/can work to do now. [​IMG]

    The steaks must hang for a little longer though. I like them ripe.

    In case you wanna get rid of some Matchkings feel free to mail me. [​IMG] I appreciate your offer.
     
  11. Troy

    Troy Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    173
    Joined:
    Jun 23, 2001
    I have found the Lapua Scenars to be some, if not, the most durable match bullets. I use these bullets for metallic silhouette for this very reason. Silhouette shooters in the States did extensive testing with 6.5 mm match bullets and found the Lapua Scenars, Cauteruccio's, and Sierra Matchings to be among the most durable.
     
  12. Dave King

    Dave King Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    2,362
    Joined:
    May 3, 2001
    Petander

    Thanks for the info... too bad about some folks personalities.

    I sent out a box of those .338 300 Matchkings today...you should get them in a week or so I'm told. Be careful...don't put your eye out [​IMG].
     
  13. Perkules

    Perkules Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    179
    Joined:
    Dec 11, 2002
    Hehehhh... thanks A LOT,Dave! [​IMG]

    Busy hunting this weekend,just got home.Still raining a lot,it was good though.

    Also another week coming for "Solo Sniping", the moose played tricks on us today,got two yesterday though. And the deer possibility is always there so it looks like a good week to me. [​IMG]

    Let´s see: Three Scenar rounds left means three deer / moose. [​IMG]

    EDIT: I always have our Shepherd ready for possible tracking in the dark, also the places to hunt are well organized,we always know if there are other hunters or anybody else around. So it´s not really "Solo", I will call people before I go and after a kill. So will everyone else in case they go during the week,most don´t go though.

    [ 10-12-2003: Message edited by: Petander ]
     
  14. Nighthawk

    Nighthawk Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    429
    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2002
    I'm very glad I found this topic. I have some 250 grain .338 rounds for my new .338 Lapua. (no kidding) I just waiting for the barrel. Thanks for the info guys.