25-06 case head seperation?

Discussion in 'Reloading' started by 243yote, Feb 18, 2010.

  1. 243yote

    243yote Well-Known Member

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    I have an H&R Ultra hunter and have reloaded brass and full length resized about 5-6 times and then this happened.Next reload on my 25-06 , starting at min recommeneded start load with new powder and working up to max load. I did not get to recommeneded max load and this happened. Crack appeared on the 1st rnd but I did not noticed until one case extracted and then came apart after hitting the ground. Noticed after about 4 rnds the cases had a crack around the case head. The 5th had almost completely cracked but extracted from chamber. The 6th rnd completely seperated and case got stuck. Did a terrible job of removing case ? Over worked brass? Left a couple of scratches from removing brass,would that scew up the chamber demensions? Have not shot the rifle since then. Just wondering because reloading manual says to full length size cases everytime for break open actions or cases will not extract and that is true. Tried that on my .223 H&R and cases do not extract if not full length resized. Safe to shoot gun or get new barrel for gun?Any insight woulld be helpful? :rolleyes:
     
  2. Winchester 69

    Winchester 69 Well-Known Member

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    Does partial full-length resizing have any relevance for you? When the chamber is long, the die, if set to minimum dimensions, will cause case stretch with each firing. The case will stretch and grow thin at the base. Then it will separate. The case should should be sized no longer than is necessary for the reloaded case to fit the rifle's chamber. Redding's Competition Shellholder Set makes proper compensation simple.
     

  3. Kiwi Nate

    Kiwi Nate Well-Known Member

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    Plus 1.

    Start over with the die a little way off the shellholder and size a case. Check the case fit in your rifle. If it is too tight, turn the die down a quarter of a turn and try for fit agin. Repeat until the brass fits your chamber- without being oversized. case head seperation is a common problem when cases are oversized and work hardened.
     
  4. Gene

    Gene Well-Known Member

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    If you are F/L sizing every reload, your brass is probably work hardened after 5-6 loads. Buy some new brass and start over. Follow the die manufacturer's instructions for full length sizing.
     
  5. Moman

    Moman Well-Known Member

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    Yote, here is the tool that I use for this. I measure and record case length at the datum prior to and after fire forming, recording results. It will give you an idea of the size of your chamber. I set my dies to partial size the shoulders about .001. If you use this tool, deprime first in a seperate operation, measure, then bump shoulder .001-.002.

    Another suggestion, use a sharp pointed tool (sometimes even a paper clip will work) to feel the inside of your case in this area. You can usually feel this seperation start to form on the inside first.



    Hornady Lock-N-Load Headspace Gage 5 Bushing Set with Comparator - MidwayUSA
     
  6. royinidaho

    royinidaho Writers Guild

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    Used to have the same problem.

    I simply use the FL size die to size the neck 1 caliber on an '06 family of cases.

    With reasonable pressures I haven't had to do what Moman does, though he gives good advice. If my other rifles weren't wildcats I'd be using it on them.lightbulb
     
  7. 243yote

    243yote Well-Known Member

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    Well thanks for all the input .
     
  8. lever-hed

    lever-hed Well-Known Member

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    Assuming your not exceeding manual guidelines, my first reaction is youre oversizing the brass each time, this will undoubtedly shorten case life, more then normal. FL sizing each time I will say that your case life wont be too good. (typically minimally sizing cases to fit your rifle’s chamber is what most do for bolt actions, for accuracy and case life).. If you have no choice but to FL size, make sure you know your max headspace dimension fo ryour rifle, so that you can minimize how much your sizing cases – another way that comes to mind is to get a body die, and a separate neck die, it may be easier to manipulate the case sizing with that setup. (bump shoulder no more then 2 thou.)
    Next thing, if youre oversizing (during FL szg), chances are good you have too much headspace,.. this can and will contribute to case head separation.
    Also, I would dbl check your break open action for any possible loosening, this may be a factor.
    Next thing, if your seating bullets too far to the lands, this will cause pressure spikes, hence busted cases. If you know your rifle’s chamber dimensions (and case dims before and after firings), this would go a long way in understanding what the problem is.
    Next, if you scratched your chamber, maybe a problem, may not be.. if it is a good gouge it could be a problem for your brass, otherwise it maybe possible to sand it out .
    What loads are you using? Are you trimming cases every 2/3 reloads? When you say 5th, 6th rounds cracked, etc. , are you talking about “5th reload” or just 5th round fired that day?
     
  9. elkaholic

    elkaholic Well-Known Member

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    I agree with not sizing any more than you have to for all the reasons mentioned. I started loading a 25 with a lee loader back in the early 70's and NEVER separated a case because it only neck sized. As long as I used my own brass, I could load countless times as long as I trimmed occasionally. Not suggesting you go to a Lee loader:D just don't overwork your cases. You'll probably have better accuracy as well.....Rich
     
  10. Fitch

    Fitch Well-Known Member

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    +1 on the tool.

    I use an RCBS universal deprime die to get the primers out.

    I've found this tool to be excellent for detecting thinning just above the base:

    MidwayUSA - Advanced Search

    Setup just like it is in the picture it works really well to detect case thinning above the base. When I see it on the gage, I can see it looking in the case with a borescope.

    Fitch
     
  11. 243yote

    243yote Well-Known Member

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    Well i have LEE reloading dies and press. If i do not full length resize my cases everytime the cases would get stuck. I noticed this when i only neck sized for my H&R in .223. So i did not bother just neck sizing for my 25-06. I did noticed that when i did full length resized my cases for the 25-06 that the dies only sized to where the cases split. After the the stuck case i did gouge the chamber a bit and when i fired the next time i did noticed the brass conformed to the gouges in the chamber. I bought a nrck sier for the 25-06 but hav e not used it for that reason. So could i only neck size and bump shoulders back enough to prevent stucks cases?
     
  12. 243yote

    243yote Well-Known Member

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    Well after everyone's input i compared once fired brass to the reloaded brass . Same brand brass(remington) from the same gun.The once fired brass was even all the way around looking down the inside of the brass.The stuff i reloaded was bulged uneven looking down inside brass? The cases that did crack also the same,uneven bulge. Also i compared side by side the once fired with the reloaded stuff and the shoulders were the same length. I turned them side by side and noticed the reloaded brass actually was leaning away from the once fired brass. Wow! Also used a paperclip bent to feel the inside of cases. Looked at chamber of the rifle and noticed a low spot in the chamber itself. The repair sanding i did after i removed the stuck was not enough to make a low spot in the chamber. Repaired slight gouges from removing stuck case.How do i know? The sanding marks are above the low spot in the chamber! Also looking down the chamber i noticed brass marks in the chamber were uneven from what i could see. As far as reloading i followed the recommened instructions that came with my LEE reloader for setting up the die for use. Also looked at brass again and noticed bulge just below where the case heads cracked after the first firing. Compared to the new factory loaded ammo.Could the chamber have been cut using a crooked tooling? The rifle in question is a H&R ultra Hunter. :rolleyes:
     
  13. 243yote

    243yote Well-Known Member

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    With what i just found out i will go to the source (rifle chamber) next time if this happens before i start blaming reloading equipment. I will be calling H&R tomorrow and find out if they will help me with this problem. So something new learned and hope this helps out someone else with the same problem. So before spending money on a gunsmith to look at your rifle take it take some time to check it yourself first. Remember we are all human and we do make mistakes. Without humans, machines would not know what to do!gun)
     
  14. Fitch

    Fitch Well-Known Member

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    Interesting. Please post what H&R says after they inspect the chamber.

    Thanks
    Fitch