30-338
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In the immortal words of Emily Lutella..." Never Mind!" I guess I was just thinking Leica and not paying sufficient attention...More and better rangefinders I am in favor of! Thanks for the correction 30-338
2009 SHOT Show report Part 1
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In the immortal words of Emily Lutella..." Never Mind!" I guess I was just thinking Leica and not paying sufficient attention...More and better rangefinders I am in favor of! Thanks for the correction 30-338
ScottBerish
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I hate to say this, but it appeared to me the Bushy was better indoors compared to the Lupy Mark 4, for a street price less than half the Lupy!
The Vortex Tac scope promises to be a market class leader, can't wait to check out either optic!
30-338
Well-Known Member
Ditto....exciting news. 30-338
I looked through the Sightron SIII 6-24X and the Vortex Viper 6-24X scopes at Shot Show, because of the reports I've read about the quality of these scopes at purchase costs much less than the other mainline premium scopes. Also, the warranty on both of these brands of scopes is about as good as it gets.
Of these two scopes, the glass in the Sightron SIII made it the obvious standout to my eyes within the confines of the building. I was way impressed. The mildot crosshair offering in both of these scopes is a wire crosshair rather than etched. I like a crosshair with more than 5 mils of hash marks beneath the intersection of the cross hairs, and both of these scopes are currently only available with the standard military mildot crosshair - meaning 5 mils in all directions from the intersection of the crosshairs.
But I was so impressed with the quality of the glass in the Sightron SIII that I may have to pick one up in their current Mildot reticle.
Scott's info on the Vortex tactical becoming available later this year has also gotten my attention... I'm tempted to wait to see the quality/cost of these new Vortex scopes versus the Sightron SIII before purchasing.
Of these two scopes, the glass in the Sightron SIII made it the obvious standout to my eyes within the confines of the building. I was way impressed. The mildot crosshair offering in both of these scopes is a wire crosshair rather than etched. I like a crosshair with more than 5 mils of hash marks beneath the intersection of the cross hairs, and both of these scopes are currently only available with the standard military mildot crosshair - meaning 5 mils in all directions from the intersection of the crosshairs.
But I was so impressed with the quality of the glass in the Sightron SIII that I may have to pick one up in their current Mildot reticle.
Scott's info on the Vortex tactical becoming available later this year has also gotten my attention... I'm tempted to wait to see the quality/cost of these new Vortex scopes versus the Sightron SIII before purchasing.
I also looked through the new Zeiss laser rangefinder. The glass looked good, but not better than the Swaro LRF to my eyes. From information I've read, the Swaro has a narrower laser beam than the new Zeiss model and because of this, I don't believe the Zeiss will outrange the Swaro. The Zeiss is advertised as a 1300 yd LRF. The Swaro a 1500 yd LRF. The ultimate answer on ranging capability will only become available when enough LRH's purchase and compare the Zeiss to the Swaro in actual field use. I currently own the Swaro rangefinder, and it's the King of the Hill from my perspective - unless and until a majority consensus has the new Zeiss outranging the Swaro. The difference in cost between the two isn't all that much. If glass quality and ranging distance is of ultimate importance to you, you'll simply have to wait for sufficient user feedback before trying to save $100-$150 by going with the Zeiss over the Swaro.
ScottBerish
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Phorwath,
I agree the optics on the Victory aren't any better than the Swaro, but i still liked the Zeiss better. Based on beam divergence specs, the Swaro should range further. Fi nally, there are Swaro LRFs for $750-$800??? Do tell.
Scott
Scott,
You'd be the expert on the purchase prices for sure. I purchased my Swaro about 2 years ago. It was a demo model with full warranty. If I recall correctly, I paid about $779 - a little less than the full retail prices. After having owned and used the Leica 1200 Scan, then comparing it against the Bushnell 1500 Arc in field use, I wasn't satisfied with failures to range 700-900 yds under some field conditions (like when a Dall Ram was moving away from me). So by the time I finally purchased the Swaro, I didn't care if I paid $100 or even $300 more for the assurance that I could range out to 1300-1500 yards under almost any condition. For those content with lesser ranging ability, the cost savings may be worth it.
I want my LRF to range further than I ever plan to shoot. I also use it to determine whether further forward shooting positions will get me within shooting range, so that I can evaluate stalking options. The Zeiss may prove to be a winner, but for many die-hard LRHs, that will only happen after the unanimous feedback is that it will range on par with the Swaro for a substantial cost savings. My $.02
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ScottBerish
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10-4. Let the field data come rolling in! I just thought the Swaro were $900+, but i haven't shopped for one in awhile.
I read on here somewhere that you could have custom reticles installed in the Sightrons. It was around $130. I am also evaluating an SIII. I originally wanted a nightforce, but the SIII keep getting compared to the NF favorably. I don't want to give away the extra loot if I don't need to.
Here's what ILya, from The Optics Talk Forums had to say about Sightron products in his 2009 Shot Show review.
Sightron:
Sightron does not have too much stuff that is new for the show, but they told me a couple of new things they are working on. I was asked to not disclose it yet, but it sounds interesting (and is right up my alley). There are a few new scope configurations and a few new binoculars. Still, Sightron has a pretty complete line-up and if you have not seen them yet, I highly recommend you check out Sightron's S2 Big Sky and S3 scopes. Of the currently in production stuff, I think these Sightrons are ultimately the best Japanese scopes in terms of optics. Keep your eyes out for upcoming models. They sound like they can cause quite a stir in their respective markets.
The binoculars that attracted my attention are the redesigned SIII binoculars that now have ED glass in them. They looked good optically and had the now-popular split bridge design.
Here's a link to his full report. I found it interesting and informative - just as I found Scott Berish's review.
The Optics Talk Forums - SHOT Show 2009 impressions - Page 1
I just purchased a Sightron SIII 6-24X50 Mil-Dot based on what I saw at Shot Show and what I've read about them. Better glass than Nightforce. This will start a firefight for certain!!
I didn't know Sightron's could be had with custom reticles? Unless they provide an etched lens reticle, I don't think we'll have the option of obtaining anything like IOR MP-8 or NF NP-R1 or NP-R2.
Sightron:
Sightron does not have too much stuff that is new for the show, but they told me a couple of new things they are working on. I was asked to not disclose it yet, but it sounds interesting (and is right up my alley). There are a few new scope configurations and a few new binoculars. Still, Sightron has a pretty complete line-up and if you have not seen them yet, I highly recommend you check out Sightron's S2 Big Sky and S3 scopes. Of the currently in production stuff, I think these Sightrons are ultimately the best Japanese scopes in terms of optics. Keep your eyes out for upcoming models. They sound like they can cause quite a stir in their respective markets.
The binoculars that attracted my attention are the redesigned SIII binoculars that now have ED glass in them. They looked good optically and had the now-popular split bridge design.
Here's a link to his full report. I found it interesting and informative - just as I found Scott Berish's review.
The Optics Talk Forums - SHOT Show 2009 impressions - Page 1
I just purchased a Sightron SIII 6-24X50 Mil-Dot based on what I saw at Shot Show and what I've read about them. Better glass than Nightforce. This will start a firefight for certain!!
I didn't know Sightron's could be had with custom reticles? Unless they provide an etched lens reticle, I don't think we'll have the option of obtaining anything like IOR MP-8 or NF NP-R1 or NP-R2.
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SouthTXBowhunter
Well-Known Member
What about the Mark 4 line? They fit in that price range if you shop hard for them. I was going to go with them till I decided to spend the extra few hundred for a Nightforce.
I emailed Sightron CS to find out for certain:
Hello,
I have read on a couple web sites that custom reticules can be installed in Sightron scopes without voiding the warranty. Can you give me contact information and some info on what types of changes or replacements are available?
Thanks,
John
John:
Please contact Bill Ackerman at Optical Services Inc 575-589-3833. He actually makes our benchrest dot reticle. Please contact Bill for reticle variations and cost.
Please contact Bill Ackerman at Optical Services Inc 575-589-3833. He actually makes our benchrest dot reticle. Please contact Bill for reticle variations and cost.
Thank you,
Eden
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Re LRFs:
Beam divergence isn't everything. Form factor and glass play a part as well as price. I ended up getting a Swaro rangefinder (and have loved it) a few months ago. However, I was able to get it new for $839 and now I see it listed for $999! No way would I have paid that premium over the next likely choice at the time - the Leica CRF 1200. One thing I really do like about the Swaro LRF is the larger objective. I have been out glassing/ranging deer around here at twilight and have determined that these will work fine to replace binos. A couple weeks ago, I also got to look through some Swaro 10x42 binos and, to my eyes, the SLC glass in the monocular LRF was just as good. Have to say though that those are one fine pair of binos - zero eyestrain, etc. I just wonder what is up with the Swaro LRF pricing. I imagine Zeiss and Leica will put some pressure on that.
Beam divergence isn't everything. Form factor and glass play a part as well as price. I ended up getting a Swaro rangefinder (and have loved it) a few months ago. However, I was able to get it new for $839 and now I see it listed for $999! No way would I have paid that premium over the next likely choice at the time - the Leica CRF 1200. One thing I really do like about the Swaro LRF is the larger objective. I have been out glassing/ranging deer around here at twilight and have determined that these will work fine to replace binos. A couple weeks ago, I also got to look through some Swaro 10x42 binos and, to my eyes, the SLC glass in the monocular LRF was just as good. Have to say though that those are one fine pair of binos - zero eyestrain, etc. I just wonder what is up with the Swaro LRF pricing. I imagine Zeiss and Leica will put some pressure on that.
Roger that on the Swaro LRF glass. When I feel the need to travel/hunt lightweight, I will often hunt and glass spring bears in the mountains with only the Swaro LRF. The glass is just as good as their SLC binoculars IMO. And I do own a pair of Swaro SLC binos, as well as their 8x20 pocket sized binoculars. So I have some basis to make this comparison.
Didn't know the price had jumped to $1000 for the Swaro LRF, but the Leica 1200 simply didn't cut it for me. It's pretty frustrating when the game is walking away from you at a distance of 700 yds and you can't get a range with your LRF. I was able to range out to as far as 1150 yds with my Leica (occasionally), but I also experienced mountainside hunting where ranging out to 700 yds was hit or miss. And that was the last time I used the Leica.
