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Rifles, Reloading, Optics, Equipment
Reloading
Norma 217
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<blockquote data-quote="paul105" data-source="post: 960079" data-attributes="member: 80598"><p>Just wanted to update this post. It shows how different guns are. Norma ballistics tech, Quickload, and actual shooting experience. Here is a chronology of events:</p><p> </p><p> I contacted Norma on several occasions – this is the result. </p><p> </p><p> Update and Recap on .30-378 Weatherby Magnum</p><p> </p><p> Weatherby specs list freebore is .361" for the .30-378 Wtby Mag. Best I can tell freebore on the rifle I have is at least .361 and maybe a bit more.</p><p> </p><p> Rifle is clean.</p><p> </p><p> Fired cases allow bullet to slide in and out freely (necks not too thick).</p><p> </p><p> Barrel Length: 26"</p><p> Action: Dakota 97</p><p> </p><p> Loaded with Norma 217 (Lot Number 0603 135067)</p><p> 1x factory fired Weatherby cases</p><p> Federal 215 magnum primers</p><p> 168gr Barnes Tipped TSX</p><p> Seated at 3.645" OAL</p><p> </p><p> Chronograh set 20' (about 6 meters) from muzzle.</p><p> </p><p> Per Norma's instructions, I started with one round at 113.5gr as listed in manual for 165gr oryx – sticky bolt uplift (for about the width of the extractor cut), extractor cut mark on case head, extraction normal and velocity didn't register on chronograph. Temp – 65-70 Deg F</p><p> </p><p> After email from Norma (saying drop charge no more than 3 grains) I tried 111.5gr – velocity average 3,609 fps at 70 Deg F. Bolt lift not completely normal with resistance on initial uplift and some resistance midway thru bolt uplift (each case was a bit different) – extractor cut marks on several case heads, and extraction was normal.</p><p> </p><p> Dropped charge to 110.5gr – velocity 3,567 fps. Bolt lift and case head marks less noticeable than 111.5gr but still evident to some degree. Temp 65 Deg F</p><p> </p><p> Dropped charge to 109.5gr – velocity 3,520 fps. Bolt lift normal, case head normal. Temp 60 Deg F.</p><p> </p><p> It looks like I should stop at 109.5gr – does this sound reasonable and 3,520 fps.</p><p> </p><p> Tried the 109.5gr load again – again, initial bolt lift still balking slightly and extractor cut marks on case head.</p><p> </p><p> Went down to 108.5gr – chrono gave 3,463 fps and bolt lift was totally normal, although several cases showed slight ejector cut marks. Used two chronos one behind the other. Shot 3 at 200 yards and got a 2" group – vertical dispersion was ¾" – wind was fairly strong and swirling which may account for horiz spread (which I can live with even if not wind related).]</p><p> </p><p> I finally feel comfortable with this load and will load 20 to verify.</p><p> </p><p> To put this into perspective – 118.0gr of H50BMG at 3,380 w/168gr TTSX is max in this gun (as much as 123.0gr is listed as max in various reliable sources).</p><p> ..</p><p></p><p>The following is from a poster on the 24hourcampfire -- Quickload data</p><p></p><p><a href="http://www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php/topics/8925950#Post8925950" target="_blank">http://www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php/topics/8925950#Post8925950</a></p><p></p><p></p><p>[CODE]Cartridge : .30-378 Weath. Mag.</p><p>Bullet : .308, 168, Barnes 'TTSX'BT 30878</p><p>Useable Case Capaci: 120.538 grain H2O = 7.826 cm³</p><p>Cartridge O.A.L. L6: 3.655 inch = 92.84 mm</p><p>Barrel Length : 26.0 inch = 660.4 mm</p><p>Powder : Norma 217</p><p></p><p>Predicted data by increasing and decreasing the given charge,</p><p>incremented in steps of 2.0% of nominal charge.</p><p>CAUTION: Figures exceed maximum and minimum recommended loads !</p><p></p><p>Step Fill. Charge Vel. Energy Pmax Pmuz Prop.Burnt B_Time</p><p> % % Grains fps ft.lbs psi psi % ms</p><p></p><p>-20.0 80 88.00 2664 2648 30235 12799 94.9 1.693</p><p>-18.0 82 90.20 2734 2789 32422 13177 96.1 1.652</p><p>-16.0 84 92.40 2804 2934 34785 13528 97.2 1.613</p><p>-14.0 86 94.60 2874 3082 37301 13847 98.1 1.574</p><p>-12.0 88 96.80 2944 3233 39963 14133 98.9 1.535</p><p>-10.0 90 99.00 3013 3387 42794 14382 99.4 1.498</p><p>-08.0 92 101.20 3082 3544 45817 14593 99.8 1.455</p><p>-06.0 94 103.40 3150 3702 49046 14763 100.0 1.409</p><p>-04.0 97 105.60 3218 3863 52495 14896 100.0 1.364</p><p>-02.0 99 107.80 3284 4024 56180 15020 100.0 1.322 ! Near Maximum !</p><p>+00.0 101 110.00 3350 4187 60119 15140 100.0 1.280 ! Near Maximum !</p><p>+02.0 103 112.20 3415 4350 64329 15256 100.0 1.240 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!</p><p>+04.0 105 114.40 3479 4516 68834 15367 100.0 1.202 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!</p><p>+06.0 107 116.60 3543 4682 73657 15473 100.0 1.165 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!</p><p>+08.0 109 118.80 3606 4851 78824 15574 100.0 1.130 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!</p><p>+10.0 111 121.00 3669 5021 84365 15670 100.0 1.095 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!</p><p></p><p>Results caused by ± 10% powder lot-to-lot burning rate variation using nominal charge</p><p>Data for burning rate increased by 10% relative to nominal value:</p><p>+Ba 101 110.00 3496 4559 73916 14586 100.0 1.168 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!</p><p>Data for burning rate decreased by 10% relative to nominal value:</p><p>-Ba 101 110.00 3126 3646 46492 15592 98.3 1.433</p><p> </p><p></p><p></p><p> Regards,</p><p> </p><p> Paul[/CODE]</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="paul105, post: 960079, member: 80598"] Just wanted to update this post. It shows how different guns are. Norma ballistics tech, Quickload, and actual shooting experience. Here is a chronology of events: I contacted Norma on several occasions – this is the result. Update and Recap on .30-378 Weatherby Magnum Weatherby specs list freebore is .361” for the .30-378 Wtby Mag. Best I can tell freebore on the rifle I have is at least .361 and maybe a bit more. Rifle is clean. Fired cases allow bullet to slide in and out freely (necks not too thick). Barrel Length: 26” Action: Dakota 97 Loaded with Norma 217 (Lot Number 0603 135067) 1x factory fired Weatherby cases Federal 215 magnum primers 168gr Barnes Tipped TSX Seated at 3.645” OAL Chronograh set 20’ (about 6 meters) from muzzle. Per Norma’s instructions, I started with one round at 113.5gr as listed in manual for 165gr oryx – sticky bolt uplift (for about the width of the extractor cut), extractor cut mark on case head, extraction normal and velocity didn’t register on chronograph. Temp – 65-70 Deg F After email from Norma (saying drop charge no more than 3 grains) I tried 111.5gr – velocity average 3,609 fps at 70 Deg F. Bolt lift not completely normal with resistance on initial uplift and some resistance midway thru bolt uplift (each case was a bit different) – extractor cut marks on several case heads, and extraction was normal. Dropped charge to 110.5gr – velocity 3,567 fps. Bolt lift and case head marks less noticeable than 111.5gr but still evident to some degree. Temp 65 Deg F Dropped charge to 109.5gr – velocity 3,520 fps. Bolt lift normal, case head normal. Temp 60 Deg F. It looks like I should stop at 109.5gr – does this sound reasonable and 3,520 fps. Tried the 109.5gr load again – again, initial bolt lift still balking slightly and extractor cut marks on case head. Went down to 108.5gr – chrono gave 3,463 fps and bolt lift was totally normal, although several cases showed slight ejector cut marks. Used two chronos one behind the other. Shot 3 at 200 yards and got a 2” group – vertical dispersion was ¾” – wind was fairly strong and swirling which may account for horiz spread (which I can live with even if not wind related).] I finally feel comfortable with this load and will load 20 to verify. To put this into perspective – 118.0gr of H50BMG at 3,380 w/168gr TTSX is max in this gun (as much as 123.0gr is listed as max in various reliable sources). .. The following is from a poster on the 24hourcampfire -- Quickload data [url]http://www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php/topics/8925950#Post8925950[/url] [CODE]Cartridge : .30-378 Weath. Mag. Bullet : .308, 168, Barnes 'TTSX'BT 30878 Useable Case Capaci: 120.538 grain H2O = 7.826 cm³ Cartridge O.A.L. L6: 3.655 inch = 92.84 mm Barrel Length : 26.0 inch = 660.4 mm Powder : Norma 217 Predicted data by increasing and decreasing the given charge, incremented in steps of 2.0% of nominal charge. CAUTION: Figures exceed maximum and minimum recommended loads ! Step Fill. Charge Vel. Energy Pmax Pmuz Prop.Burnt B_Time % % Grains fps ft.lbs psi psi % ms -20.0 80 88.00 2664 2648 30235 12799 94.9 1.693 -18.0 82 90.20 2734 2789 32422 13177 96.1 1.652 -16.0 84 92.40 2804 2934 34785 13528 97.2 1.613 -14.0 86 94.60 2874 3082 37301 13847 98.1 1.574 -12.0 88 96.80 2944 3233 39963 14133 98.9 1.535 -10.0 90 99.00 3013 3387 42794 14382 99.4 1.498 -08.0 92 101.20 3082 3544 45817 14593 99.8 1.455 -06.0 94 103.40 3150 3702 49046 14763 100.0 1.409 -04.0 97 105.60 3218 3863 52495 14896 100.0 1.364 -02.0 99 107.80 3284 4024 56180 15020 100.0 1.322 ! Near Maximum ! +00.0 101 110.00 3350 4187 60119 15140 100.0 1.280 ! Near Maximum ! +02.0 103 112.20 3415 4350 64329 15256 100.0 1.240 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE! +04.0 105 114.40 3479 4516 68834 15367 100.0 1.202 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE! +06.0 107 116.60 3543 4682 73657 15473 100.0 1.165 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE! +08.0 109 118.80 3606 4851 78824 15574 100.0 1.130 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE! +10.0 111 121.00 3669 5021 84365 15670 100.0 1.095 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE! Results caused by ± 10% powder lot-to-lot burning rate variation using nominal charge Data for burning rate increased by 10% relative to nominal value: +Ba 101 110.00 3496 4559 73916 14586 100.0 1.168 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE! Data for burning rate decreased by 10% relative to nominal value: -Ba 101 110.00 3126 3646 46492 15592 98.3 1.433 Regards, Paul[/CODE] [/QUOTE]
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