New here, hoping for advice

Discussion in 'The Basics, Starting Out' started by M Jager, Mar 10, 2006.

  1. M Jager

    M Jager Active Member

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    First let me say hi and that there seems to be alot of really good information on this site. I am in the middle of a personal caliber debate and am hoping you all can help me make up my mind.

    Last summer I picked up a beat up savage 110 in 30.06 for Iowa's first rifle deer season. It shoots very well but being 22 I "need" something with a bit more flare. I am thinking of rebarreling the savage with a pac-nor barrel in a flat shooting coyote and deer cartridge. Mainly looking for a "when they just have to die no matter what range or condition" coyote slayer. That being said I'm not planning on ever shooting a deer past 500 yards (personal ethics)and while varmints are a whole nother ball game (shoot em as far as you can see them) I don't realistically expect to take a shot at a yote past 600 yards.

    I want to stay in the mid calibers (keep it pleasant to shoot) and have a sporter weight 26 inch barrel as it will be carried often and shot little. I don't think I want or need a 13 pound rifle or a .338 for whackin yotes.

    I am currently leaning towards a 6mm-.06 improved with the hope of using 87 grain V-MAXs for yotes and 95 grain Barnes Xs for deer. However, the seeds of doubt are creeping in that this may not be the perfect choice for me.
    Other calibers I have thought about:
    6mm-.284
    25.06 - Hey how fast and flat do I really need to go anyway
    6.5-.06
    6.5-.284
    .257 STW - Heard about it here and sounds interesting
    I would appreciate any imput on what you think would be best for my needs. While I am by no means new to shooting and reloading, this will be my first custom so....
    Mainly looking for something that shoots flat as you don't always have time to use a laser range finder hunting coyotes and puts yotes down 'right now'
    Thanks in advance
    Matt
     
  2. royinidaho

    royinidaho Writers Guild

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    Welcome aboard,

    You want "flare"? This is the place.

    Be careful or you'll get hooked.

    Any of the calibers you list will do the job, tho the smaller the cal. the shorter the bbl life.
    Besides your "need" will most probably take you well beyond your current perspective. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

    Your "personal ethics" are gonna get stretched, I bet /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif

    More important than the action and barrel maker is the rifle smith that fits it all together. There are several great riflesmiths here that walk the walk and talk the talk.

    Some examples:
    Link
    This one will work w/your 110 action

    This'll getcha goin

    A good read

    Some of the stuff going on around here.

    And a final one

    Remember: Eat lite, tip big and dream loooonnnggg Range /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif
    Good luck.
     

  3. Buffalobob

    Buffalobob Writers Guild

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    A 243 caliber with a 1-8 twist barrel will handle the lighter bullet as well as give you the flexibillty to move up to the 105-107 gr long range bulets. To get the best of of the 6-06 and 6-284 you might add a couple of inches of barrel. An inch of barrel weighs almost exactly the same as an inch of snickers bar and is more effective than the snickers bar.

    Life is full of compromises. A 257STW and a 26 inch barrel is a waste of steel and powder. A 257Wby will probably give you the same performance in that length barrel with less problems. It will be a significant boost over the 25-06 which is itself a rock steady proven perfomer that will fulfill all of your needs.

    Most new people come to the forum wanting a laser gun and then find out the truth and proceed happily forward with a new appreciation for ballistics.

    Depending on terrain and your individual circumstances, I would strongly consider what Roy said and build a gun where the starting distance was 500yds and that way you can grow into it for a while.
     
  4. Meister

    Meister Well-Known Member

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    I realize you have a few of the wilder calibers set in your mind, but the good old 308 or 243 will do what you want and is far cheaper to shoot. This will allow you to get as much trigger time as possible for the buck. Remember, luck is the residue of preparation, the more trigger time, the better shot you become. A range card properly filled out will speed in shot taking and makes up for a less flat trajectory. Another consideration is barrel wear, the 6.5-284 and others like it will eat a barrel in as little as 1000 rounds. Every time you rebarrel you need to do a whole load evaluation and the new barrel may not like the loading you are accustomed to.
    The rounds you have mentioned are very good ones, flat and have bullets with great BC's. They will fit in you action and do a great job for your purposes, just be sure you are prepared for the financial burden that comes along with the hotter calibers. Go to midway and check what brass and bullets will cost, as well as what more standard calibers cost. My first custom rifle was a 308, I was able to learn how to do everything fairly cheaply. I was able to afford to go out every weekend and shoot 100 rounds without regretting it and calculating how much longer my barrel will last. That rifle belongs to a friend and is still a tack driver after almost 5000 rounds. If you're all set for what is required to be proficient with one of these rounds, I would suggest the 6.5-284. Lots of 1000 yd benchrest shooters can't be wrong.
     
  5. bailey1474

    bailey1474 <strong>SPONSOR</strong>

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  6. dog caller

    dog caller Well-Known Member

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    Roy in Idaho wrote:

    [ QUOTE ]

    Besides your "need" will most probably take you well beyond your current perspective.
    Good luck.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    ....and most definatly well beyond your current salary /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

    One word of advice: Don't communicate with BJ Bailey or Mike/TX. I have a feeling they are gonna cost me a whole lotta money, a worn out pick-up and a dang nice house before it's all said and done. They got me hankering for one of them 270 AM's real bad! When I order it, my wife is gonna take every darn thing I own. Maybe you should just send me the money you were planning on spending, turn tail and run! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

    It's hard to go wrong with anything in a 6mm/.244 caliber for a deer and coyote combo rifle. You get a lot of versatility with it.

    dc
     
  7. wildcat

    wildcat Well-Known Member

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    Welcome, there is great info on this site. My vote goes to the 6.5x284, I have one, and it's a shooter. I would highly recommend you think about it. I shoot a Lupa 139 grn Scenar bullet at around 2950 FPS. My best three shot group with this load is .091 at 100 yards. The 6.5x284 is a great 1000 yard caliber, and very accurate at that range. Good luck with your choice, I am sure you will get many suggestions. Once again, welcome!!!
     
  8. M Jager

    M Jager Active Member

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    First, sorry for being slow to reply. Work, school, and being sick rather sucks. Thanks for the relies and I will try to respond to each in the order they were posted.

    Roy,
    Thanks for the welcome and the links. Gotta agree that long range rifles will likely turn into an obsession, but my personal ethics probably aren't going to change. When it comes to varmints, its about getting the kill as the landowners expect results. When it comes to deer and other "game" animals I have a different perspective. Don't worry, I only apply my opinions here on myself. I put a personal max range of 500 yards on game animals for myself for my reasons. However, I certainly have no problem with someone else shooting game at any range as long as they can do it cleanly. Kinda one of those you do your thing, I'll do mine, and we'll all be happy doing our own thing.

    Bob,
    Thanks for the advice and I love the snickers anology. Can't do the .257 Wby route as my hunting buddy already has one and we all no you can't copy. I fully agree with your laser gun comment, but I think we both agree that, when you don't have time to laser the range and consult your balistics table, flatter is better.

    Meister,
    Again, great words of wisdom. However, if I was going to go with a .243 or .308, I think I would be further ahead to leave it alone as a 30.06. Don't worry, I have and will have other rifles to put extensive rounds through. For example, I am currently building a Shilen barreled AR that I expect to be a hect of a P. Dog slayer, which is one of my hobbies. I figure I can shoot the hect out of my .22, .223, and .308 as a substitute for only sparingly shooting whatever barrel burner I build.

    Dog Caller,
    I know what you mean man. Try doing it on a college budget. I have a feeling its going to be awhile before I get this project started. For the record, I really hate college.

    Wildcat,
    Not much to say, except it looks like one more vote for the 6.5x284. Looks like its going to might hard to buck the 6.5 logic.
    Thanks all for the replies so far.
    Matt
     
  9. bailey1474

    bailey1474 <strong>SPONSOR</strong>

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    [ QUOTE ]
    For the record, I really hate college.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Enjoy it while your there my friend. The real world is not as good as it seems. I'd give anything to go back to my freshman year knowing what I know now. Best 7 years of my life!!! And no I'm not a doctor.
     
  10. remingtonman_25_06

    remingtonman_25_06 Well-Known Member

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    Out of your choices, I would vote for the 25-06. If you want versatality you can shoot the 100g or 115g btip at 3350, and 3150fps respectively. Great coyote, and longer range deer rounds. I have personally taken several deer at the 500+ yard mark with my 25-06 and the 115g btip. Its an accurate caliber, cheap to shoot, pretty easy on the pocket book, and will give you at least 3000-3500 rounds of barrel life. Its not as fancy as some of the other calibers you listed, but it will get the job done out to 600 yards on coyotes and deer.
     
  11. 41mag

    41mag Well-Known Member

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    Hey Matt,

    Don't pay no mind to Dog Caller there, it only took me 35 years to save up for my new rig. Heck and I haven't even been to college. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

    I have one thing for you to think about. Your only going through this world one time, there ain't no guarantees on how long that will last. You might as well get what you want and worry about the ripple effect later if at all. My brother in law would have turned 46 this coming Saturday, instead we will be having services for him. I know it put a lot into perspective for me.

    As for the college, get all you can out of it while your there. It's way harder to try and go back for more at a later date. It ight seem a waste of time and effort, but most jobs now consider some sort of degree a minimum requirment. You young you will have time to worry about working when it comes. Get the education and you will be miles ahead.
     
  12. Coyboy

    Coyboy Well-Known Member

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    Mike, sorry about your B-in-L passing. Your sister is going to need ya.
     
  13. M Jager

    M Jager Active Member

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    Mike,
    Sorry to hear about your brother in law and good advice on living every day for its potential.

    On college, I mainly dislike it for alot of general reasons. First, 99 percent of what you do in terms of coursework doesn't apply to anything you will do in the real world. To say its a waste of time is an understatement. Second, if the USA was ran like a university, we would have a revolution. Yes, it is that messed up. Third, college students as a group are immature, self centered, and don't take life seriously. 4 years of that crap is enough for me. My idea of living life isn't getting stupid drunk 3 or more times a week. Sorry, too many negative experiences to count and I have a negative opinion of college and I can't wait to get out.

    However, I do feel I have done a pretty decent job of getting the most from my four year sentence.
    I will graduate in 4 years (May) with a B.S. in Animal Ecology (Wildlife) and a minor Criminal Justice and a G.P.A. of 3.4-something.
    I represented the U.S.A. in the 2003 College World Shooting Championships held in the Czech Republic (shot trap)
    I spent a summer trapping wolves for the USGS outside Ely, MN
    I spent a summer living in the Bob Marshal Wilderness (Montana) studing grizzly bears for the USFS
    I spent a summer working as a seasonal L.E.O. for the IA DNR
    I am a current member of the I.S.U. Rodeo Team (I ride bulls)
    I am currently in the hiring process with the US Border Patrol and hopefully will be working for USFWS within 5 years.

    I guess I really don't fit the norm, I prefer the real world to college life. I have chosen a career field where I want to go to work everyday. Call me weird, I'm just not a college person.
     
  14. hjl

    hjl Well-Known Member

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    m jager
    Have you thought about a 25/06 ackley improved?
    It will fit your std o6 bolt face .With a 26 in barrel it should nearly equal your mates 257 weatherby in proformance.
    Easy to form cases as all you do is load 25/06 ammo &amp; fire .
    25/06 cases are a lot cheaper than weatherby.
    Regards
    hjl