new custom cant get to shoot

Discussion in 'Long Range Hunting & Shooting' started by Foster_65, Feb 13, 2011.

  1. Foster_65

    Foster_65 Well-Known Member

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    i just got my first custom rifle in january. it is a 7mm wsm and i am having a heck of a time getting any good accuracy out of it. one inch is about the best. i have tried 168 bergers, 160 sierra game king, and 160 gr accubonds. i have tried alot of different powders including h1000, rl 25, win 780, and alot of others. the rifle is a sporter weight lilja barrel 1-9 twist on a rem 700 short action, bell and carlson alaskan stock that has been bedded. being it is a short action i am limited with mag space. can anyone help me i am completely frustrated. i have already put about 250 rounds through it just in load developement. what can i do??? or any suggestions on bullet powder combos would be great. or any other suggestions at all.
    thanks
     
  2. liltank

    liltank Well-Known Member

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    How have you been working up your loads? Did you stick with one powder and bullet combo at one length?

    Ex:
    H1000 @2.275" comparator OAL Federal 210 primer, loaded in point .2 or .3 grain increments from minimum to max load.

    Another example, I loaded .308 to find a good load. I picked a specific length and loaded 3 powders as follows:

    RL15 43.0, 43.3, 43.5, 43.8, 44.0, 44.5= 43.3, 43.5, 44.0 accuracy nodes 2.286 C.O.A.L (touching lands)
    TAC 42.0, 42.2, 42.4, 42.6, 42.8, 43.0= 42.4 accuracy node 2.275 C.O.A.L (.010" off lands)
    Varget 43.0, 43.3, 43.5, 43.8, 44.0, 44.5, 45.0= 43.5, 44.5 accuracy nodes C.O.A.L

    All these were set to the exact same length (accept the TAC), F210M, RWS brass and bullet. You pretty much have to do the same with any bullet you choose. Just one hint, try sinking your Bergers to .075", .080", .100" deep.

    Tank
     

  3. Dean2506

    Dean2506 Well-Known Member

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    Out of sporter weight bbl. how much cool down between shots. How clean is your bore? I have a rifle right now that will only shoot 8 rounds accurate (one ragged hole) then goes to crap (1.5 in) until i clean. fixing to rebarrel that rifle. Are you full length sizing or neck sizing? Have you tried loading some long and firing it like a single shot? Just a few questions. I played hell with the one that likes a clean bbl before i figured it out.
     
  4. Foster_65

    Foster_65 Well-Known Member

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    i have been going up in 1 grain increments with these powders from min to max and sometimes a grain over is there is no signs of pressure. with the bergers, i that them set so they just fit in the mag so i cannot get them that close to the lands. that is my problem i think. i havent shot any bullets bullets lighter than 160. should i try some 140s?? maybe i should got up in half grain increments instead of one grain. i did have one group with bergers and h1000. it was 69 gr and shot two for shot groups that measured about .75 moa. should i try going up or down a couple tenths. the groups both had 1 flyer but 8 shots in about an inch seems fairly consistent.

    i have struggled with this wth factory guns but thought that a custom would never be this fussy. i wanted to be able to consistantly shoot .5 moa or so at 100 and keep this at longer ranges. so far it seems like i have spent alot of money for a rifle that shoots not a whole lot better than a factory. i am stressed
     
  5. rscott5028

    rscott5028 Well-Known Member

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    Are you saying you can't seat VLD bullets to the lands lest they not fit in the mag well? If so, you might try single shot like Dean2506 suggested to see if you can find a load with the accuracy you're looking for.

    And, go at it methodically like Tank suggested. It's easy to get in a hurry and change too many variables at once.

    How's your concentricity and headspace on your brass before and after firing?

    What does your smith think about the results thus far?

    --richard
     
  6. liltank

    liltank Well-Known Member

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    It's okay to go mag length. Go in .2tenth grain increments. That will really let you see what it is doing for grouping. One grain increments is way to broad to really nail down accuracy. Pressure testing, 1 grain is okay, but to find an accuracy load it needs to be much closer. Let the barrel cool between loads. Clean between each load to really get a feel for what the barrel is capable of.

    Tank
     
  7. ICANHITHIMMAN

    ICANHITHIMMAN Well-Known Member

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    I would go half grain increments till I got her close then tenths. Min 200 yards test range and at least 10 min between shots. Depending on the temp. I have a hand held lazer thermomiter I take with me seems over the top I know but lets me keep things consistant.
     
  8. Foster_65

    Foster_65 Well-Known Member

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    i am full length sizing and bumping the shoulder back .002. i did have a great load with the bergers and rl 17 but the bullets were seated long and would not fit in the mag. so i could go back to that but it would be a single shot and i really dont want that. i am not fussy on bullet type just a good hunting bullet for large mulies.

    well i havent talked to the smith since i shot those good groups with the bergers seated long. he was there when i shot them. just looking for the capability to shoot more than one shot
     
  9. elkaholic

    elkaholic Well-Known Member

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    Do you know what all was done besides a custom barrel and the action bedded? Did the gunsmith square the action, barrel and lugs? I had a 721 Remington with TWO different Lilja barrels, an H-S stock, etc. and I never could get it to shoot under an inch. I found out that all the smith did was lap the lugs. I highly suspect the problem was the action since the chance of getting two bad Lilja barrels was near zero! I'm not saying that is your problem; I hope it isn't. Let us know. Good luck........Rich
    p.s. just noticed in your above post that you did shoot one good group with the bullets seated out. That is a GOOD sign. My guns only shoot Bergers seated into the lands.
     
  10. Coyboy

    Coyboy Well-Known Member

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    I agree with the other guys .5 grain increments or your likly waisting alot of time.
    H1000 and rl-25 are not the ideal powders in the 7wsm. especially with a short barrel. (I am assuming you don't have a 26" #3, you said sporter.)

    I would start with h4831sc and if that didn't work would try H4350.

    Did the smith instal a wyatts extended mag box? Thats a neccesity in the wsm cartriges in SA.

    Are you shooting off a bipod or sandbags?

    What power scope? If it is a 9-10 power you might try a 20x for load development and switch it after you find the load.
     
  11. BountyHunter

    BountyHunter Writers Guild

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    Good cleaning with copper remover and carbon cutter to remove the carbon ring in the throat.

    Try RL17, non magnum primers and Barnes TTSX seated well off the lands to fit in the existing magazine. Another powder is H4350

    If I understood correctly, you have one load that shoots good but too long.

    Otherwise I would say change scopes and have someone else shoot the gun to see if they get the same results.

    BH
     
  12. Foster_65

    Foster_65 Well-Known Member

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    i am unsure if he blue printed the action, i guess i just assumed he did. yes i did have a load that would shoot one ragged hole with the bergers using rl 17 but they would not fit in the mag well. and it is the factory mag well. i am pretty confident the rifle is clean, as i never let it go more than 20 rounds and it seems that after 20 there is not very much fouling. using KG 12 and butches for the carbon. i ahve not tried h4831 or h4350 but did try both in the IMR but not extensively. my dad is in wi and i know he has some h4831 layin around and im gonna let him take the rifle with him for some more developement. its hard to find days that arnt windy here in ND. i have been doing both using sand bags and off a pod. when i use the bi pod i have bags in the back. my scope is a leupold mark 4 4.5-14.

    i am thinking about trying some hornady 162 btsp. would H4831 be good powder to start with.
     
  13. liltank

    liltank Well-Known Member

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    I would suggest the 162 SST's. They are going to give you better ballistics than the SPBT. The 162 A-max or new BTHP might be a good option. Pick one and go for it.

    Tank
     
  14. eddybo

    eddybo Well-Known Member

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    VLDs are seating depth sensitive, but do not have to be seated in the lands. Take the load that was working you seat it to the magazine, and then keep going shorter keeping an eye on pressures. I have a couple berger loads that are seated very short.