Deputy819
Well-Known Member
Read here this morning about using Lapua .308 Palma (small primer pocket) brass to 'possibly' give the .358 Winchester a little extra kick (under the handloading section of the article). Anybody here ever tried this?
Lapua .308 Palma brass for .358 Winchester?
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ShtrRdy
Well-Known Member
I didn't read the whole article but I saw the note about getting increased velocity out of the Lapua small primer brass. The way this person got higher velocity was to run the pressure over max. This is where the small primer is a benefit to reducing the primer pocket from getting loose.
From my limited experience with a small primer in the 6mm Creedmoor brass, I found I needed a CCI Magnum primer to get ES down. I've also read of others having trouble igniting the powder charge in cold temperatures.
If you want to run a little higher velocity you might try higher pressure with the brass you have to see what happens.
From my limited experience with a small primer in the 6mm Creedmoor brass, I found I needed a CCI Magnum primer to get ES down. I've also read of others having trouble igniting the powder charge in cold temperatures.
If you want to run a little higher velocity you might try higher pressure with the brass you have to see what happens.
Deputy819
Well-Known Member
Well, the issue with the brass I currently have (Starline) is that with a 200gr bullet I'm a full grain away (48.0gr IMR 3031) from a listed compressed Max load (49.0gr IMR 3031) and I'm already very compressed. If I try to stuff any more powder in the case the bullet is pushed back out of the case mouth after seating. Don't think I'll be able to increase the pressure by adding powder. Luckily, 48.0gr IMR 3031 is consistently very accurate in my rifle, but I don't know the velocity. The muzzle brake gives my Magnetospeed 'error fits' unfortunately.
I was just curious if anyone had tried Lapua brass in this case and what their results were.
ShtrRdy
Well-Known Member
Oh, I see your dilemma. Thanks for explaining it. 
358 WCF
Active Member
Maybe a different powder is a better option? AA2015, RL7, the 4895s, RL15, & 748 aren't long extruded powders, so they fill the case with less air space & compression. Just a thought...
Deputy819
Well-Known Member
Yeah, I've had other members send me data on Ramshot TAC, etc for the .358. The load I currently have with IMR 3031 is a consistently accurate one to be sure, but just won't allow me to go any further. Almost one of those situations where I should just "leave well enough alone".
I was merely curious if anyone here had actually went through the trouble of necking up Lapua .308 Palma brass, having to get a smaller decapping pin, etc just to see if substantial enough velocity was gained that would actually justify it.
I was merely curious if anyone here had actually went through the trouble of necking up Lapua .308 Palma brass, having to get a smaller decapping pin, etc just to see if substantial enough velocity was gained that would actually justify it.
358 WCF
Active Member
I necked up 20 regular Lapua 308 brass for mine, cuz that's what I had handy. It's still packed away waiting to be tested for a real load. I fireformed with a fairly stiff charge of AA2015 & 200 gr. Hornadys for a jagged hole at 100 yds., but haven't been able to do anything else with it due to life happening. Have you tried WW brass as it may be thinner than *line? Is it still available anywhere? I've been away from the hobby for a while & still trying to get up to speed on what's out there. Man are you guys spoiled these days, or what?
You could always be happy with what you have too unless you're inclined more testing. I doubt if 100fps will be all that much of a difference. What kind of actual speeds are you getting? Book numbers are often rather meaningless in the real world with different components.
You could always be happy with what you have too unless you're inclined more testing. I doubt if 100fps will be all that much of a difference. What kind of actual speeds are you getting? Book numbers are often rather meaningless in the real world with different components.
Deputy819
Well-Known Member
Which Hornady's were you using?
The only brass I've tried is Starline. Been slinging Sierra 200gr ProHunters (round nose) so far and they're accurate enough.....NOT 1 jagged hole accurate, but consistently shoot less than 1 moa out to 200 yards.
cohunt
Well-Known Member
well-- I found some info, maybe it will help-- a guy weighed 25 cases of starline vs lapua palma brass and came up with 171gr average for the starline vs 177 for the Lap palma--- usually (not always) heavier weight will show less capacity--soooo the lap palma brass may have less capacity than the starline you are already using, but since the lap/palma brass has a small primer hole the differences in weight may skew the results here--- I find that starline usually has a bit more than average case capacity but they may be close
I also found a post where a guy checked the case cap of the lap palma brass and it came out to 55.9gr of H2o--what does your starline brass hold?
I also found a post where a guy checked the case cap of the lap palma brass and it came out to 55.9gr of H2o--what does your starline brass hold?
Last edited:
Deputy819
Well-Known Member
358 WCF
Active Member
Deputy,
Holy crap. I just dug out the reload page for these. It was in 1995. The 1st 5 shots were Factory 358 during break in. They shot around 3/4" @100 yds. It was Sierra 225s seated into the lands, not Hornady 200s. Sorry about that. All 20 shot into a .622" group during bbl break in. Not chronographed & case base expansion was mild up to 39 gr. of AA2015 where I stopped that day. Somewhere in a box they are loaded again in 1/2 gr. steps up to 41gr, but that's as far as I got. There is a note in my notes that Lapua 308 taper expanded to .35 is a tad thicker in the neck walls than WW factory 358s from a yellow box with 200 gr. Silver-Tips.
I wouldn't expect this kind of accuracy from a factory gun. This is with a stainless M-70 short action that the guy who did my benchrest guns squared, trued, generally spiffed up & then installed a 21" Shilen select 35 bbl. with a snug chamber.
Wish I could be more help. It's coming, but I dont move as fast as I once did & the loading bench is still under construction. I dug the chronograph out over the weekend &, believe it or not, it's working but I had to fiddle with it. Glad I took the battery out of it 25 years ago...
Holy crap. I just dug out the reload page for these. It was in 1995. The 1st 5 shots were Factory 358 during break in. They shot around 3/4" @100 yds. It was Sierra 225s seated into the lands, not Hornady 200s. Sorry about that. All 20 shot into a .622" group during bbl break in. Not chronographed & case base expansion was mild up to 39 gr. of AA2015 where I stopped that day. Somewhere in a box they are loaded again in 1/2 gr. steps up to 41gr, but that's as far as I got. There is a note in my notes that Lapua 308 taper expanded to .35 is a tad thicker in the neck walls than WW factory 358s from a yellow box with 200 gr. Silver-Tips.
I wouldn't expect this kind of accuracy from a factory gun. This is with a stainless M-70 short action that the guy who did my benchrest guns squared, trued, generally spiffed up & then installed a 21" Shilen select 35 bbl. with a snug chamber.
Wish I could be more help. It's coming, but I dont move as fast as I once did & the loading bench is still under construction. I dug the chronograph out over the weekend &, believe it or not, it's working but I had to fiddle with it. Glad I took the battery out of it 25 years ago...
Deputy819
Well-Known Member
Gotcha! I was actually looking at those yesterday on Midway USA's site.....thinking about giving them a try. I had really good luck with the 225 Game Kings in a .338-06.
sounds like a nice M70 you've got there.
RAGGED EDGE
Well-Known Member
I found the 225 Sierra to be the most accurate bullet in all of my .358s'.
Deputy819
Well-Known Member
How did it perform for you on deer (or anything else) at 200 yards and under?
