Fire forming 243 brass

[Beelzebub]

I've got about 600 full length cases laying around and want/need to fire form them to match 3 different 243's. I have about 400 58 grain Zombie bullets I was going to use to form the cases. How much pressure is needed to form an RP case adequately? I have on hand: 4064, 4350, RL19, 4198, 4895, RL7 7828, H100V and a bunch or shotgun and pistol powders also. I really don't want to sent hot rounds down the barrels and help burn out the barrels. Any recommendations on powder/charge? I don't care how fast or accurate they are. Probably just shoot them into a sand pile or water any way.

thanks in advance,
B

 

[MagnumManiac]

I use Clays and a twist of toilet paper.
This is my method.
I average the max loads listed in the top 3 from a manual, say 40gr, for the 243. Then I divide that number by 3, this is my start load for fire forming with Clays, a 1/3 charge of max with rifle powder.
This has never failed to work for me, you need to increase the charge if cases don't come out fully formed near the base. The tp needs to be poked in quite firmly, I know when it's tight enough just as it starts to squeak.
Clays is quite bulky, so no filler has never been needed.
Hope this helps.

Cheers.
gun)

 

[Beelzebub]

I use Clays and a twist of toilet paper.
This is my method.
I average the max loads listed in the top 3 from a manual, say 40gr, for the 243. Then I divide that number by 3, this is my start load for fire forming with Clays, a 1/3 charge of max with rifle powder.
This has never failed to work for me, you need to increase the charge if cases don't come out fully formed near the base. The tp needs to be poked in quite firmly, I know when it's tight enough just as it starts to squeak.
Clays is quite bulky, so no filler has never been needed.
Hope this helps.

Cheers.
gun)

XXXXXXXXXXXXX

OK, so basically you are loading 16-18 grains of Clays and then stuffing TP as tight as you can get it. No bullet?????????????

 

[MagnumManiac]

XXXXXXXXXXXXX

OK, so basically you are loading 16-18 grains of Clays and then stuffing TP as tight as you can get it. No bullet?????????????

That is correct.
I have also fired 300RUM factory loads in my 338 Edge chamber to get fully formed brass. It works, even on the necks.

Cheers.
gun)

 

[bigedp51]

I had 50 new Winchester .243 cases that were .009 shorter than a GO gauge and .011 shorter than the chamber. I fired half of them with the bullet jammed into the rifling 2 grains below my normal charge. And then fired the other half without doing anything but loading and shooting them with a normal powder charge.

I then checked the second batch on my RCBS case mastering gauge and there was no stretching or thinning.

Below my $100.00 RCBS "bent paperclip" gauge for checking thinning in the base web area.

Bottom line, as long as your not shooting a mil-surp rifle with a long fat chamber the case should not stretch at reasonable chamber pressures.

I asked about this fire forming at AccurateShooter.com and got replies about false shoulders, jamming, etc. And a benchrest shooter sent me a PM and said just shoot a few cases at normal pressure and see if they stretch and then worry about it if they do. Meaning a lot of it depends on the type/quality of brass you are shooting.

 

[Beelzebub]

That is correct.
I have also fired 300RUM factory loads in my 338 Edge chamber to get fully formed brass. It works, even on the necks.

Cheers.
gun)

XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX

thanks for clearing that up for me. Will definitely be making confetti this morning.

B

 

[ShootnMathews]

Maybe this is not relevant to the question but depending on what you are using the gun for, fire forming may just be a waste of supplies. In my 243 there is so little difference in group size between formed brass and new brass that it's pointless to bother with. You may see better results. Maybe my 243 just isn't picky. I can use different brands of brass, new brass, formed brass, mixed brass, doesn't really seem to matter much as long as the powder is consistent and bullet seat is consistent the gun shoots 1/2" to 5/8" groups.

But my gun is a hunting gun and 1/2" is plenty close enough. If I were competition shooting with it I'd probably keep tinkering with it but it shoots sub 3" groups at 500 which is about my max hunting range with a 243. So with my rifle any fire forming, neck turning, weight sorting, and stuff like that is just a waste to me because it's already accurate enough to kill a deer as far as I want to push a 243. I'm not bragging here by the way. Just saying you might want to try a few first to see what you got before burning $100 worth a powder.

 

[Beelzebub]

I have about come to the same conclusion. With full length sized, untrimmed brass, non-deburred flash holes and inconsistent seating depths as much as .008 I can still get her to shoo into the .3xx" groups. So I bought a neck sizer, flash hole uniformer and a micro adjust seater die. Neck sized and trimmed all fire formed brass. Hunting season is dying down. Only 2 more weeks left of gun season, so I'm just going to do a little more fine tuning with charges and seating depths and pick a winner and start loading up 6 or 7 hundred cases. I ordered 2 of the smallest square plates from the LRH Store and they should be here tomorrow. Can't wait to back up to about 675 and listen for the gong sound.

Bgun)

 

[Ksmirk]

Just a hint if you happen to have a break on your rifle might be careful with the TP loads, I've heard of breaks being torn off :-O like I said never saw it but one of those read on the inter web things so your mileage may vary. Later,

Kirk

 

[Beelzebub]

Just a hint if you happen to have a break on your rifle might be careful with the TP loads, I've heard of breaks being torn off :-O like I said never saw it but one of those read on the inter web things so your mileage may vary. Later,

Kirk

XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX

will definitely keep a watch out for that. Wouldn't think tha particular charge woud produce enuff pressure to do that, but physics is a strange thing. tks for the heads up.

 

[okie man]

Are you planning on splitting up the brass for each gun? 200 cases per gun, I'd just load up some plinker rounds, split them up between guns and shoot them. Couple hundred average rounds won't hurt a 243! Just keep the barrels clean and cool

 

[Beelzebub]

Thanks for all of the advice guys. I think I have come to the conclusion to just load the most accurate bullets for each gun and fire form the cases as I go and keep the separated after firing.

I did ask for advice and I do appreciated the advice I got.

Bee

 

[Ksmirk]

You could go out on a limb and find 1 load all the rifles liked might drive you stir crazy then who knows may just fall in your lap. Not saying your wrong just seems like a hassle to have a load for each rifle. Later,

Kirk