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Discussion in 'Reloading' started by bigbuckjeff, May 1, 2010.
After FL resizing bolt is hard to close. Length is good. What might be my trouble?
What caliber? What brand of dies & press?
I'd say the die needs adjusted , it's not pushing the shoulder back far enough .
300 WSM, Remington Model 7 ,RCBS dies .Old Lyman Orange Crush Press
How would I adjust the dies?
The die brand, press and cartridge doesn't matter; just adjust the FL sizer by loosening the lock nut and turning the die body down a little bit more. I'd bet another 1/16 of a turn (about 4 1/2 thou) will fix things up fine.
I had the same problem with my 300WSM when I was setting the dies up to reload. I was using Redding dies and in order to set the shoulder back enough for case to chamber in my Tikka T3 rifle I had to grind a small amount of steel off the base of the sizer die in order for the die to drop far enough over the case. This was with new Winchester brass. This procedure didn't harm the performance of the die at all.
I found that if you head spacing is a little long with the WSM stuff you can set your shoulder back to fit the chamber but the case needs to go deeper to get the area ahead of the web sized back down to fit the diameter of the chamber, but to do that you end up setting your shoulder way back again and the cycle goes round.
I had to grind a die of also but it was to get the brass sized down not set the shoulder back. I reset my head spacing and I can set it up normal now and only bump the shoulder. Grind your shell holder if you need to that's easier to replace.
I realise this may be a stupid question, but are you allowing the press to 'cam over' at the top of it's stroke?
I have only ever loaded for a buddies 300WSM, it was a real PITA to get right!
I had to keep screwing the die in and sizing a case then trying it in the rifle until the bolt would close with little resistance, it took me a few hours of checking and double checking the fit. Some cases were fine on the first try and others were as if they'd been fired in another rifle.
I then discovered that it was the expansion ring just above the web causing the tight bolt closure! I didn't modify his die in any way, just made sure that the press was camming over enough to size the entire case.
I ended up with a die condition that was over 1/4 turn in past die/shellholder contact with the ram at the top of it's stroke.
Sure , those things can matter. If the OP had stated the cal. we'd automatically know they would be resonably new manufactured dies as the cartridge is reasonably new. As for the press and dies, press first, is it a 'cheaper' brand with weak linkage that might be springing instead of transfering the motion and power as it should. The dies, are they an old, off brand, that came out of a gunshow (gunshows and pawn shops seem to be where some items go after they no longer work like they are supposed to). More information can never be a bad thing. Hope you get it sorted out BBJ.
I've seen dies (especially in the mag cases) that do not size the web area down far enough. Check the web diameter on a fired case and again after full length sizing and see if there is a difference and how much? I had an ultra that had that problem......Rich
" If the OP had stated the cal. we'd automatically know they would be resonably new manufactured dies as the cartridge is reasonably new. As for the press and dies, press first, is it a 'cheaper' brand with weak linkage that might be springing instead of transfering the motion and power as it should. The dies, are they an old, off brand, that came out of a gunshow (gunshows and pawn shops seem to be where some items go after they no longer work like they are supposed to). More information can never be a bad thing. Hope you get it sorted out BBJ.
Ted/BBJ, I'm old but I think maybe I've sorted your comments into four points. Lets see if I get it now.
1. Old and/or off brand dies were made to exactly the same SAAMI tolerances as newer ones and they are adjusted exactly like new ones ... and I can actually remember that! In fact, I still have a small pile of those old and "off brand" dies. They haven't dry rotted, they still look and work fine, exactly as they did some 45 years ago!
2. Press spring and wear are all easily compensated for with proper die adjusment, isn't it? (Well, mine are!)
3. No cartridge, new or old, is reloaded with specific or different die adjusments from any other of it's general type.
4. More "information" means nothing if it's irrelivant information, does it? lightbulb
So, all that irrelivant stuff you mention doesn't matter a bit to the question.
Elk and Bigbuckjeff, problems in resizing belted cases is sometimes caused by the die maker not making the upper interiour of the die body as long and, occasionally, not as small in the lower diameter as it should be. Understand that neither our die nor chamber specifications are a given specific measurement, both have a tolerance range and everything within that range is fully "in tolerance." That usually works fine, BUT if we get a smallish chamber and a largish die we may not quite be able to make it work and it's not a brand or price thing, it's just standard manufactoring tolerances stacking against you. Seems most die makers will replace the die if the owner lets them know about it.
Otherwise, take a look at Larry Willlis' "Innovative Technogies" (Goggle it) collet sizing die for belted rounds, it's made for dealing with exactly that problem.
Im having the same trouble with my new wildcat 25 WSM using the 270 wsm necked to 25. I dont want to oversize and throw off the head space. My big problem is if i go a little farther than shell holder i start crushing the case at the shoulkder and case wall jucntion. But my real problem has been working up loads my best vel. and accuracy 1/2 moa and 3650 vel. with 100 grain sierra bt is extrtaction. Case sticks in chamber and extractor wont pull it out. Bolt lifts good and comes back but case stays in chamber and have to use a cleaning rod to remove. I know everyone is going to say load is to hot but i only have aslight plunger mark on case. I have done this hundreds of times and never had this problem from pressure. I wondering if my extractor is bad it is factory remington . Also the fired case is stiff to reclose bolt and still wont extract after being placed back in after fired. I shot this load on sat. temp. 81 degree no problem today had this problem with 72 degree temp with humidity from on and off rain showers. Im using new redding dies, and rockchucker press. Any help would be appreciated.
Mike......I had this EXACT same problem with my 300 ultra. Two or three firings and you had to throw the case away even with moderate loads. As I mentioned in an above post, many manufacturers dies do not size the case down sufficiently "at the web"! Measure a fired case and then a resized case and see for yourself. An unfired factory case will have about .005" clearance. Most of the dies are very near chamber spec and once the web is expanded fully to chamber size, the dies will not size it back sufficiently. The larger diameter the case (magnun) the more clearance is needed. I found with my ultra that if I didn't have at least a thou clearance when chambering, the case would likely not extract upon firing. I complained about this to my gunsmith and he confirmed what I am stating. Try it and see! My guess is that you have about 1/2 thou after you have resized when the cases are sticking......Rich