Autorotate19
Well-Known Member
Thanks for all the help. Ridge Runner, so I could run a piece of brass in a .30 cal die just to expand the neck. Then start sizing it in my 7mm die. Do I have that right?
Thanks
Thanks
Adjusting Die to Chamber?
- Thread starter Autorotate19
- Start date
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I am in the same boat. I know this is going to be 2 questions a bottle neck chambers on the sholder and a belted mag chambers on the belt right. Now if I got my FL resizing die set to deep it going shorten my caseJon,
Thanks for saying what I was trying to say.....
I think I need to take a common sense descriptive writing class.
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Most all cases will grow with upper end charges. It is allways good to know where the shoulder is in comparrison to your chamber. A quick measurement of your brass that has been fired at least three times with this Case Gauges & Headspace Tools - Hornady Lock-N-Load HeadspaceTool Set w/Bushings
will let you know exactly where your at.
This measurement will help you set up your die properly. Dont care if your using a bottleneck cartridge or a belted one. When properly set up, your die should lessen this measurement by .002 - .003. Anything more and you are working your brass too much which could result in case head seperation.
will let you know exactly where your at.
This measurement will help you set up your die properly. Dont care if your using a bottleneck cartridge or a belted one. When properly set up, your die should lessen this measurement by .002 - .003. Anything more and you are working your brass too much which could result in case head seperation.
Ridge Runner
Well-Known Member
thats what I do, just run a 30 cal expander ball through the neck, then size it back down to a crush fit. I've had zero separations since 1980.
RR
RR
Autorotate19
Well-Known Member
I think he means just a couple peices just to set your die. Not every time. Thanks
Ridge Runner
Well-Known Member
ovas is correct, I only do this the first piece of brass, just to get the die set up, that piece then stays in the die box.
RR
RR
Autorotate19
Well-Known Member
Well I tried what ridge runner said, expanded the neck to .30 call then sized it down until bolt would close with resistance. Tuned in just a touch more and they chamber fine. Is it okay if the bolt is just a little tight, or should it be normal? Thanks for all the help guys! O and I was searching around, and a few guys were talking about using a paper clip to measure the stretch in front of the belt. Does anyone do this. Thanks
Autorotate19
Well-Known Member
I started sizing all my cases and I noticed that is looks like its not sizing the neck all the way down to the shoulder. Is this right?
What do you guys think? They chamber just fine? Thanks
http://i897.photobucket.com/albums/ac174/ovastafford/th_casesjpgmod-1.jpg
What do you guys think? They chamber just fine? Thanks
http://i897.photobucket.com/albums/ac174/ovastafford/th_casesjpgmod-1.jpg
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Moosetracker
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Nov 28, 2005
- Messages
- 56
I use a variation of the technique described by Fitch above.
To set it up for a .002" bump on the shoulder I use the following procedure.
1. I take a case fire formed in my firearm. The case should be a tight fit so that it's as close as possible to chamber dimensions.
2. Set the case in the Digital Headspace Gauge and zero the gauge (can use Hornady or RCBS gauges). Here's the link: Innovative Technologies - Reloading Equipment
3. Insert a .003" shim on the FL or redding body die and screw the die in the press till it's snug on the shellholder. Here's the link for the set of shims:
- Skip's die shim kit - (7/8-14)
4. Resize the case with that set up.
5. Place the case in the Digital Headspace Gauge and get a measurement of the amount of shoulder bump.
6. If the bump measures .005" all you need to do is replace the .003" shim with a .006" shim and you get a .002" bump.
The beauty of this set up is that you don't need to touch the die even if you have multiple guns of the same caliber - you just change the shim in accordance with the bump you need. Also you can use another shim if you want more or less bump.
Occasionnally, you get a minimal dimension chamber where you can only get less than .001" with the FL or body die. When this occurs, I use a dedicated shell holder which I sand on a flat surface to take off .001" or so.
Finally it's a good idea to keep a tight fitting fire formed case in your die box to test your setting with the Headspace Digital Gauge occasionnally.
To set it up for a .002" bump on the shoulder I use the following procedure.
1. I take a case fire formed in my firearm. The case should be a tight fit so that it's as close as possible to chamber dimensions.
2. Set the case in the Digital Headspace Gauge and zero the gauge (can use Hornady or RCBS gauges). Here's the link: Innovative Technologies - Reloading Equipment
3. Insert a .003" shim on the FL or redding body die and screw the die in the press till it's snug on the shellholder. Here's the link for the set of shims:
- Skip's die shim kit - (7/8-14)
4. Resize the case with that set up.
5. Place the case in the Digital Headspace Gauge and get a measurement of the amount of shoulder bump.
6. If the bump measures .005" all you need to do is replace the .003" shim with a .006" shim and you get a .002" bump.
The beauty of this set up is that you don't need to touch the die even if you have multiple guns of the same caliber - you just change the shim in accordance with the bump you need. Also you can use another shim if you want more or less bump.
Occasionnally, you get a minimal dimension chamber where you can only get less than .001" with the FL or body die. When this occurs, I use a dedicated shell holder which I sand on a flat surface to take off .001" or so.
Finally it's a good idea to keep a tight fitting fire formed case in your die box to test your setting with the Headspace Digital Gauge occasionnally.
Autorotate19
Well-Known Member
Do my cases look normal though? They are like 10 thousands larger near the bottom of the neck compared to the mouth.
royinidaho
Well-Known Member
They appear to be partial neck sized. If the cases chamber and shoot ok then ok.
I partial neck size until shoulder needs bumped back thinking that the 'bump' centers the bullet in the bore. Not sure if the thinking is correct but the bump doesn't seem to hurt.
LRHWAL
Well-Known Member
I'm going to maybe throw a curve ball and don't mean to confuse anyone (and don't claim to know everything, but don't tell my girlfriend I admitted that).
I'm with the guys who suggest that you need headspace gauges of some sort. Without them you don't really know where you are. In fact, sizing to "kiss" the shellholder with the bottom of the die without a "cam over" may be increasing the headspace of the case - i.e. moving the datum line forward. I've experienced this first hand.
Take a look as you size a case and you may see that initial "kiss" of the shellholder change to a gap of a few thou when you are actually performing a sizing operation and take up the play on the threads etc. As you start sizing you squeeze the body smaller and the brass needs to go somewhere, so it initially increases headspace and, as you adjust the die lower, it will begin to decrease the headspace again. It would have saved me some time if someone told me this before. This is nowehere in die instructions. I was setting up Redding Comp Shellholders and it was confusing to see the headspace initially increase as I used the shellholders that would in theory decrease it.
Your current setting may in fact be increasing the headspace. In most circumstances a hard up to the shellholder setting will size more than is needed and can increase the chances of head separations and the case wall thinning in the web area as described. It all depends on your chamber, brass, dies and shellholder.
So, I'm with measuring to know with certainty what I'm doing. Are my results better? I like to think so, or at least it's more likely that I'll be doing what I set out to and I'll know if things are not as I want them.
Redding describes the method of sizing for feel in their tech section onthe website. You could do that. I still prefer to measure.
I shoot a 300WM a great deal and I've not needed a Willis Collett sizer yet. I do use a Redding body die from time to time and that seems to get to the body as much as is needed.
I'm with the guys who suggest that you need headspace gauges of some sort. Without them you don't really know where you are. In fact, sizing to "kiss" the shellholder with the bottom of the die without a "cam over" may be increasing the headspace of the case - i.e. moving the datum line forward. I've experienced this first hand.
Take a look as you size a case and you may see that initial "kiss" of the shellholder change to a gap of a few thou when you are actually performing a sizing operation and take up the play on the threads etc. As you start sizing you squeeze the body smaller and the brass needs to go somewhere, so it initially increases headspace and, as you adjust the die lower, it will begin to decrease the headspace again. It would have saved me some time if someone told me this before. This is nowehere in die instructions. I was setting up Redding Comp Shellholders and it was confusing to see the headspace initially increase as I used the shellholders that would in theory decrease it.
Your current setting may in fact be increasing the headspace. In most circumstances a hard up to the shellholder setting will size more than is needed and can increase the chances of head separations and the case wall thinning in the web area as described. It all depends on your chamber, brass, dies and shellholder.
So, I'm with measuring to know with certainty what I'm doing. Are my results better? I like to think so, or at least it's more likely that I'll be doing what I set out to and I'll know if things are not as I want them.
Redding describes the method of sizing for feel in their tech section onthe website. You could do that. I still prefer to measure.
I shoot a 300WM a great deal and I've not needed a Willis Collett sizer yet. I do use a Redding body die from time to time and that seems to get to the body as much as is needed.
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