buckdeer
Active Member
does anyone have any experience with this cal. i really like the performance of 6.5 cals. and am thinking of building a 6.5 stw i already have a shilen stainless sporter barrel. thanks for all replies
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6.5 stw
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Jason Price
Member
I've got a very high quality 30" heavy taper 6.5 barrel in 8 twist myself and have considered chambering it in the stw class case just as you - I'm also having difficulty finding any useful info - A customer of mine did a .264 Thor awhile back which is a stw 35 degree improved, but he did it in a 26" barrel which I thought might have limited it's performance - If you do a search out here in internet land on ".264 Thor" you will find a few bits of info, but still not very much - I personally feel that if you don't use at least a 30" tube you're not gaining anything - Considering the excellent BC's of the 6.5 bullets, surely somebody out there somewhere has done an extreme velocity .264 project and can provide much more useful info - JP
chris matthews
Well-Known Member
Myself and a few others are burning up barrels with a 6.5 WSM. That's kinda the way I would lean to get away from a belted case. 6.5 WSSM, 6.5-284 or the WSM will get the job done.
For what it's worth- H1000 64grs, 141 gr Cauterucio at 3150 fps in a 26" tube. Biggest 5 shot group is 0.257" at 100 yds.
For what it's worth- H1000 64grs, 141 gr Cauterucio at 3150 fps in a 26" tube. Biggest 5 shot group is 0.257" at 100 yds.
G
Guest
Guest
from what I have found with several calibers including the 6.5 , the realy high BC bullets don't realy like to be pushed much faster than 3000-3200fps or the accuracy suffers , at least with the Berger and Hornady A-max bullets.
Why shoot 80+ gr of powder to get a lesser result than with 65gr ?
Personaly I'd rather give up a 200fps if it closed my groups by 25% , I think a slow hit is better than a fast miss as long as you slow hit has enough thump to offer a quick kill.
Thats why if it came to making a life of death shot at 800yds I'd be shooting my 308 rather than any of my other 30 mags.
Why shoot 80+ gr of powder to get a lesser result than with 65gr ?
Personaly I'd rather give up a 200fps if it closed my groups by 25% , I think a slow hit is better than a fast miss as long as you slow hit has enough thump to offer a quick kill.
Thats why if it came to making a life of death shot at 800yds I'd be shooting my 308 rather than any of my other 30 mags.
buckdeer
Active Member
thanks for the info guys, if i go with the stw if will not really be for any shots over 500 yrds, i just was thinking more along the line of a real deer thumper. i have a 264 win mag now and it sure does a number on deer i guess i figured more speed would do even better, as i don't like to chase deer after i shoot one. maybe just another 264 wm anyway thanks
I built a 6.5 STW and have some load data from Layne Simpson. With a 26" barrel and a 100 grain Nosler B. Tip moving 3850 fps. I am having Christensen Arms build me one with a 28" barrel and hoping to improve this a little. The average goes:
100 grain bullets - 3850 to 3950 fps
120/125 grain bullets - 3500 to 3600 fps
140 grain bullets - 3400 fps
This is all from my data and Layne Simpson's. Email me for questions. This is a definite fast mover and super accurate.
100 grain bullets - 3850 to 3950 fps
120/125 grain bullets - 3500 to 3600 fps
140 grain bullets - 3400 fps
This is all from my data and Layne Simpson's. Email me for questions. This is a definite fast mover and super accurate.
G
Guest
Guest
doc136,
If you don't mind me asking, what kind of consistant accuracy are you getting at those velocities?
Thanks for your time!
If you don't mind me asking, what kind of consistant accuracy are you getting at those velocities?
Thanks for your time!
I averaged .25" to .5" depending on bullet (100 yds from bench). For people to say that this isn't accurate is not true. Any gun or any caliber has the capability to be accurate. It is the variables that need to be adjusted to make it accurate. Many people argue that the 300 wim mag isn't accurate due to the belt and sloppy shoulder degree. But look how many matches it has won. It has proven to be accurate. Just some cartridges have a tendency to be more accurate than others.
On another note, I have heard many argue that the 6.5 mm is finicky or fouls easily. If you use top quality tools and equipment, I have found it to be no different than any of my other guns. The 6.5 may have a bad rap with a lot of people, but has served me well.
If building a 6.5 STW I would certainly use a long barrel to obtain top velocity. I would take the time and money and do things right. Like I said, I am building a 6.5 stw right now as we speak. I am going to use a McMillan stock, Remington 700 action, Kepplinger Single Set trigger and fully bed the action and barrel. Hope this helps. Godd Hunting!
On another note, I have heard many argue that the 6.5 mm is finicky or fouls easily. If you use top quality tools and equipment, I have found it to be no different than any of my other guns. The 6.5 may have a bad rap with a lot of people, but has served me well.
If building a 6.5 STW I would certainly use a long barrel to obtain top velocity. I would take the time and money and do things right. Like I said, I am building a 6.5 stw right now as we speak. I am going to use a McMillan stock, Remington 700 action, Kepplinger Single Set trigger and fully bed the action and barrel. Hope this helps. Godd Hunting!
buckdeer
Active Member
thanks doc it looks like your 6.5 stw is working fine for you. those 140's at 3400 should really hammer deer. what is your barrel twist and do you think 26 in is to short i want a sporter gun so any longer is kind of out of the question. thanks again
Buckdeer,
Any true magnum cartridge, the 6.5 stw included can always use the barrel length. However, not living in a perfect world, we all know that they still perform without the extra long barrel.
Here are my thoughts, and this is the brutal truth. The 6.5 stw is a great cartridge. With a 26" barrel, you should get the velocuty ranges that I stated earlier since that was formulated on a 26" barrel. In fact, Layne Simpson's data was from a 26" barrel as well. I would not go any less than 26". If you do, say to 24", you would be better off with a 264 win. mag. At this point, you would only be a couple hundred fps behind the 264 WM, but burning a significant amount of more powder.....making it inefficent.
One more point....take this as food for thought: The 6.5 stw has more energy at 200 yards with the 140 grain bullet than a 300 win mag with 150 grain does at 200 yards! This is according to Layne Simpon's article on the 6.5 stw. We can thank the nice B.C. that the 6.5 has to offer.
I have seen several people taking the 270 WSM and necking it down to 6.5mm. The load data that I have seen on this is not promising. Other than having the ability to use a short action and eliminating the belt, the 6.5 WSM has no more to offer than the 264 WM. Some of the load data that I have seen on the 6.5 WSM was slower than the 6.5-284. Burning more powder to go slower is mot my idea of a great cartridge. Layne Simpson has compared the 6.5 stw to other cartridges in his article. These being the 7mm stw and the 25 stw. Today, one could argue that the 7mm RUM may be a good contender. I would agree, but it has always been hard to turn away from the 6.5's great B.C. and penetration power.
Any true magnum cartridge, the 6.5 stw included can always use the barrel length. However, not living in a perfect world, we all know that they still perform without the extra long barrel.
Here are my thoughts, and this is the brutal truth. The 6.5 stw is a great cartridge. With a 26" barrel, you should get the velocuty ranges that I stated earlier since that was formulated on a 26" barrel. In fact, Layne Simpson's data was from a 26" barrel as well. I would not go any less than 26". If you do, say to 24", you would be better off with a 264 win. mag. At this point, you would only be a couple hundred fps behind the 264 WM, but burning a significant amount of more powder.....making it inefficent.
One more point....take this as food for thought: The 6.5 stw has more energy at 200 yards with the 140 grain bullet than a 300 win mag with 150 grain does at 200 yards! This is according to Layne Simpon's article on the 6.5 stw. We can thank the nice B.C. that the 6.5 has to offer.
I have seen several people taking the 270 WSM and necking it down to 6.5mm. The load data that I have seen on this is not promising. Other than having the ability to use a short action and eliminating the belt, the 6.5 WSM has no more to offer than the 264 WM. Some of the load data that I have seen on the 6.5 WSM was slower than the 6.5-284. Burning more powder to go slower is mot my idea of a great cartridge. Layne Simpson has compared the 6.5 stw to other cartridges in his article. These being the 7mm stw and the 25 stw. Today, one could argue that the 7mm RUM may be a good contender. I would agree, but it has always been hard to turn away from the 6.5's great B.C. and penetration power.
Steve Shelp
Well-Known Member
All,
I have quite a bit of experience with the 6.5-300 WWH (6.5-300 Weatherby) and a 6.5-300 Win Mag beltless. The 6.5 WWH is the original version of 6.5 STW by several decades. But the end results is that one has rounded shoulders and the other the standard angled shoulder. They are basically 1 for 1 comparison really. If I didn't already have access to a WWH reamer I would stay with the standard angled shoulders of the STW.
I've stood on my 6.5 WWH with 140gr Sierra MK and they have gone over 3500fps in a 30" barrel. But case life wasn't good. I could back off to 3300fps and shoot pretty decent on milkjugs well out past 1000yds. Is this case going to win a benchrest match.... no. But it has plenty of accuracy in it to shoot as far as you want with speed. The last time I fired my 6.5-300 WWH in competition I used exactly (80) 1/4MOA clicks to get on target. That is 20 MOA up from a 100yd zero at 1500ft elevation. It doesn't get much flatter than that when shooting 1K yds.
Yes barrel wear isn't as good as a 260 Rem, but I've shot up more than 1 barrel and the stories about barrels being going in less than 500 rounds... well I would question the experience of the shooter making that claim if he has ever used one of these speed demons. As a matter of fact my current 6.5 WWH barrel is so "shot out" that the throat (which originally I could seat a 140gr SMK into the lands) is so far gone that I can put a 155gr SMK on top of the case, chamber the round, pull the case and the 155 will fall off the mouth of the case becuase it didn't get pushed back at all. But the last time I shot this rifle was a night before a competition at the NC 1000yd range and was shooting at the clay pigeons on the bank. Didn't hit any, but if a deer was standing in place of the pigeon they would've been lung hits. So it still shoots ok even with the throat that far gone. I'm not saying they will all do that, but this one does. I do not have good barrel life records of these barrels though. I was younger and to anxious to shoot rather than keep good records like I do now.
These calibers are fun to play with, but if your looking for top-notch accuracy go with something less. If your looking for speed and a good LR hunting caliber, it has been working in the field for many many years. It's all in what you are looking for.
If there are specific questions i can help you with let me know.
Steve
I have quite a bit of experience with the 6.5-300 WWH (6.5-300 Weatherby) and a 6.5-300 Win Mag beltless. The 6.5 WWH is the original version of 6.5 STW by several decades. But the end results is that one has rounded shoulders and the other the standard angled shoulder. They are basically 1 for 1 comparison really. If I didn't already have access to a WWH reamer I would stay with the standard angled shoulders of the STW.
I've stood on my 6.5 WWH with 140gr Sierra MK and they have gone over 3500fps in a 30" barrel. But case life wasn't good. I could back off to 3300fps and shoot pretty decent on milkjugs well out past 1000yds. Is this case going to win a benchrest match.... no. But it has plenty of accuracy in it to shoot as far as you want with speed. The last time I fired my 6.5-300 WWH in competition I used exactly (80) 1/4MOA clicks to get on target. That is 20 MOA up from a 100yd zero at 1500ft elevation. It doesn't get much flatter than that when shooting 1K yds.
Yes barrel wear isn't as good as a 260 Rem, but I've shot up more than 1 barrel and the stories about barrels being going in less than 500 rounds... well I would question the experience of the shooter making that claim if he has ever used one of these speed demons. As a matter of fact my current 6.5 WWH barrel is so "shot out" that the throat (which originally I could seat a 140gr SMK into the lands) is so far gone that I can put a 155gr SMK on top of the case, chamber the round, pull the case and the 155 will fall off the mouth of the case becuase it didn't get pushed back at all. But the last time I shot this rifle was a night before a competition at the NC 1000yd range and was shooting at the clay pigeons on the bank. Didn't hit any, but if a deer was standing in place of the pigeon they would've been lung hits. So it still shoots ok even with the throat that far gone. I'm not saying they will all do that, but this one does. I do not have good barrel life records of these barrels though. I was younger and to anxious to shoot rather than keep good records like I do now.
These calibers are fun to play with, but if your looking for top-notch accuracy go with something less. If your looking for speed and a good LR hunting caliber, it has been working in the field for many many years. It's all in what you are looking for.
If there are specific questions i can help you with let me know.
Steve
Oh yeah, the other half of the question.....I would use the 1:8" or 1:9" depending on which weight bullets you want to shoot. One could even go to 1:10" if they really wanted to. I have seen some load data on this one guy who built a 6.5 stw for the 100 grain bullets only. He used 1:14". He shot some 107 Match Kings and they key holed. 1:14" is probably not fast enough for most of us. I would probably stick with the 1:10" and faster. If you want to be able to shoot the 160 grain bullets, maybe 1:8" might be more ideal. The load data that I stated was with a twist of 1:9". Hope this clears up some questions. If you need specific load data help, let me know!
buckdeer
Active Member
thanks again guys and yes you both cleared up some questions, i think i will build the stw as i already have one 264 wm and don't see the use of two of the same. lol thanks
