The title says it a lot on this particular thread. Now I spoke to a gentlemen that had said the win mag is harder for a smith to get shooting excellent due to the belted case, and that the WSM can produce the same speeds if not better and will be easy for a smith to get shooting excellent. I always read posts on people hunting and shooting a win mag at extended ranges and pushing 210-215 Bergers at 2800 to almost 3000. But never see much hunting done with a 300. WSM or velocities. What's your preference and the guys shooting the wsm, what kind of speeds are you getting with the 210-230?
300. WSM vs 300. Win mag
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Broz
Well-Known Member
I will say that the 300 win mag has been the easiest rifle to load for I have owned.
My load with 210 Bergers was 2995 fps.
My load with 215 Bergers is 3035 and I have seen 3050 fps.
My sons 300 win mag shot the 210's at 2916 fps and had more room for speed but this was the accuracy node.
His 300 win now sends the 230 Bergers at 2775 fps.
All these velocities are at 4000' ASL and from an Oehler 35 , so no internet hype here.
All above loads were easy to work up and all will shoot 1/2 moa at 1000 yards.
The 300 WSM's I have worked with I could not get as much velocity. They shot well but accuracy loads were slower than the 300 win.
I like the brass offered for the 300 win better too.
This is why we shoot the 300 win over the 300 WSM.
Jeff
My load with 210 Bergers was 2995 fps.
My load with 215 Bergers is 3035 and I have seen 3050 fps.
My sons 300 win mag shot the 210's at 2916 fps and had more room for speed but this was the accuracy node.
His 300 win now sends the 230 Bergers at 2775 fps.
All these velocities are at 4000' ASL and from an Oehler 35 , so no internet hype here.
All above loads were easy to work up and all will shoot 1/2 moa at 1000 yards.
The 300 WSM's I have worked with I could not get as much velocity. They shot well but accuracy loads were slower than the 300 win.
I like the brass offered for the 300 win better too.
This is why we shoot the 300 win over the 300 WSM.
Jeff
matt_3479
Well-Known Member
Hey jeff, your always one to have great answers, couple more questions for you
Out of the 210 and 215 did you prefer one over the other for actual hunting as well as target. I know you have tried both but I don't remember reading you actually preferring one over the other? Did you try the 230 as well.
Now your son tried all three as well. I thought I remember reading he is currently usin and sticking with the 230 but I could be wrong. I have seen your beautiful rifle 100 times and love it more I see it, but your son's I haven't seen yet I don't think. What is his specs in his rifle, and pic if you have one readily available
Born2kill;
I was also debating between these two cartridges a couple years ago due to the fact I shoot a wsm now factory but going build a 300. Win mag and decided that just from all the info from this site.
Out of the 210 and 215 did you prefer one over the other for actual hunting as well as target. I know you have tried both but I don't remember reading you actually preferring one over the other? Did you try the 230 as well.
Now your son tried all three as well. I thought I remember reading he is currently usin and sticking with the 230 but I could be wrong. I have seen your beautiful rifle 100 times and love it more I see it, but your son's I haven't seen yet I don't think. What is his specs in his rifle, and pic if you have one readily available
Born2kill;
I was also debating between these two cartridges a couple years ago due to the fact I shoot a wsm now factory but going build a 300. Win mag and decided that just from all the info from this site.
shortgrass
Well-Known Member
Accuracy potential between the .300WM and the .300WSM? Now there's some of the internet 'hype'! The .300WM will out run the other every time.
Broz
Well-Known Member
"Hey jeff, your always one to have great answers, couple more questions for you
Out of the 210 and 215 did you prefer one over the other for actual hunting as well as target. I know you have tried both but I don't remember reading you actually preferring one over the other? Did you try the 230 as well."
I am shooting the 215's now but like both the 210 and 215. I prefer the 215 only because of the fact it has less drift and shoots a little faster and is tighter grouped at long distances, probably due to less drift. I have never shot the 230's in my 300 win. But have been with my son for many kills with his.
"Now your son tried all three as well. I thought I remember reading he is currently usin and sticking with the 230 but I could be wrong. I have seen your beautiful rifle 100 times and love it more I see it, but your son's I haven't seen yet I don't think. What is his specs in his rifle, and pic if you have one readily available"
My son has shot the 210's and 230 OTM's. But may be changing to the 215's at some point, time will tell there.
His rifle is off a trued 700 Rem in an A-5 stock with a heavy Broughton 5C 28" tube. It drives tacks.
Out of the 210 and 215 did you prefer one over the other for actual hunting as well as target. I know you have tried both but I don't remember reading you actually preferring one over the other? Did you try the 230 as well."
I am shooting the 215's now but like both the 210 and 215. I prefer the 215 only because of the fact it has less drift and shoots a little faster and is tighter grouped at long distances, probably due to less drift. I have never shot the 230's in my 300 win. But have been with my son for many kills with his.
"Now your son tried all three as well. I thought I remember reading he is currently usin and sticking with the 230 but I could be wrong. I have seen your beautiful rifle 100 times and love it more I see it, but your son's I haven't seen yet I don't think. What is his specs in his rifle, and pic if you have one readily available"
My son has shot the 210's and 230 OTM's. But may be changing to the 215's at some point, time will tell there.
His rifle is off a trued 700 Rem in an A-5 stock with a heavy Broughton 5C 28" tube. It drives tacks.
matt_3479
Well-Known Member
That's good to know, migh have too look into the picking some 215's up later to try
lloydsmale
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Ive been shooting my 300 win and 300wsm all summer working up loads. Heres my findings. Accuracy wize there neck and neck. Id guess it would come down to individual rifles more then any differnce between the case design. Brass life seems a bit better with the win mag. For a velocity comparison I approached it like this. I loaded both with 4350 and eased up till i got pressure signs with both then backed off one full grain and used the same 150 and 165 grain bullets. My wsm is an abolt with a 22 inch barrel and my win is a 700 with a 24. Yes the wsm has a shorter barrel but like was pointed out to me on here beacause it is a shorter round the chamber would not be so deap in the barrel as compared to the win mag so about an inch of that 2 inch differnce is washed. Loaded like that my win mag was only about 50fps faster. So my guess is if i would have added that inch of barrel they would have been about identical. Posslibly with heavier bullets the win mag would shine a bit more but shooting 150s and 165s you could about flip a coin. By the way I had my 24 in barreled 300 H&H in there to in this comparision. It ran about 50 fps slower then the wsm did. Even these results are hardy wrote in stone as just grabbing a differnt gun of the shelf when you purchase could be 50 fps faster or slower then the one you picked. Where the wsm shines for me is that that little abolt weights about a full pound less then either of the others and its shorter and handier if a guy had to carry it around all day. Compact and as handy as any 243 sporter weight gun and still carrys the load. Out of the 3 my favorite is probably the 300 H&H. Why? For no other reason then i like rem classics and theres a bit of cool factor to the H&H.
varmintH8R
Well-Known Member
I tend to agree with Lloydsmale. I have a 300WSM that I like, but I think the 300WM is the way to go if you are looking at >180gr bullet weights. This is especially true if you are building/buying the WSM on a short action, as you will be more constrained on OAL and magazine length.
If I had it to do over I would go 300WM.
If I had it to do over I would go 300WM.
MontanaRifleman
Well-Known Member
On velocity and weight of bullets, this is my experience with a 300 WSM. With H4350 I can push 180 (E-Tip) bullets about 3000. With RL17 I can push them about 3400. I can push 210 Bergers about 2935. This is out of a 24 3/8ths Sako barrel. I was shooting my WSM once and the gut next to me was shooting his WM. He wanted me to chrono his load which was a 180 bullet and RL22 so he asked me to shoot a couple over my Prochrono. The velocity of his load from a 26" barrel was identical to my load from a 24 3/8 barrel, 3400 fps. As pointed out, the chamber of of the WSM is shorter than the WM by almost exactly .5", so the actual difference in bore was about 1".
With RL17, the 300 WSM becomes the equivalent of the 300 WM. I haven't heard of many using RL17 in the WM, but I'm guessing it would give higher velocities. With the standard powders, the WM is going to get about 100 fps or so more velocity than the WSM.
As for accuracy, my rifle is a Sako lemon and wont shoot anything well. But I don't believe there is any inherent difference in accuracy between the two cartridges and is much more dependent on barrel and rifle. Both cartridges have been used successfully in BR.
I personally don't care for belted cases because there is no reason to have a belt (unless for head spacing in the 375 H&H) and I like a clean case wall.
I think the 300 WSM is a fine cartridge and if you use a good barrel and smith you would have a fine fine shooting rifle for all around big game hunting in NA. Same could be said for the WM. Take your pick.
With RL17, the 300 WSM becomes the equivalent of the 300 WM. I haven't heard of many using RL17 in the WM, but I'm guessing it would give higher velocities. With the standard powders, the WM is going to get about 100 fps or so more velocity than the WSM.
As for accuracy, my rifle is a Sako lemon and wont shoot anything well. But I don't believe there is any inherent difference in accuracy between the two cartridges and is much more dependent on barrel and rifle. Both cartridges have been used successfully in BR.
I personally don't care for belted cases because there is no reason to have a belt (unless for head spacing in the 375 H&H) and I like a clean case wall.
I think the 300 WSM is a fine cartridge and if you use a good barrel and smith you would have a fine fine shooting rifle for all around big game hunting in NA. Same could be said for the WM. Take your pick.
Lefty7mmstw
Well-Known Member
Horse a piece- buy/ build the rifle you want and don't look back. All standard 30 mags are good accuracy and within 100 fps of each other in the same rifle barrel length.
D
Deleted member 46119
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And anyone who says otherwise is full if hooey.
Though the 300RUM is a bit faster than the 300WSM. I have one belted magnum and that's enough.
Get what turns you on.
If I had to do it over I'd still go with a 300WSM on a long action instead of short.
lloydsmale
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yup i have to agree. Between the h&h. wsm and the win its a matter of personal prefernce as what one will do so will the others. The ultra though will give an honest 2-300 fps more and is in a differnt league.
Lefty7mmstw
Well-Known Member
The 300 rum and 30-378 roy rounds really aren't standard mag rounds imo. They utilize a full length action, freebore, and quite a bit more case capacity than the h@h and the standard action chamberings. The 300 roy is sort of a bridge round as I don't know if it really lands in either camp. Good round though; just never needed to spend 2-3x as much for the same brass so I never went roy.
There are many 300 wsm in the 1000 bench game. My friends up here make there own off a 270wsm case and shoot great with them.Bud just built a new heavy this year and is grouping good. He told me the guy from Penn. has the small group world record right now with the 300wsm. He is gunning for him.
