300 wetherby mag

[101sniper]

gun)I seem to be haveing some problems with only a few rounds out of say 30 rounds that I load. When I fire the rounds that I load two to four dont fire I pull them apart and it seems that the primer has gone off. but no powder burn at all. I did find that the powder that came out was a little discolored looked greenish. not all all of it just some. Useing IMR 4350, CCI primers, and berger 168g bullets. The rounds only sat around for a couple of weeks before being fire. Thinking air may be getting in some who. Any help would great thanks.

 

[goose]

Could there have been sizing lube, water, or tumbling media in the case or somehow contaminating the primers? Could the powder have been contaminated? I would maybe call the service line for the powder maker and the primer maker, they should have some ideas......maybe there are some bad lots out there.

 

[Kevin Thomas]

I'm with Goose here, sounds like you've got a contamination problem there somewhere. Even the most inadequate of LR primers should still be giving you ignition in your 300 Wby. Some possible things to check here; media stuck in the flash hole? Any left over lube getting into the primer pocket? Primers contaminated by lube elsewhere, like on the bench or in the primer tray? Common warnings about oils from your hands being transferred to the primer during handling and subsequently killing the primer are overstated, and they're really pretty hard to "kill". But there's something in the proces that's reducing their effectivness. How about improperly stored powder that is or has been damaged by contact with something that is degrading it in some manner?

You might also check headspace and how your sizing die is set up. The belt should obviate some of this, but you'll be better off if you treat this one as a normal, rimless case rather than as a belted design. Headspace it off the shoulder. While this should help ignition, I doubt it's the cause of your problem here.

By the way, noticing your moniker here, who were you with?

Kevin Thomas
Lapua USA
Co C, 1/506 Inf, '77-'81

 

[Trickymissfit]

My guess would be contamination inside the case itself. I'd give the failed cases (after breaking them down) a really good cleaning. Then I'd lay them out all night with a light bulb close enough to get them warm but not hot. Also check the flash holes for blockage as you said the primers went off. Big Weatherby mags like real dense loads of slow burning powder for good ignition. I'll be honest with you in that I never reallized there was a load using 4350 with the .300! I've found that you just can't get enough primer in those big cases, and I like the Federal mag primer. Also remember to stay at a near max load with these big cases, as they don't act nice with lighter loads.
gary

 

[101sniper]

I served with the 101st Air Borne 1/327 Sniper Recon INF DIV. The speer manual has a load 70g min 74g max loading 72g for mine. I am currently using the same eight pound keg for my custom 300 win mag and have had no problems. Even pulled a round from a lot that a made up this past spring of the 300win mag and the powder had the same shine that it does out of the keg. I am wondering if it might be the bullets the berger VLD bullets have to be seated really deep to match the book recomended 3.560" OAL maybe a few of the cases are not sealing tight around the bullet allowing air to get in. The cases used are once fired factory and have not been tumbled and I only neck size the case, since they are only fired out the the one rifle.
thanks for the help guys if you have anything else it would be great.



101sniper

 

[malcarjeb]

I think your problem might be the same i had before on a 30-06. I was using cci standard rifle primer and a youth load that only filled the case about 60-65% and It would not fire all the time. Had been using rem. primers with no problem and since have good back to remington primes and no problems at all. I think the standard cci doesnt have enough spark for a low fill case. 70gr of IMR 4350 would be about the same case fill I had. I found this to be worst if the case was tilled toward the bullet end and leaves an air gap on the primer end. Try a hotter primer and or more powder. hope this helps

 

[Trickymissfit]

I served with the 101st Air Borne 1/327 Sniper Recon INF DIV. The speer manual has a load 70g min 74g max loading 72g for mine. I am currently using the same eight pound keg for my custom 300 win mag and have had no problems. Even pulled a round from a lot that a made up this past spring of the 300win mag and the powder had the same shine that it does out of the keg. I am wondering if it might be the bullets the berger VLD bullets have to be seated really deep to match the book recomended 3.560" OAL maybe a few of the cases are not sealing tight around the bullet allowing air to get in. The cases used are once fired factory and have not been tumbled and I only neck size the case, since they are only fired out the the one rifle.
thanks for the help guys if you have anything else it would be great.



101sniper

I never said the load was a bad load, but I really was unaware that they had loads using 4350. I'm now thinking you may have some bad primers. I've bought a lot or two of primers in the past that had a few primers that were weak, and even a few duds mixed in there. I once bought a few hundred primers (CCI small primers) to use in my .222. Ignition was all over the place, and about one in five was a dud. Yet if you struck that primer two or three times the round might go off. I rebuilt the trigger and firing pin assembly twice with new parts; only to get the same results. Tried them in my .223, and got the same results with different powder combos. It ended up being a bad lot of primers. I think I'd call Hogdon (they now own IMR) and ask them for their opinion. Lastly have you ever tried IMR7828? I use that and RL22 and RL 25 in my Weatherbys.
gary

 

[Trickymissfit]

I think your problem might be the same i had before on a 30-06. I was using cci standard rifle primer and a youth load that only filled the case about 60-65% and It would not fire all the time. Had been using rem. primers with no problem and since have good back to remington primes and no problems at all. I think the standard cci doesnt have enough spark for a low fill case. 70gr of IMR 4350 would be about the same case fill I had. I found this to be worst if the case was tilled toward the bullet end and leaves an air gap on the primer end. Try a hotter primer and or more powder. hope this helps

I wonder if you could add a filler between the powder and the bullet (like cream of wheat) and make it work?
gary

 

[Kevin Thomas]

Guys, if you're only loading a 60% load density with 4350, you'r headed for some real serious problems far worse than misfires or hangfires. IMR or H4350, or any of several other slow burning powders like them don't react well to reduced loads (poor load density) and can be dangerous in such applications.

Aside from that, there's something else that's causing the misfires here. I'm still leaning towards case or powder contamination.

Kevin Thomas
Lapua USA

 

[101sniper]

I might agree with the primer idea but i have used the remaining primers in three diffrent rifles and have have no problems. and the primers that were pulled out of the cases that didn't fire were spent.The 72grs. of 4350 fills the case nicely max is 74g. I really dont think that there would be room for the primer spark to jump the powder charge. I am more inclined to think powder contamination also but i dont know how. Same powder used in two diffrent weapons, same primers used in three diffrent weapons, same reloading steps used in all my reloading. In the rounds that failed to fire the powder is discolored and clumped together. Again I would agree that it is powder contamination but not sure how. I think I will try some mag primers and some powder that Trickymissfit recomended. Thanks again fellas and if anyone has anything else please let me know.



101sniper

 

[malcarjeb]

I might agree with the primer idea but i have used the remaining primers in three diffrent rifles and have have no problems. and the primers that were pulled out of the cases that didn't fire were spent.The 72grs. of 4350 fills the case nicely max is 74g. I really dont think that there would be room for the primer spark to jump the powder charge. I am more inclined to think powder contamination also but i dont know how. Same powder used in two diffrent weapons, same primers used in three diffrent weapons, same reloading steps used in all my reloading. In the rounds that failed to fire the powder is discolored and clumped together. Again I would agree that it is powder contamination but not sure how. I think I will try some mag primers and some powder that Trickymissfit recomended. Thanks again fellas and if anyone has anything else please let me know.



101sniper

My powder looked just like yours. the powder i was useing was imr 4895. TRY the same load with a hotter primer and I bet it takes care of your problem!!

 

[Danny1788]

i bought my wby new and shot maybe 60rounds of factory loaded barnes through it. when i started loading for my 300wby i was running 78gr imr4350 with 168gr ttsx with no pressure signs at all it was chrony at 3140fps. now after i had about i would say 125rounds down the tube i was getting still moa at 100yrds but not as tight as befor i just left it as barrel breaking in. so i switched to imr7828 and use 84gr imr7828 and 168gr ttsx and shoot 5shot groups at .473 and under depending on me hahah. i havent chrony this load yet but its close to 3200fps im guessing. so i dont know what was max load in your wby but i took these loads striat out of the barnes books and they are working great for me! just to throw my $.02 in hope this helps try upping your powder. o i always used fed215GM primers too

 

[ANARCHIST]

I wonder if you could add a filler between the powder and the bullet (like cream of wheat) and make it work?
gary

I am with the general opinion, you have bad primers from whatever reason or headspace issues, tend to think PRIMER issues.

I have been using 7828 exclusively in the 300wby 84.5 grns 165 Sierra Game King 215 primers - had a few that dumped 100% in whitetails w/o exiting at about 100yds - load is fine in 2 MKV & a Win70

You need be careful trying to make light loads using slow powders.