Why am I splitting necks?

[Creedmoor shooter]

Since the hornady brass is lasting and the other isn't, the guys are probably right about the neck thickness

I'm thinking the same thing. I thought that norma brass was just junk but then it happens again with another brand of brass so its definitely something with my setup. It didnt really bother me to have this ADG brass go as the pockets had already loosened up significantly. I'll be ordering some Peterson brass this week.

 

[Creedmoor shooter]

So I'm going to order a Redding type s full length bushing resize die tonight after I get some measurements. What neck tension should I be running or what would you guys recommend?

 

[wboregon]

If you have a loaded round in the brass you plan on continuing with, just measure the neck diameter of the loaded round and shoot for .002-.003 smaller for the bushing. or you can measure the thickness of the brass at the neck with a micrometer times it by 2 and add the bullet diameter then again shoot .002-.003.

.002-.003 seems to be enough tension for me, especially if I'm seating something like a Nosler ABLR as the jackets start to indent while seating with much more neck tension than that. you can run .003-.004 with thick jacket target bullet and have no issue though, and you might want to play around with it and see what you like

 

[Creedmoor shooter]

If you have a loaded round in the brass you plan on continuing with, just measure the neck diameter of the loaded round and shoot for .002-.003 smaller for the bushing. or you can measure the thickness of the brass at the neck with a micrometer times it by 2 and add the bullet diameter then again shoot .002-.003.

.002-.003 seems to be enough tension for me, especially if I'm seating something like a Nosler ABLR as the jackets start to indent while seating with much more neck tension than that. you can run .003-.004 with thick jacket target bullet and have no issue though, and you might want to play around with it and see what you like

Yeah after I posted that question I realized I may have to wait. I'm changing from ADG and going to Peterson as I was not happy with the primer pockets on the ADG brass. I'll have to wait to get some peterson brass in then go from there. I'm still going to get some measurements for you guys because I'm just down right curious now.

 

[Canhunter35]

Do you mind me asking, if you've had 8 loading with your hornady brass why change? Is ur es too large?

 

[Creedmoor shooter]

Do you mind me asking, if you've had 8 loading with your hornady brass why change? Is ur es too large?

I would sometimes get strange flyers. They seemed to go away when I switched to nicer brass and my es and sd seemed to tighten up.

 

[Saracen]

So I'm having issues splitting necks after 3-4 firings. I had this happen with norma brass after 3 firings and now with ADG after 4 firings annealing every reload. There must be an issue somewhere with it happening with 2 brands of brass. Loads are not hot. Outside diameter of the neck on the fired rounds is .395. This is a 6.5 creedmoor built on a savage action with a criterion barrel. I've read it could be a dirty die, which is possible as I haven't cleaned it in a long time

First thing I'd do is consider the state of the dies, then quality of the brass - who made it?
Annealing cases every time you size should be considered a prerequisite too.

 

[Bucknut]

What is your annealing process. If you're annealing different brands of brass in the flame for the same amount of time, and the neck thickness is different, it could easily be your culprit. The time in the flame might be adequate for the hornady brass, but if it's not quite enough for a brand with a thicker neck wall, it will become work hardened and split. Brass doesn't gradually become softer with time in the flame. It has to hit a certain temperature before it softens up at all.... just an idea.

 

[Creedmoor shooter]

What is your annealing process. If you're annealing different brands of brass in the flame for the same amount of time, and the neck thickness is different, it could easily be your culprit. The time in the flame might be adequate for the hornady brass, but if it's not quite enough for a brand with a thicker neck wall, it will become work hardened and split. Brass doesn't gradually become softer with time in the flame. It has to hit a certain temperature before it softens up at all.... just an idea.

Your all gonna laugh at this..... I just use a hand torch and spin the cases in a drill with a deep socket. I cant afford a annealing machine at this point in time. I just heat it until I get a ring around the neck/shoulder junction(which is about 5-6seconds under the flame). Regardless if I'm doing the annealing right, I should hope the brass would go past 3-4 firings without annealing.

 

[Bucknut]

No laughing here. I do the exact same. There are several variables that dicatate time in flame (elevation, specific torch, neck wall thickness, etc.) .... but if I had to guess, based on my own experience, you're not heating your brass enough to do you any good. (I have to run my Norma 7 SAUM Brass, sized and turned for a 6.5 gap for about 15 sec. I use a metronome app on my phone at 60 beats per second).... I get over 15 loads on my Norma brass this way, with phenomenal accuracy.

There are two ways to figure out what is an adequate amount of time in the flame.

A: 750* tempilaq on the INSIDE of the neck

B: anneal a couple in a dark room. Keep the neck in the flame until the neck just barely begins to give a hint of glowing red/orange.

If you're not adequately annealing, AND your dies are overworking the brass, you could easily see split necks in 3-4 firings. IMO

If nothing else, trying this is cheaper than a new set of dies. Good luck, keep us posted on what you find.

 

[Chuck32571]

Sounds like your annealing practice is the source of the problem. I use the Annealing Made Perfect machine and no two brands of brass use the same heat settings. Since I went to that method I haven't had a single case neck problem. Also be sure to chamfer the inside case necks before seating the bullet since this will ease the initial force on the neck.

 

[Creedmoor shooter]

No laughing here. I do the exact same. There are several variables that dicatate time in flame (elevation, specific torch, neck wall thickness, etc.) .... but if I had to guess, based on my own experience, you're not heating your brass enough to do you any good. (I have to run my Norma 7 SAUM Brass, sized and turned for a 6.5 gap for about 15 sec. I use a metronome app on my phone at 60 beats per second).... I get over 15 loads on my Norma brass this way, with phenomenal accuracy.

There are two ways to figure out what is an adequate amount of time in the flame.

A: 750* tempilaq on the INSIDE of the neck

B: anneal a couple in a dark room. Keep the neck in the flame until the neck just barely begins to give a hint of glowing red/orange.

If you're not adequately annealing, AND your dies are overworking the brass, you could easily see split necks in 3-4 firings. IMO

If nothing else, trying this is cheaper than a new set of dies. Good luck, keep us posted on what you find.

I was planning on a new sizer die anyway. This just gives me an excuse to get a bushing die that I've been wanting to get. I'm planning on ordering tempilaq when I order my new bushing die. I'll try the dark room method tonight as well just for giggles and get some measurements on my brass.

 

[CatShooter]

You should not be getting head separations or neck splits. Dirty die necks cannot cause these (or any other) problems.

When annealing, heat the necks to a dark red for 3 to 4 seconds... that will insure that you are getting a proper and uniform anneal - you cannot "over anneal" cases with propane and air. Don't waste your money (or time) with templaq, it will do nothing for you.

Get a Redding Bushing "S" neck sizer, and a bushing that is ~3 thou smaller than the loaded neck diameter... and don't use the expander.

These changes will stop both of your problems.

(P-51B, Cadillac of the skies)

 

[Creedmoor shooter]

You should not be getting head separations or neck splits. Dirty die necks cannot cause these (or any other) problems.

When annealing, heat the necks to a dark red for 3 to 4 seconds... that will insure that you are getting a proper and uniform anneal - you cannot "over anneal" cases with propane and air. Don't waste your money (or time) with templaq, it will do nothing for you.

Get a Redding Bushing "S" neck sizer, and a bushing that is ~3 thou smaller than the loaded neck diameter... and don't use the expander.

These changes will stop both of your problems.

(P-51B, Cadillac of the skies)

I'm ordering the Redding type s full length sizer bushing die tonight. I prefer to shoulder bump than neck size. I do a .002 shoulder bump. I neck sized for awhile with good success. I just dont like to fight to get a round in the chamber or have to run it through a FL sizing die every few firings as that breaks up my consistency.