What constitutes “long range hunting”?

[slsak]

Another question for everyone; when does the quarry come into play? A longrange shot on something small like a javelina can be a lot closer than a longrange shot on an elk. I mean the size of the elk's vital zone is almost the same size as the whole body of a javelina. Now, taking long shots on javelin is at least a little unnecessary as they're pretty easy to get close to, but the question still remains.

True, but then again I have never __Needed__ to shoot a groundhog or prairie dog with more than a .22 or from more than a hundred feet. Most hunting can be done at sticks feathers and string distances.

Justified confidence in skill, knowledge of game, is what makes LRH ethical.

 

[Teri Anne]

Comparing a ground hog to an Elk is not exactly apples to apples with one exception, and this theory kind of makes my thoughts on how far to shoot ethically. I concur that shooting ground hogs, which I have much experience in the past couple of years was all done with my Tikka T1x, longest shot being a little over 100 yards. The Tikka is sub MOA at an average of 0.6 MOA so at that range unless I muffed the shot the groundhog pretty much didn't have a chance. I don't know how many I ended up shooting, but they were all 1 shot 1 groundhog. Now let's convert this to Elk. I would guess, and please note that this is a guess and not worth arguing about that the target area of an Elk is around a foot in diameter. My Tikka T3x .270 is the most accurate big game rifle that I have with an average MOA using Federal Premium 140 gr ammo with a 0.5 MOA average. Just using the .5 MOA vs the kill area one would say that one should be able to hit that magical 12 inch spot out to 2000 yards...If the .270 could reach out that far and there were no other factors that affected bullet flight. We all know this is not the case and goes against my thoughts on the max range that one should shoot at a given size animal. In real life over a real field on a warm day with some mirage and a bit of a cross wind, (about 5 mph) the same .270 shoots an average 2.75 group at 300 yards (the longest range I have had the opportunity to shoot it at thus far.) Zeroed for 200 yards with a dead on hold the group landed 4 inches low and 3 inches left at 300 yards, pretty consistent for its zero still says good out to 1000 yards. Some might take that shot but for me, and only me I would try to get within 400 yards max and much preferred at 300. In conclusion, shoot long range but shoot a rifle that is capable of dropping each and every round into the breadbasket under the actual conditions you are shooting at. Your rifle, your animal, your range and conditions with you shooting. Good Luck and Good Hunting.

 

[brant89]

Well I for one don't particularly care for the man/woman comparison but since i am definitely in the minority here it probably won't matter to anyone. I have shot long range, between 600 and 1000 yards. All of my shots at those distances have been at paper since I do not subscribe to shooting at animals (other than prairie dogs and vermin) at that range. I know my capabilities as well as my rifle/load's probably as well and maybe better than anyone on this site. I also know that the 1 MOA rifle under perfect circumstances which seldom present themselves when hunting at 500 yards means a perfect shot is only likely to hit within 5 inches of where the rifle was aimed when it discharged, hopefully the aiming point and all of the other things in-between worked out to make the bullet hit where you were pointing, but that seldom happen either. As ranges increases so does the errors. at 700 yards the perfect shot means that the bullet will hit within 7 inches, and at 1000 yards the bullet will hit within 10 inches of where you were aiming when the rifle sent it's message of death when the round broke, barring any atmospheric abnormalities in between. I hear a lot of people bragging about their magnificent shots when trying to execute animals at long range, but my question is, How many of those magnificent shots were first round hits at those ranges? Can anybody here actually claim to have a one shot kill at any range beyond 500 yards? If so please let me know and fill me in on the circumstances. As once said in a nationwide news rag, "Inquiring minds want to know."

1 MOA at 500 yards means your bullet will impact within 2.5 inches of POA under perfect conditions, not 5 inches as you have stated. Pretty basic LR math for a such a self proclaimed expert who is more proficient than pretty much everyone else on this site... Just because you can't make first round, one shot kills past 500yd doesn't mean nobody else can.

Here are a some of my one shot kills (over 300 yards) with details, as you requested. Groundhogs: 302, 305, 356, 420, 540, 705, 714, antelope: 336 (heart), 367 (CNS), 567 (double lung), deer: 485 (double lung), 552 (CNS). All groundhogs were in basically ideal conditions with light wind. The two shorter range antelope were pure crosswinds gusting from 8-12mph, the longer antelope was a half value crosswind gusting from 6-8mph, the deer were both 1-2mph pure crosswinds. This list doesn't include the HUNDREDS of first round impacts on steel out to 950 yards that would have been well within a deer's vitals, often in much worse shooting conditions than I would be comfortable with in the field.

I included groundhogs because they are a MUCH smaller target than a deer or elk.

You regularly chime in on here questioning the morals and ethics of pretty much everyone on this site. I think you need to check your pride/ego at the door and accept the fact that you either have much less LR experience than many of the members here or you are simply not a very good shooter. Your self proclaimed 2.75 inch group that landed 4 inches low and three inches left at 300 yards suggests both are probably true. In regard to shooting longer than most of us has been alive I will say this, don't confuse experience with proficiency. I would wager that most of the top shooters in the world are quite a bit younger than you.

 

[cabelasken]

On a flight to Alaska for work, I sat next to a fellow that published long range (800+ yd) kill shots for high end rifle and optic manufacturers. He said they needed two more videos to fill out the 10 desired episodes. He asked about my rifles (Brown Precision) and scopes (leupold, Zeiss) and my longest shots. I told him my longest to date was about 450 Yds - a bull elk and a couple of bucks. He was surprised that I didn't take longer shots and I just replied that I wasn't comfortable beyond 450 under field conditions. I then asked him how many shots they needed to take in order to obtain their 10 one shot long range kills and he didn't answer me. In fact we didn't speak another word the rest of the trip. I know my Brown Precision rifles are capable of 5 shot 1/2" groups and less, but under field conditions at 8000 ft altitude after a mile hike I am not. But given an opportunity at 450 yds or less I stand a very good chance that I will fill the freezer after a single shot. And practicing at 5, 600 yds and further only reinforces those odds. At my age, I don't want to chase wounded animals up or down a canyon as I've found they nearly always try to escape away from your truck. I want the animal to drop where they stand. So, I guess I'm not a long range hunter by definition, but at least on this forum I can learn and get pointers from the best of the best.

 

[Len Backus]

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