What are the signs of erector failure in a scope?

DNADave

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jun 18, 2019
Messages
209
Location
Seattle
I managed to eek out a bit of range time this afternoon. Worked through the initial stages of loads for both of my .270 Win and my 7mm RM before pulling my .340 Wby Mag out.

First and second rounds missed paper completely. Pulled bolt and bore sighted by looking through barrel and then adjusting the scope. I was looking at the berm above my neighbor to the right.

My neighbor is someone I see at the range a lot and we've chatted a bit in the past. I told him what was going on and he offered to shoot while I spotted. His first shot was high, so we adjusted down some. That produced the hole in the top left just below the tear on his second shot. There was just two minutes left before the range closed at this point, so we adjusted the scope quickly and I fired one more round producing the hole below the black.

Both my range buddy and I noticed that the scope was badly out of focus, but I did not try to readjust the diopter.

I'm thinking I have my answer, but wondering if it would be worth going back tomorrow and see if it will group, or if I should send it back for warranty repair?
20200801_212935.jpg
 

Bravo 4

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jul 20, 2007
Messages
3,799
Location
The South
You haven’t 100% ruled out the scope (or proven that it is), but if you are convinced the scope is faulty then give them a call. My experience with potential scope issues is this; even scopes (from a big name company) that I knew to be faulty because I checked the mounting hardware, made sure everything on the gun was torqued properly, cleaned the barrel, shot a proven load through, had someone else I trust shoot it, swapped to a proven scope, etc...come back with a clean bill of health. This was because all they did was mount the scope in an apparatus and run the turrets while looking through a collimator checking for reticle movement, showing nothing when under harsh recoil (probably similar to what your rifle produces).
Here’s another problem I would be facing in your situation, even if they just sent me a brand new scope I would never trust it again on that rifle. I know that any scope can fail at any point, but confidence in your equipment goes a long ways. You have lost that at this point. The worst could be you waist some money on shipping and are out a scope for a while. Well that’s definitely not the worst but you see what I’m saying. But then again you may start taking the scope off and notice something wasn’t tight to begin with. Good luck, if you want to talk shoot me a pm and I’ll give you my number.
 

DNADave

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jun 18, 2019
Messages
209
Location
Seattle
Just got off the phone with Riton. In their view, this is because I have their rings mounted to Weaver bases and their rings are ONLY to be mounted on a picatinnay rail. I find it hard to believe that this would cause a POI shift of several feet in both directions at 100yds.

So far, not at all impressed with their service.
 

DNADave

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jun 18, 2019
Messages
209
Location
Seattle
I had some time over lunch and pulled out my rifle and tools. The rings were at 20 in-lbs and the base to ring bolts all tight. Bases felt solid, as they should be since I installed them with blue lock-tite.

The bases are the standard two piece Weaver type with two slots up front and one in the back. The slots are tighter than a Picatinny and the through bolt on the ring base fits snugly in that slot.

Here are some pictures (the last picture shows the open second slot on the forward base for size reference):

20200804_125041.jpg
20200804_125053.jpg
20200804_125102.jpg
20200804_125116.jpg
20200804_125129.jpg
 

David Emerson

Well-Known Member
LRH Team Member
Joined
Jan 1, 2020
Messages
803
Location
Drayton,ND
Just got off the phone with Riton. In their view, this is because I have their rings mounted to Weaver bases and their rings are ONLY to be mounted on a picatinnay rail. I find it hard to believe that this would cause a POI shift of several feet in both directions at 100yds.

So far, not at all impressed with their service.
A picattiny ring will not fit down into the slot on a regular weaver base. They need to be milled wider. In any regular style weaver base I use leupold QRW rings. Steel and stout. I just looked at your pictures. Your rings are seated down as they should be. I think somebody at Riton is passing gas. In looking at your rings it looks odd on the clamp side. Like they were not made wide enough. Your ring to base clamp should be straight up and down. I guess if it was me I would try a set of leupold QRW rings. I have never had an issue with them.
 
Last edited:

DNADave

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jun 18, 2019
Messages
209
Location
Seattle
A picattiny ring will not fit down into the slot on a regular weaver base. They need to be milled wider. In any regular style weaver base I use leupold QRW rings. Steel and stout. I just looked at your pictures. Your rings are seated down as they should be. I think somebody at Riton is passing gas. In looking at your rings it looks odd on the clamp side. Like they were not made wide enough. Your ring to base clamp should be straight up and down. I guess if it was me I would try a set of leupold QRW rings. I have never had an issue with them.
I agree on the clamp. These were Riton's rings and they didn't seem as good as others I've used. I have some Talley one piece ring/base rings coming, but they're still about a week out from being delivered. I have QRW rings on another rifle and do like them.

The bases are actually Warne steel bases (M902/879M) that are Weaver style. They might be wider than standard Weaver, but I haven't compared them to the actual Weaver bases I have on my other rifles.
 

sw282

Well-Known Member
Joined
Dec 29, 2015
Messages
122
Twas an old gunsmith here in Augusta Ga that did a booming business with the rich membership from the Augusta National/Masters Golf Club back when Africa was the
most popular hunt spot for the rich and famous. He'd mount scopes on their 375s, 458s
along with 0le Roy's bruiser 375, 378, and 460s. Eddie Sanders used Weaver rings and bases ONLY
 
Last edited:

David Emerson

Well-Known Member
LRH Team Member
Joined
Jan 1, 2020
Messages
803
Location
Drayton,ND
Twas an old gunsmith here in Augusta Ga that did a booming business with the rich membership from the Augusta National/Masters Golf Club back when Africa was the
most popular hunt spot for the rich and famous. He'd mount scopes on their 375s, 458s
along with 0le Roy's bruiser 375, 378, and 460s. Eddie Sanders used Weaver rings and bases ONLY
Yes the weaver bases are good but I hated the old weaver band clamp rings. You had to have a lot of practice in where to have your scope tilted as the scope would rotate as you tightened them down. Cheap is the best thing I can say about them.
 

David Emerson

Well-Known Member
LRH Team Member
Joined
Jan 1, 2020
Messages
803
Location
Drayton,ND
I agree on the clamp. These were Riton's rings and they didn't seem as good as others I've used. I have some Talley one piece ring/base rings coming, but they're still about a week out from being delivered. I have QRW rings on another rifle and do like them.

The bases are actually Warne steel bases (M902/879M) that are Weaver style. They might be wider than standard Weaver, but I haven't compared them to the actual Weaver bases I have on my other rifles.
Warne makes good stuff
 

DNADave

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jun 18, 2019
Messages
209
Location
Seattle
Yes the weaver bases are good but I hated the old weaver band clamp rings. You had to have a lot of practice in where to have your scope tilted as the scope would rotate as you tightened them down. Cheap is the best thing I can say about them.
Agreed on the old Weaver band clamps. So many trial and error attempts to get your scope level.
 
Top