What am I seeing in my barrel?

DSheetz

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It's interesting to see all of the tooling chatter marks in the Savage . I'm not afraid to use a bronze brush , but like anything else you shouldn't over use them . I have seen some barrels ruined with people trying to get them too clean and over using J B or ammonia based cleaners . Keep in mind that bronze makes your copper remover show copper signs if you use a bronze brush . Carbon is an 8 or 9 on the hardness scale and a lot of solvents won't even start to soften it up for removal and like so many other things a small amount of it will cause more to build up faster by catching more of it then a smooth surface . Over all it looks like you are doing pretty well with your cleaning procedures . With the barrel steel being so much harder then the bullets and other things you put down your barrels , except grit in say JB or Tubbs fire forming rounds it will take some time for the Savage to smooth out and speed up .
 

Tac-O

Formerly 'Ryan Tockstein'
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It's interesting to see all of the tooling chatter marks in the Savage . I'm not afraid to use a bronze brush , but like anything else you shouldn't over use them . I have seen some barrels ruined with people trying to get them too clean and over using J B or ammonia based cleaners . Keep in mind that bronze makes your copper remover show copper signs if you use a bronze brush . Carbon is an 8 or 9 on the hardness scale and a lot of solvents won't even start to soften it up for removal and like so many other things a small amount of it will cause more to build up faster by catching more of it then a smooth surface . Over all it looks like you are doing pretty well with your cleaning procedures . With the barrel steel being so much harder then the bullets and other things you put down your barrels , except grit in say JB or Tubbs fire forming rounds it will take some time for the Savage to smooth out and speed up .
I've always heard savage barrels are scary looking inside despite typically shooting well. So I wasn't surprised at all when I looked in there!!

I haven't heard too many accounts of chemical soaking action working very well on carbon. People usually are soaking and using an abrasive or brush. I have used CLR a couple of times before and got more carbon stuff out that none of my gun cleaners would. All the information I've read is that no one has suffered damage to their bore by using it wisely and the sds doesn't show any ingredients that are harmful to stainless. So I was really wanting to use it on some hard carbon and check the efficacy with my new toy. That savage is a perfect candidate!!
 

26Reload

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Which dark part? The one circled in red is actually the end of the chamber.
Yes..red circle is carbon ring...and yes..the took a shows one also....if you click on your picture(#11) and increase the size you can see the jagged edges of the carbon ring....
Some rifle can shoot with a carbon ring...some can't...
Sometimes that ring is hard to decipher as it looks like a shadow....
Here's before..during and after cleaning....it might be the same rifle...i have two getting ready for rebarreling....
2020-01-20-16-42-02.jpg2020-01-20-16-41-22.jpg2020-01-22-22-11-06.jpgif you enhance the after pic you can still see a very faint line of carbon and where it's been...just have to decide for yourself how clean is clean enough....some shoot clean..some shoot dirty...mine hit deer when I say bang.....
 

Tac-O

Formerly 'Ryan Tockstein'
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Yes..red circle is carbon ring...and yes..the took a shows one also....if you click on your picture(#11) and increase the size you can see the jagged edges of the carbon ring....
Some rifle can shoot with a carbon ring...some can't...
Sometimes that ring is hard to decipher as it looks like a shadow....
Here's before..during and after cleaning....it might be the same rifle...i have two getting ready for rebarreling....
View attachment 207262View attachment 207263View attachment 207264if you enhance the after pic you can still see a very faint line of carbon and where it's been...just have to decide for yourself how clean is clean enough....some shoot clean..some shoot dirty...mine hit deer when I say bang.....

Ahh I see. Thanks for the extra pictures! I was thinking that the chamber end just has a pronounced edge.

Mine does just fine as is for 400-500 yard elk size vitals. I'll probably scrub it out just to see if the fliers go away.
 

26Reload

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Yes...it does work...just don't shove it it there,with the side mirror...and not all the way....
Audiologist said my ears were really clean...so I had to check...
Great view of eardrum.....havent shoved it up the nose...someone else can do that.....
 

adamjp

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Jan 10, 2012
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It looks to me that the barrel steel in your savage is decaying at the muzzle. It appears to have a sandblasted appearance which is indicative of inclusions in the barrel steel - a fault from the mill, not the barrel maker.

There is no real fix for this, the barrel will lose accuracy very quickly as the bullet becomes unstable at the crown and does not exit consistently.

If it is what I think it is, a new barrel will be needed.
 

pescado

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Jan 8, 2015
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Photo 13 is a typical cross hatch rubbish cold hammer Tikka barrel. My Tac A1 in 260 was so rubbish I had it rebarreled just to get it to shoot.
 

Tac-O

Formerly 'Ryan Tockstein'
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Apr 28, 2019
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444
Location
Sandy, UT
It looks to me that the barrel steel in your savage is decaying at the muzzle. It appears to have a sandblasted appearance which is indicative of inclusions in the barrel steel - a fault from the mill, not the barrel maker.

There is no real fix for this, the barrel will lose accuracy very quickly as the bullet becomes unstable at the crown and does not exit consistently.

If it is what I think it is, a new barrel will be needed.

Is it there and visible when the barrel is new or does it become apparent through shooting it?

We'll see how it does after I get the carbon out
 

Tac-O

Formerly 'Ryan Tockstein'
Joined
Apr 28, 2019
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Sandy, UT
Photo 13 is a typical cross hatch rubbish cold hammer Tikka barrel. My Tac A1 in 260 was so rubbish I had it rebarreled just to get it to shoot.

I'm not too worried about the cross hatches in the Tikka or the drill marks in the savage. So long as they shoot as well as I need then it's all good!!

I just got the borescope because I wanted to learn what is going on in there. I hope to not cause myself any unnecessary stress and anxiety!
 

adamjp

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Jan 10, 2012
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72
Is it there and visible when the barrel is new or does it become apparent through shooting it?

We'll see how it does after I get the carbon out
It is invisible when new, looks like any other barrel. Only through shooting do the impurities separate from the steel. I built a Grendel which I couldn't get to shoot, after taking it to the smith who screwed it all together, he has a look and after a little while was able to show me the rotted crown. The barrel maker replaced the barrel without fuss.

Think of it like a piece of concrete with large rocks in it. When stressed the rocks fall out of the concrete.
 

DSheetz

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Aug 22, 2015
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I wouldn't be worried about either barrel myself . It was just interesting to see the differences between the two in as far as to how they were made and the quality of the machining and yet they preformed well . It just showed me that at times you don't need to be as much of a perfectionist to get them to preform well .
 

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