Vertical Alignment between Scope/Rifle...??

[Country Bumpkin]

I have broken my collar bone, my shoulder blade and separated my shoulder (all my right shoulder - I'm right handed). My shoulder sags and I'm pretty lopsided.

I find myself taking too much time setting up for hunting shots because I spend so much time fighting the scope level. My gunsmith is telling me that I don't NEED my rifle and scope to be perfectly aligned with one-another (as in I can lay down and get comfortable with my rifle, then have a friend twist the scope until it is plumb to the world). This means that my rifle is now canted to the right and my scope is plumb/level to the world - and I'm comfortable and not fighting anymore.

I don't agree that this is the right approach. I have a 20 MOA rail under my scope. My thoughts are that if the rifle is canted and the scope (pointing down 20 moa) is "level", then the further shot I take, the further left I'm going to hit.

Who's looking at this wrong, me or him?

I like not having to fight the level, but I'm confident that once I find the right load and stretching further shots, that I'm not going to be hitting in a vertical pattern.

 

[codyadams]

I believe that you are correct, everything must be level for longer ranges. Have you looked into the stocks or chassis with adjustable recoil pad tilt, that way you could set it up so the rifle/optic is level but the pad is adjusted to fit the way you hold the rifle?

 

[ShtrRdy]

I'm thinking the same as Codyadams. There might even be add on butt pad assemblies thar allow you to position the butt pad up/down, or canted.

 

[Hunter84]

I agree with you and the other responses. Scope alignment is critical, even for short range shooting.

 

[Country Bumpkin]

Thanks everyone, looks like I'm adjusting scope tonight.

Let the mental battles resume!

 

[Canhunter35]

I have no experience with canting ur rifle, but I'm gonna throw this out: David Tubb says it works and cants his rifle. From ur shoulder condition I would try to emulate Mr. Tubb. Being uncomfortable does not support good shooting.

 

[eklarsen]

How far do you need to shoot? If you are shooting out past say 500 yards then you need to be plumb and level. If shooting at shorter range then it will likely not matter very much.

 

[Hunter84]

I agree with you and the other responses. Scope alignment is critical, even for short range shooting.

fyi:I recommend the wheeler professional scope mounting and ring lapping kit. The ring lapping is probably a little overkill but the scope ring alignment tool works great. It's hard to get good ring alignment without the tool.

 

[J E Custom]

I have no experience with canting ur rifle, but I'm gonna throw this out: David Tubb says it works and cants his rifle. From ur shoulder condition I would try to emulate Mr. Tubb. Being uncomfortable does not support good shooting.

I was lucky enough to shoot with David when I was competing is NRA high power matches. And he does cant his rifle and obviously does well at it.

I did however noticed that every time he changed the elevation to a different distance, he also adjusted his windage to compensate for the error. I had enough trouble keeping up with everything else so I decided to level the sites or scope with the rifle.

A good test to see if you cant the rifle is armed with at least a 100, 200 300, 400 and 500 yard zero is to past a tall target with the bulls eye
at the bottom of the target then shoot at least 3 shots set at 100, then move the turrets to your 200 yard Zero and aim at the same bulls eye. Repeat the process until you shoot the longest distance the rifle is zeroed, and if you cane the rifle, your vertical dispersion will angle off left or right depending on the cant.

You can level the rifle using the bolt raceways and then level the scope or sites with something absolutely level and even install a level on the sites/scope and even then you may get some vertical dispersion. So test firing in my opinion, is the last word.

J E CUSTOM

 

[HARPERC]

.......I did however noticed that every time he changed the elevation to a different distance, he also adjusted his windage to compensate for the error. I had enough trouble keeping up with everything else so I decided to level the sites or scope with the rifle.......

That would require a quirk of brain I don't have. Almost as crazy as the folks that paint upside down pictures I can't see until they flip it 90 degrees.

I'm pretty crooked, pretty slow, and take any mechanical advantage I can find to get the rifle square with the world, then adjust me as well as I can.

 

[Canhunter35]

I was lucky enough to shoot with David when I was competing is NRA high power matches. And he does cant his rifle and obviously does well at it.

I did however noticed that every time he changed the elevation to a different distance, he also adjusted his windage to compensate for the error. I had enough trouble keeping up with everything else so I decided to level the sites or scope with the rifle.

A good test to see if you cant the rifle is armed with at least a 100, 200 300, 400 and 500 yard zero is to past a tall target with the bulls eye
at the bottom of the target then shoot at least 3 shots set at 100, then move the turrets to your 200 yard Zero and aim at the same bulls eye. Repeat the process until you shoot the longest distance the rifle is zeroed, and if you cane the rifle, your vertical dispersion will angle off left or right depending on the cant.

You can level the rifle using the bolt raceways and then level the scope or sites with something absolutely level and even install a level on the sites/scope and even then you may get some vertical dispersion. So test firing in my opinion, is the last word.

J E CUSTOM

Makes sense having to adjust because you've added a horizontal axis to your shooting. I suppose from reading the ops question, he would have to decide if the discomfort outweighs the extra calculations, but it is doable

 

[ShtrRdy]

Would something like this work?

https://graco-corp.com/product/575s/

 

[J E Custom]

Would something like this work?

https://graco-corp.com/product/575s/

Yes.
It is common to use an adjustable butt plate to cant the butt plate/recoil pad for a better fit.

You can also use the top of the target frame to check your position if the scope is level with the rifle.

J E CUSTOM

 

[Chippewa]

I would think if your rifle was built with the cant intended to be always there, and a level installed on the scope to insure its level with the horizon while your rifle is tilted you are fine. Go with a bipod that has nice cant feature and a rear bag that the gun can recoil thru canted. Of course the stocks forend needs to be strong enough to stay freefloating even while its recoiling at angle. But still good repeatable form during recoil seems to be key. Also your brake would need set up for the cant if its side discharge.
To me ANTIcant levels are installed so you know your veticle and horizontal axis of the scope are exactly where they should be in relation to gravity. Then when you zero with level reference you have that to go by in the field to remove the error from crooked crosshair shifting point of impact when dialing away from zero. Further distances would be worse shifting.
I think comfort is the way go for keeping your shots repeatable. I agree with the use of the wheeler scope kit. But you would need the barrel clamp style for what you attempting.
An heck if no success you can set up like norm and just try something else.