# throw a bullet ?

#### Schnyd112

##### Well-Known Member
You are just widening the window to make an impact. Tracking it, timing it and shooting where it will be. You’re not adding lateral movement.

have you played the carnival game when you drop a playing card and have to catch it by closing a stationary paddle? Almost impossible. If you were able to move that paddle, you could catch the card more often and, with practice, every time.

You can’t shoot where the target is, you have to shoot where it is going to be. Matching it’s speed, swinging with the target, helps you pull out in front and time that action.

#### Chase723

##### Well-Known Member
Those videos demonstrate that from the point of origin the droplet or bullet actually travels at a diagonal from its point of departure. While the path is straight it’s not parallel. The only way that can happen is if there is a horizontal velocity vector.

#### Coyote_Hunter

##### Well-Known Member
Physics is physics. If you apply a lateral motion to the bullet, that motion will continue until stopped by friction in the air or collision with some other object. Newton's 1st law of Motion applies.

The question therefore becomes not "Can you shoot around an obstacle?" but rather how to design a test setup that would show such motion. Testing in outer space could help a lot.

As a practical matter, slower bullets and greater lateral motion would make the lateral motion more visible, as would greater distance between the obstacle and the target.

#### Coyote_Hunter

##### Well-Known Member
A note to clarify my previous post, which rely didn't answer the question "Can you 'throw' a bullet to shoot around an obstacle?"

The answer is implicit in my post - you cannot: a bullet will continue in a straight line UNLESS acted on by another force. That external force could be spin or wind drift, or gravity, or maybe something else, but the external force is required.

The problem is a bullet is far too massive. When you get down to firing sub-atomic scales you get wave-like behavior that changes everything when if comes to hitting an obstructed target - no lateral motion on the part of the source and no external force is required. This has been demonstrated many times since the early 1800's using light and a double slit setup.

So get out your billion-dollar, man-portable peta-watt laser gun. And your double-slit device.

#### Canadian Bushman

##### Well-Known Member
If bullets dont continue to move horizontally when shot from a moving barrel, then that means you dont have to lag a target when shooting from a moving car or helicopter, right?

#### J E Custom

##### Well-Known Member
When you are shooting at a moving target, the projectile (Bullets, pellets, and arrows) go straight at the release of the weapon. The fact that you continue to swing and change your point of aim, Makes the projectile appear to curve In the opposite direction as the swing. It is an optical illusion .

This is especially noticeable when shooting a running target with a bow and arrow because of the speed of the arrow (300 to 400 ft/sec).

It does say one thing good about your shooting if you see this phenomenon, because if it looked like it went straight, you didn't follow through with your swing.

J E CUSTOM

#### Coyote_Hunter

##### Well-Known Member
If bullets dont continue to move horizontally when shot from a moving barrel, then that means you dont have to lag a target when shooting from a moving car or helicopter, right?

When a bullet leaves a barrel it has a specific vector (velocity and direction). It will continue to move along that vector unless an external force (wind, gravity, etc.) acts on the bullet and changes it’s vector. Let’s ignore air resistance for a moment.

Einstein’s Special Theory of Relativity states that there is no difference whether the shooter is in motion (via car or helicopter or whatever) and the target is motionless or the target is in motion and the shooter is motionless.

A motionless shooter has to lead a bird because it has forward motion relative to the shooter and the bullet takes time to traverse the distance from the barrel to the bird. If the bird was suspended motionless in the air and the shooter was moving backward (relative to the bird), the lead (relative to the bird) would be the same. To the shooter, this would appear to be a lag.

Now reverse the situation. The bird is flying backward (very unusual bird!) and the shooter is motionless. The shooter would still need to lead the bird (relative to the bird’s direction of travel) to allow the bullet time to travel to the bird’s future location. But the bird flying backward relative to a motionless shooter is no different than the shooter moving forward with the bird motionless. The shooter would still aim as if it was the bird that was moving. From the moving shooter’s perspective, a lag would be required.

The point is that in each case, and ignoring external forces like air resistance and gravity, etc.) the bullet travels in a straight line from the moment it leaves the barrel. It won’t bend around an obstruction between the barrel at the time the bullet leaves the barrel and the point of aim (future location of the bird).

#### Tulsa Reiner

##### Well-Known Member
When a bullet leaves a barrel it has a specific vector (velocity and direction). It will continue to move along that vector unless an external force (wind, gravity, etc.) acts on the bullet and changes it’s vector. Let’s ignore air resistance for a moment.

Einstein’s Special Theory of Relativity states that there is no difference whether the shooter is in motion (via car or helicopter or whatever) and the target is motionless or the target is in motion and the shooter is motionless.

A motionless shooter has to lead a bird because it has forward motion relative to the shooter and the bullet takes time to traverse the distance from the barrel to the bird. If the bird was suspended motionless in the air and the shooter was moving backward (relative to the bird), the lead (relative to the bird) would be the same. To the shooter, this would appear to be a lag.

Now reverse the situation. The bird is flying backward (very unusual bird!) and the shooter is motionless. The shooter would still need to lead the bird (relative to the bird’s direction of travel) to allow the bullet time to travel to the bird’s future location. But the bird flying backward relative to a motionless shooter is no different than the shooter moving forward with the bird motionless. The shooter would still aim as if it was the bird that was moving. From the moving shooter’s perspective, a lag would be required.

The point is that in each case, and ignoring external forces like air resistance and gravity, etc.) the bullet travels in a straight line from the moment it leaves the barrel. It won’t bend around an obstruction between the barrel at the time the bullet leaves the barrel and the point of aim (future location of the bird).
To summarize: the only way the bullet can travel in an arc (non- straight path) is for an external force to act on it, such as gravity, wind, or the gravitational pull of another large body like the moon.

#### Coyote_Hunter

##### Well-Known Member
You will also miss a running coyote if you stop to pull the trigger . You need to follow through with the animal's speed

Or point shoot, which is what I generally do. Have taken down running coyotes and antelope at 500 yards.

#### Chase723

##### Well-Known Member

Not a bullet...but still a projectile. Little off topic but still cool.

#### Wedgy

##### Well-Known Member

Not a bullet...but still a projectile. Little off topic but still cool.
"Archers paradox"

#### Coyote_Hunter

##### Well-Known Member
To summarize: the only way the bullet can travel in an arc (non- straight path) is for an external force to act on it, such as gravity, wind, or the gravitational pull of another large body like the moon.

Exactly right.

#### Tulsa Reiner

##### Well-Known Member
Coyote Hunter: is your last name Einstein? That experiment sounds familiar.

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