Thoughts on Hammers on elk (out of a 6.5 CM)

[dogz]

On the real I've been hunting elk for 43 years, guided professionally for a fair bit of time for the big buggers and have helped/hunted with a lot of people who've taken a lot of elk.

Many years being in and around the taking of double digit numbers of elk (I'll just leave it at I've seen my share of elk killed). Point being, I've seen them taken from close to far, from archery to 375's and 416's. I've used my 22/250 on up to my 375 Wby to take them. From spitting range to 700 yards I've found that if I place a good bullet in a good place then good things will happen.

If one screws the pooch and makes a bad hit then they can be awfully tough to get on the turf for good! No matter what round is being used!

Honestly real world taking a elk out even with a lowly 6.5 CM just isn't rocket science! If a fella exhibits a bit of good judgement and has the ability and the cool calmness to know when to shoot then it just isn't tough! On that last part a lot of people just aren't that cool and calm when it comes crunch time. Some of that is on them, some of it is on their guides...

IMO a decent (139-140) bullet out of the 6.5 CM will penetrate at least as far as the same constructed bullet will out of an 06 with a 180 grain. Not many sane people would question
how effective a 180 out of an 06 is on elk no would they...

Thanks all for the fun chit chat, I had hoped to find someone who had actually used a Hammer on elk out of a 6.5 but it just didn't work out (so far)...

Enjoy the 4th all!

 

[Hard rock]

On the real I've been hunting elk for 43 years, guided professionally for a fair bit of time for the big buggers and have helped/hunted with a lot of people who've taken a lot of elk.

Many years being in and around the taking of double digit numbers of elk (I'll just leave it at I've seen my share of elk killed). Point being, I've seen them taken from close to far, from archery to 375's and 416's. I've used my 22/250 on up to my 375 Wby to take them. From spitting range to 700 yards I've found that if I place a good bullet in a good place then good things will happen.

If one screws the pooch and makes a bad hit then they can be awfully tough to get on the turf for good! No matter what round is being used!

Honestly real world taking a elk out even with a lowly 6.5 CM just isn't rocket science! If a fella exhibits a bit of good judgement and has the ability and the cool calmness to know when to shoot then it just isn't tough! On that last part a lot of people just aren't that cool and calm when it comes crunch time. Some of that is on them, some of it is on their guides...

IMO a decent (139-140) bullet out of the 6.5 CM will penetrate at least as far as the same constructed bullet will out of an 06 with a 180 grain. Not many sane people would question
how effective a 180 out of an 06 is on elk no would they...

Thanks all for the fun chit chat, I had hoped to find someone who had actually used a Hammer on elk out of a 6.5 but it just didn't work out (so far)...

Enjoy the 4th

On the real I've been hunting elk for 43 years, guided professionally for a fair bit of time for the big buggers and have helped/hunted with a lot of people who've taken a lot of elk.

Many years being in and around the taking of double digit numbers of elk (I'll just leave it at I've seen my share of elk killed). Point being, I've seen them taken from close to far, from archery to 375's and 416's. I've used my 22/250 on up to my 375 Wby to take them. From spitting range to 700 yards I've found that if I place a good bullet in a good place then good things will happen.

If one screws the pooch and makes a bad hit then they can be awfully tough to get on the turf for good! No matter what round is being used!

Honestly real world taking a elk out even with a lowly 6.5 CM just isn't rocket science! If a fella exhibits a bit of good judgement and has the ability and the cool calmness to know when to shoot then it just isn't tough! On that last part a lot of people just aren't that cool and calm when it comes crunch time. Some of that is on them, some of it is on their guides...

IMO a decent (139-140) bullet out of the 6.5 CM will penetrate at least as far as the same constructed bullet will out of an 06 with a 180 grain. Not many sane people would question
how effective a 180 out of an 06 is on elk no would they...

Thanks all for the fun chit chat, I had hoped to find someone who had actually used a Hammer on elk out of a 6.5 but it just didn't work out (so far)...

Enjoy the 4th all!

Go too official hammer bullets terminal performance picture heavy page on this forum and you will find your ansewer.

 

[Lefty G-gear]

Yeah just because of the CM. Creedmoors get beat on pretty hard just because they're popular

I have shot a couple thousand rounds of 308, plinking dirt-clauds in the hills at long range, up to 950-yards, with a lot of wind, and without a lot of wind. - Now, I have a 6.5 Creedmoor to try the same. - This article got me more interested:

QUOTE:
"In October 2017, U.S. Special Operations Command tested the performance of the 7.62x51 NATO, .260 Remington, and 6.5 CM cartridges out of SR25, M110A1, and Mk20 sniper rifles. SOCOM determined that the 6.5CM performed the best, doubling hit probability at 1,000 meters (italics mine) increasing effective range by nearly half, reducing wind drift by a third and having less recoil than the 7.62 NATO rounds…"

(BUT, I've heard that up to 500-yards, the .308 has the advantage. - Anything beyond - the 6.5 Creedmoor shines.)

6.5 Creedmoor vs. .308 Winchester

Both the .308 Winchester and the 6.5 Creedmoor offer all-around performance for a variety of hunting and shooting applications, but there can be only one winner. Petzal weighs in and compares these two cartridges for accuracy, recoil, and effectiveness on game.

www.fieldandstream.com

 

[FrogFire7]

I have shot a couple thousand rounds of 308, plinking dirt-clauds in the hills at long range, up to 950-yards, with a lot of wind, and without a lot of wind. - Now, I have a 6.5 Creedmoor to try the same. - This article got me more interested:

QUOTE:
"In October 2017, U.S. Special Operations Command tested the performance of the 7.62x51 NATO, .260 Remington, and 6.5 CM cartridges out of SR25, M110A1, and Mk20 sniper rifles. SOCOM determined that the 6.5CM performed the best, doubling hit probability at 1,000 meters (italics mine) increasing effective range by nearly half, reducing wind drift by a third and having less recoil than the 7.62 NATO rounds…"

(BUT, I've heard that up to 500-yards, the .308 has the advantage. - Anything beyond - the 6.5 Creedmoor shines.)

6.5 Creedmoor vs. .308 Winchester

Both the .308 Winchester and the 6.5 Creedmoor offer all-around performance for a variety of hunting and shooting applications, but there can be only one winner. Petzal weighs in and compares these two cartridges for accuracy, recoil, and effectiveness on game.

www.fieldandstream.com

That seems about right. Definitely better ballistics... And if say in general out to 500 or so you might be right, seems like almost everything shoots roughly the same to about that distance, but the 308 with the heavier bullets probably does have an energy advantage to that yardage. Which I'm sure you already know . I guess what I'm saying is I agree with your assessment

 

[Priley]

If you've actually taken elk with a 6.5 CM and Hammer bullets please chime in a let me know how it went, ranges, and which bullet you used.

Many thx

I haven't used the Hammer bullets but we have killed 2 bulls and 2 cows in camp the last 2 years with the 6.5 CM with 140 gr Berger VLD's and 147 gr Hornady ELDM's from 200-635 yards the longest being a heavy 6x6. The Creed will do the job just place your shot DRT!

 

[SSgt G Cody]

This past year I took 2 large mule deer and a bull elk with 141 Hammers. All were 1-shot kills at 350-480 yards, and none ran over 50 yards from impact spot. I'm very pleased with Hammers!

 

[Varmint Hunter]

There are a few interesting videos here on the brand.

https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=Hammer+bullets+in+6.5+Creedmoor+on+elk

Hey - that 4th video down is my elk!! He was taken with a 181gr Hammer bullet fired from a 30Nosler. Using a 6.5 Needmoor hadn't been considered at the time. LOL

 

[Northkill]

I've never had the privilege to go for elk to date. Where I was coming from was based on comparative observations and experience with various projos on the many deer we've had the opportunity to take. And based on those comparisons, the 124 HH is plenty capable for elk if used within its parameters. Nothing profound - just humble observations. Though I understand how it is - it just helps to hear from someone who has actually done it. But the thing is, posters can say anything to promote their biases and opinions without much accountability on a forum like this.

 

[Northkill]

This thread will give you some helpful info:

Best Hammer for Elk

Best for this situation I should say. My Wife drew an Arkansas Elk tag. Her favorite rifle is a 6.5x55 in a Swedish Mauser and her other rifle is a Ruger 6.5 CM. She prefers the Swede, She has harvested 2 Elk in the past, both with the 140 grain Nos. Part. which is very lethal. She likes the low...

www.longrangehunting.com

 

[dogz]

THX Northkill

 

[dogz]

Hey - that 4th video down is my elk!! He was taken with a 181gr Hammer bullet fired from a 30Nosler. Using a 6.5 Needmoor hadn't been considered at the time. LOL

Totally understand not having considered this or that round. The 30 Noz is a good round, it's in good company basically running with the 300 WM and the Wby.

The CM is plenty of round for elk, anyone's who's not trying to take elk out at the longer ranges (say 700 on out) will concur with this. As well anyone who'd taken more than a handful of elk. Challenge with so many of these conversations is that most peoples files are pretty darn thin. Point being, a lot of people will say that this or that round is where one should be at, or this or that round isn't big enough. Then comes along someone who's been to the elk killing movie a lot (and killing a handful isn't a lot) and those folks will have enough time in the game to know what works.

On a side note, I'd pretty much bet you the farm that this fall we could stop by 100 or 200 elk camps in Montana (or pick your state) and we'd find more than a few CM's and if you tried to tell those toting them that they're undergunned they'd probably take a swig, another bite of elk burger from last years elk and go hmm.........and move on.

And yet, I'd also bet you the farm that you wouldn't find a 30 Noz in any of those camps either. Plenty of 300 Win's and probably a few Wby's but I'm pretty sure that the 30 Noz would be another one of those not considered as you say

Bottom line, take what you can shoot well, and have confidence in!


Happy 4th all!

(I was out earlier in this month a lot looking for bear and saw a lot of calves, going to be a good year and with all this moisture should be epic for horn growth)

 

[Varmint Hunter]

Totally understand not having considered this or that round. The 30 Noz is a good round, it's in good company basically running with the 300 WM and the Wby.

The CM is plenty of round for elk, anyone's who's not trying to take elk out at the longer ranges (say 700 on out) will concur with this. As well anyone who'd taken more than a handful of elk. Challenge with so many of these conversations is that most peoples files are pretty darn thin. Point being, a lot of people will say that this or that round is where one should be at, or this or that round isn't big enough. Then comes along someone who's been to the elk killing movie a lot (and killing a handful isn't a lot) and those folks will have enough time in the game to know what works.

On a side note, I'd pretty much bet you the farm that this fall we could stop by 100 or 200 elk camps in Montana (or pick your state) and we'd find more than a few CM's and if you tried to tell those toting them that they're undergunned they'd probably take a swig, another bite of elk burger from last years elk and go hmm.........and move on.

And yet, I'd also bet you the farm that you wouldn't find a 30 Noz in any of those camps either. Plenty of 300 Win's and probably a few Wby's but I'm pretty sure that the 30 Noz would be another one of those not considered as you say

Bottom line, take what you can shoot well, and have confidence in!


Happy 4th all!

(I was out earlier in this month a lot looking for bear and saw a lot of calves, going to be a good year and with all this moisture should be epic for horn growth)

Like most posters here, I really don't have a shortage of options when it comes to selecting a cartridge for any particular game animal. Typically, I just look to use the best cartridge for the job even though several different cartridges would get the job done. In my mind, a 300mag, of any flavor, is just about perfect for taking elk where the shot distance can't be predicted. Even if I wanted something with less ballistic capability, I've got a few options that would make me more comfortable than grabbing my Creedmoor.

It's just a personal choice because many cartridges work fine depending upon conditions and distance. The next time I hunt elk I'll probably grab another 300mag because it covers all the bases for me. I like the Creedmoor for shooting whitetails where its ballistics seem to match the quarry better. Mileage varies for everyone.

 

[Apex Custom Rifles]

Just went over this with a customer the other day asking about basically the same thing. We did the math and with his combo he was good out to about 250 yards with good energy and good shot placement. At 300, would need everything to go right, Past 300, the terminal ballistics were just not enough to justify any shot IMO.

I usually suggest staying in the 280/7RM and above cartridges. I personally use 30 magnums of various flavors.

 

[Wyo37]

What "math" was used?