The 27 Nosler, it's official!

35 Whelen

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Joined
May 21, 2018
Messages
307
Location
Montana
I saw the 400 whelen in PO Ackleys old books. How can you maintain headspace with that?
When James Howe built the first rifles and ammo for the 400 Whelen that him and Col. Whelen came up with James use cylindrical 30-06 brass (brass that had not been formed or necked). He used a shoulder of .458 not .441 of the 30-06. The Griffin & Howe built rifles for it in the 1920's and'30's, they were cambered this way and work perfect. Elmer Keith had a Griffin & Howe 400 W and He had good success with it. Some how this info was not let out or was over looked and many gunsmiths made rifles with the .441 shoulder and had bad headspace with it, so it was labeled and bad cartridge by them and many who never used it or researched it. Michael Petrov did a lot of research and found the truth. He even got to use Col. Whelens reloading dies, and one of his rifles if I remember right. I got some loading help from two grate guys I found on the 24hourcampfire forum. One lives in Alaska and he and his wife have used it on caribou and moose. The other guy is in Oklahoma and has use it in Africa on game up to and including cape buffalo.
 

David Emerson

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LRH Team Member
Joined
Jan 1, 2020
Messages
774
Location
Drayton,ND
I am glad you answered. Earlier here on this site a man could not maintain headspace with a 35 whelen. Seemed strange to me but I did not have his rifle to work with. He said he had it checked and the barrel set back yadayadayada. I never had that problem with mine. I think the best of all in that range is the 9.3x62. Just for the better bullets.
 

highdrum

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Joined
Nov 30, 2008
Messages
1,433
With light(ish) bullets under 150gr I doubt there will be much difference between the 270 Weatherby and the 27 Nosler. I know that my 27 Boondoogle (270/338 RUM variant) isn't that far ahead of a hot rod Weatherby load with bullets around 150gr and less. I've landed on the 145 Sierra TGK at 3480 fps from a 25" barrel as an all-round load. Where the larger cases start to pull ahead is with the heavier bullets. Unfortunately for me, I'm getting offensively bad results with the 170gr Berger EOL (3-4 MOA with 5 different powders!) and the 1-7" twist barrel won't consistently stabilize the 168gr Hammer Hunter at my elevation (200') when the temps get below 55°. I think the 170 Berger just doesn't like to be shot over 3200 fps, especially in such a fast twist barrel.

The 27 Nosler should really start to pull ahead with something like the 165 ABLR.
7 twist and your velocity more than likely tore the Bergers apart. The 175 matrix have a thicker jacket but open tip for expansion, they may work for you. My barrel ordered is an 8.5 twist which stabilizes the 170 down to 0° at 2k altitude @ 3100fps. So hopefully I won't have that issue.
 

35 Whelen

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Joined
May 21, 2018
Messages
307
Location
Montana
To many 35 Whelens have used a 1-16 twist. Col. Whelen and Mr. Howe were wonting to use up to 300gr. bullets and used 1-14 and 1-12 twist. The 1-14 is perfect for 275gr. and 280gr. bullets. Woodleigh and Hawk makes good .358 275gr. bullets and Swift makes a 280gr. a-frame bullet. The 1-12 is perfect for 300 and 310gr. bullets. Hawk makes 300gr. bullets, Woodleigh makes 310gr bullets in both soft point and full metal jacket. I have a savage I rebarreled with an E.R. Shaw barrel that is a 1-14 twist, and a Montana Rifle Co. AVR with a 1-12 twist. I have not tried the heavy bullets at this time but I will get to it. I think that if more rifles would have used the faster twist the 35 Whelen would be readily accepted for use any where the 9.3x62 is used. I have read where it was stated that the reason the 35 Whelen is not aloud for dangerous game is because the 1-16 twist will not stabilize the 275 to 300gr. bullets. I have read many reviews were guys have used theirs in Africa with Nosler partition, Swift A-frames and Woodleigh bullets the PH said they would allow them to use it on cape buffalo, and there are some that have taken cape buffalo with the 35W with very good success and their PH's where very satisfied and impressed with it's performance.
 

David Emerson

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LRH Team Member
Joined
Jan 1, 2020
Messages
774
Location
Drayton,ND
One of Taylors favorites was the old 350 rigby. 310 gr at 2100. He shot elephants and buffalo. You might laugh but I have a browning lever that pushes a 310 Woodleigh at 2100 with 41 gr of R15 from a 20 inch barrel. 😝 358 Winchester.Tuck it in your back pocket.It has a 12 twist. Hal Waugh was the #1 master guide in Alaska.In his later years of guiding he retired his 375 weatherby and carried a 358 Winchester for backup.
 

yorke-1

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Joined
Jul 5, 2008
Messages
1,198
Location
Clearwood, WA
7 twist and your velocity more than likely tore the Bergers apart. The 175 matrix have a thicker jacket but open tip for expansion, they may work for you. My barrel ordered is an 8.5 twist which stabilizes the 170 down to 0° at 2k altitude @ 3100fps. So hopefully I won't have that issue.
I agree, my results were slightly less disappointing with my 8.5 twist barrel. LOL

I’m waiting for Matrix to start shipping to the US again so I can grab some of the 175s. Their 160s are the only bullet I shoot in my 6.5/338 RUM.
 

highdrum

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Joined
Nov 30, 2008
Messages
1,433
I agree, my results were slightly less disappointing with my 8.5 twist barrel. LOL

I’m waiting for Matrix to start shipping to the US again so I can grab some of the 175s. Their 160s are the only bullet I shoot in my 6.5/338 RUM.
They are shipping stateside! I was just in communication earlier in the week.
 

The Hock

Well-Known Member
Joined
Aug 18, 2007
Messages
255
Location
Colorado mountains
27 Nosler is a reality! They introduced it at the SHOT Show. I've read several reports about it. I expect barrel life to be nearly the same as a 28 Nosler since there bore and case capacity are nearly identical. When I build mine I'll nitride the barrel to give it the best chance at having a decent barrel life. With Berger's hunting bullets, Matrix having figured out the ITAR import license and Nosler releasing their 165 ABLR I expect the .277 to have a bright future. Like it or hate it the manufacturers have seen a demand and they're acting too full that demand. I look for more manufacturers to jump in if these exploits are successful.
 

johnnyk

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Joined
Dec 24, 2001
Messages
2,164
Location
Potters Hill, NC
I think the 170 Berger just doesn't like to be shot over 3200 fps, especially in such a fast twist barrel.

Hmm, I don't have any problems running them in a "Kirby Built" .270 Allen Magnum, 30" Lilja, 8t at 3400fps (US869). This is a 3 groove barrel and there's reports out there of once these barrels get a few rounds through them they start "gnawing" at the jackets. So far I haven't had any problems but the round count is still quiet low, as in may be 250.
I really appreciated the info you gave for the .270 Boondoggle. I extrapolated your data to the AM. I haven't tried the 145gn ELD-X yet but I did try RL33, GM215M's and the 169.5gn Wildcats and found it had a narrow window of operation. I started at 93.0gn and was knee-deep in pressure right to start with. Tried 92.5gn, still there, so went to 92.0gn and it was just on the edge. Velocities were 3498, 3475 and 3463, respectively. Still needs some tweaking.
 

Quintus

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Joined
Apr 15, 2013
Messages
238
It would be interesting to run an 8.5 twist Nosler and Weatherby side by side and see where they end up. The Wby cases don't seem to get a lot of updating in the newer published data with the newer powders and bullets available. I absolutely love Roys version. For a 500 yards and in hunting rifle it is in my eyes, perfection.
 

highdrum

Well-Known Member
Joined
Nov 30, 2008
Messages
1,433
I ordered an 8tw 26" carbon for my build. I think I'll be doing a 27lrm tho since gunwerks will have adg 7lrm brass in April.
 

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