So is an action really just a matter of personal preference?

MagnumManiac

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If you look at custom actions from an engineering standpoint, the advantages against a factory action, and this is not to say all factory actions are this way, is that a custom is machined so that EVERY ONE is the same as the last….barrel thread timing, headspace from shoulder/lug or whatever mating surface is used and the lug recesses and bolt lugs all measure the same.
Mass produced actions that are not necessarily machined in CNC lathes/mills, cannot be held to the same tolerances.
There is nothing to say that a trued action of ANY flavour is NOT going to be just as accurate as the most expensive custom action out there.
As long as everything lines up perfectly perpendicular to the bolt centreline and barrel bore, it doesn’t improve any, no matter where it’s origins rest.
As to Win Model 70’s and their recoil lug, properly bedded, it is actually a good thing for accuracy. Mauser actions can also be made to shoot very well, may not be BR quality, but still 1/4 MoA capable.

Cheers.
 

Alex Wheeler

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The action is the most important part of the rifle. One with issues will hold back every barrel you chamber. Sometimes its small sometimes its big. An action can cause the owner as much grief as a bad barrel. I have many guys that send me problem rifles that have had multiple barrels and none will shoot. You could almost make a living just working on rifles that dont shoot as well as they should. 90% of the time the issue is in the action. Yes, the action matters, its very important, do not believe the guys that say it doesnt. I have fixed a lot of rifles that would not shoot. The brand name is not the biggest thing its who builds the rifle and that they go through every component. If you want to just "assemble" parts then stick to the actions that are used in Benchrest and f Class. They are popular for good reasons and the designers understand how to design an accurate action.
 

jgs8163

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The action is the most important part of the rifle. One with issues will hold back every barrel you chamber. Sometimes its small sometimes its big. An action can cause the owner as much grief as a bad barrel. I have many guys that send me problem rifles that have had multiple barrels and none will shoot. You could almost make a living just working on rifles that dont shoot as well as they should. 90% of the time the issue is in the action. Yes, the action matters, its very important, do not believe the guys that say it doesnt. I have fixed a lot of rifles that would not shoot. The brand name is not the biggest thing its who builds the rifle and that they go through every component. If you want to just "assemble" parts then stick to the actions that are used in Benchrest and f Class. They are popular for good reasons and the designers understand how to design an accurate action.
Excellent!!! ^^^^
 

DJ Fergus

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I haven't had enough custom actions to weight in on the subject but it does seem like a personal preference thing for the most part. I've had a fair share of trued actions. I did have a barreled action that was so out of alignment that it warped the brass upon firing. It would shoot virgin brass loads 1/2 moa and less. Not so great shooting fired brass loads because the brass was warped at the head.
 

skipglo

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Don't have time today to read the whole post! But actions are definitely personal choice....Me...I prefer to throw out the middle finger...quickest action out there...you...might like to throw your hands in the air and try to look mean! Actions...do speak louder than words...or maybe you were talking about guns?
 

.300 Dakota

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The action is the most important part of the rifle. One with issues will hold back every barrel you chamber. Sometimes its small sometimes its big. An action can cause the owner as much grief as a bad barrel. I have many guys that send me problem rifles that have had multiple barrels and none will shoot. You could almost make a living just working on rifles that dont shoot as well as they should. 90% of the time the issue is in the action. Yes, the action matters, its very important, do not believe the guys that say it doesnt. I have fixed a lot of rifles that would not shoot. The brand name is not the biggest thing its who builds the rifle and that they go through every component. If you want to just "assemble" parts then stick to the actions that are used in Benchrest and f Class. They are popular for good reasons and the designers understand how to design an accurate action.
I had a factory Win 70 push feed action "blue printed" by a local guy who did one for me before with great success, but he did it as more of a hobby than anything. It shot horribly as a factory chambered 7mm WSM. I had him make it into a .300 RCM with a Mullerworks barrel. Could barely get MOA on one or 2 loads. Had him replace the Mullerworks with a Bartlein 3B in 6.5 PRC. Had a JGS floating pilot reamer on the 300 RCM and Manson floating pilot on the 6.5. The 6.5 wouldn't shoot as good as the original .300, but close. I had seen him make several crazy accurate rifles out of AFTERMARKET actions like we're talking about here. My theory was that there was some issue with that action that truing the normal places, lapping the lugs, and reciting threads wouldn't fix. The bolt lift was so light, it would almost fall open if you turned it upside down and shook it (like some Kimbers I've encountered). Is there such thing as OVERlapping the lugs? That was the only thing I could find. I was pretty sure it wasn't a barrel issue.

So is it fair to say that using an aftermarket ("custom") action removes some if the potential shortcomings of a builder? Obviously there are still some major areas on the chamber and crown that can be botched, but it would seem to take at least some or many if the usual problem areas away.?
 

DJ Fergus

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I had a factory Win 70 push feed action "blue printed" by a local guy who did one for me before with great success, but he did it as more of a hobby than anything. It shot horribly as a factory chambered 7mm WSM. I had him make it into a .300 RCM with a Mullerworks barrel. Could barely get MOA on one or 2 loads. Had him replace the Mullerworks with a Bartlein 3B in 6.5 PRC. Had a JGS floating pilot reamer on the 300 RCM and Manson floating pilot on the 6.5. The 6.5 wouldn't shoot as good as the original .300, but close. I had seen him make several crazy accurate rifles out of AFTERMARKET actions like we're talking about here. My theory was that there was some issue with that action that truing the normal places, lapping the lugs, and reciting threads wouldn't fix. The bolt lift was so light, it would almost fall open if you turned it upside down and shook it (like some Kimbers I've encountered). Is there such thing as OVERlapping the lugs? That was the only thing I could find. I was pretty sure it wasn't a barrel issue.

So is it fair to say that using an aftermarket ("custom") action removes some if the potential shortcomings of a builder? Obviously there are still some major areas on the chamber and crown that can be botched, but it would seem to take at least some or many if the usual problem areas away.?
That is strange with the win 70. I've saw some similar things like you mentioned. In hindsight, I wondered if was inconsistent firing pin strike.
 

Alex Wheeler

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I had a factory Win 70 push feed action "blue printed" by a local guy who did one for me before with great success, but he did it as more of a hobby than anything. It shot horribly as a factory chambered 7mm WSM. I had him make it into a .300 RCM with a Mullerworks barrel. Could barely get MOA on one or 2 loads. Had him replace the Mullerworks with a Bartlein 3B in 6.5 PRC. Had a JGS floating pilot reamer on the 300 RCM and Manson floating pilot on the 6.5. The 6.5 wouldn't shoot as good as the original .300, but close. I had seen him make several crazy accurate rifles out of AFTERMARKET actions like we're talking about here. My theory was that there was some issue with that action that truing the normal places, lapping the lugs, and reciting threads wouldn't fix. The bolt lift was so light, it would almost fall open if you turned it upside down and shook it (like some Kimbers I've encountered). Is there such thing as OVERlapping the lugs? That was the only thing I could find. I was pretty sure it wasn't a barrel issue.

So is it fair to say that using an aftermarket ("custom") action removes some if the potential shortcomings of a builder? Obviously there are still some major areas on the chamber and crown that can be botched, but it would seem to take at least some or many if the usual problem areas away.?
My guess is it was an ignition problem. Someone probably messed with the spring to make it open easier and thats a huge problem for accuracy. Things have to be right no matter if its a custom or factory, both can have serious problems. But in general, yes the higher end customs do give you a better shot at avoiding a dud.
 

.300 Dakota

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My guess is it was an ignition problem. Someone probably messed with the spring to make it open easier and thats a huge problem for accuracy. Things have to be right no matter if its a custom or factory, both can have serious problems. But in general, yes the higher end customs do give you a better shot at avoiding a dud.
Email sent to your business account, sir!
 

matt_3479

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I have never had a failure on my actions. With 7 currently in the line up and all being different. From hunting in -30 degrees Celsius to +40 Celsius nothings caused any issues
 

.300 Dakota

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So I'll be trying to get my hands on a Defiance anTi X XM length with the Oberndorf floor plate assembly. UNLESS I decide to go ahead and burn another ounce and a half and just get a long action so I have more stock choices. I'm thinking the meager weight savings isn't worth the constraints on stock options. Either way, for the X version, I'll have quite a wait. Same for the McMillan that would be needed for the XM version. That floor plate assembly is mighty purty for the $300 price tag. Probably a long wait for it too. Weighs just 6 ounces for all the parts.
 

Truc

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Custom vs Factory actions.
If you shoot competition such as in my profile pic, it had better be a custom. Mainly for smoothness, I could run the bolt firing with one finger, can’t do that with a factory action,
but….
a trued Remington action shot in say a 6x Hunter class, I’ve seen outshoot custom guys with 42x scopes in matches. but not fast
 

.300 Dakota

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Moss Point, MS
Custom vs Factory actions.
If you shoot competition such as in my profile pic, it had better be a custom. Mainly for smoothness, I could run the bolt firing with one finger, can’t do that with a factory action,
but….
a trued Remington action shot in say a 6x Hunter class, I’ve seen outshoot custom guys with 42x scopes in matches. but not fast
Nice rig, sir!
 
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