Sake vs Cooper

[Rogmay]

Would like some thoughts!!! Looking for a new rifle in 7mm RM, options are Sako A7 or Cooper Excalibur 52, I looked at the Rem. Sendero and Rem. LR but liked the Savage 111 long range better, then I saw the Sako A7 Roughneck and liked it better than the Savage. I've always liked Coopers but we're a little pricy, now I've got the ok to get what I want within reason from the boss! Gun will mostly be used for hunting 90%, and friendly comp. about 10%, hunting out to 800yrds, steel out to maybe 1500yrds. I can look at a Sako with Leupold vx-6 for about the same price as the Cooper rifle alone. Question is would it be worth it to snag the Cooper and save up for a scope later or go with the Sako package now? Or any other rifle suggestions would be greatly appreciated! Thanks in advance.

 

[Varberger757]

Comparing the low budget model of Sako (A 7) with a high end Cooper isn't helpful at all IMO. The Sako Mod. 85 / Tikka T 3 have always had and still have issues with the recoil - lug, causing sometimes ugly damages at the stock. Especially when using more powerful rounds more often. The A 7 is a (cheap) clone of both of them, and if you're able to get a Cooper instead with its high quality standards, so go for it.

 

[Greyfox]

My two go to hunting rifles used for same requirements that you describe are a Cooper 520 and a Savage LRH, both in 6.5-284. Both rifles will get the job done. The Cooper is a near custom rifle, superbly made, with an action that is smooth as silk. if I could swing it financially, I would personally go with the Cooper. If cost were a consideration, I would go with the Savage. In either case, your are right to not trade off on a top quality scope.

 

[bkondeff]

Do your research and you'll find the few complaints you will find about a Sako(A7 or otherwise) are perceived issues because they use polymer on both the A7 and Tikka(also by Sako). These compaints are 99% by non-owners. What you will find is an overwhelming support by OWNER'S, that they shoot and are reliable.

I personally own a Sako 75SS in 7mm and a Tikka T3 SS and like them both very much, and both shoot mutiple bullets sub-moa, not relying on just a pet load after 50 combinations during load devopment. For example, my 75 shoots 150tsx ~.5moa, 160 Accubonds ~.5moa, and 168 Berger ~.7moa.

I suggest you put a few of these guns in your hand and see how they feel. Weight, grip(Sako has palm swell), etc. Personally I've never picked up a Savage I liked the feel of, particularly the very heavy LR, which if I remember right had a short barrel to accomodate the brake.

If you like both the Sako and Coopper, then find a deal on the Sako, which can be had, buy it and shoot it and if it doesn't fit your standard, flip it. Not hard. Then you can go spend $2500 on a Cooper with a piece of mind.

PS My Sako is going up for sale to fund a recent full custom buy, but it isn't Like New, though it shoots like new.

 

[Rogmay]

Great responses, I myself have a Tikka T3 in a 7mm and I can say it's a .75" gun with my Berger 168's. As far as the A7 being a nock off of the tikka it's actually the other way around, the A7 guarantees 5 shot MOA where as the tikka is a 3 shot MOA guarantee! Those two and a couple of Weatherbys I belive are the only factory stock guns giving guarantees! As far as durability I've never had an issue with the lugs or wood stock on my Tikka! Still up in the air!

 

[bkondeff]

Comparing the low budget model of Sako (A 7) with a high end Cooper isn't helpful at all IMO. The Sako Mod. 85 / Tikka T 3 have always had and still have issues with the recoil - lug, causing sometimes ugly damages at the stock. Especially when using more powerful rounds more often. The A 7 is a (cheap) clone of both of them, and if you're able to get a Cooper instead with its high quality standards, so go for it.

Love to see pics of the damages caused in the Sako that you describe.

 

[snookntarpon]

Cooper,

I own 2 sakos and they are great guns. But they are no cooper. With a cooper you will feel every dollar you spent in that gun. Built just right. every time. Love my coopers. Love my sakos but the Coopers steal the show.
Love all my guns. The ones i didn't love are long gone.

 

[Rogmay]

Think I'm going down tomorrow to order the Cooper Excalibur model 52 in the 7mm, can't wait, but sh!t, it's a 5-7 month wait! Should be worth it, this way I'll have time to save up for the scope!

 

[scottishkat]

There's one 7mmRM on GB right now price is up there.

You will really like the cooper Excalibur. I own 1 and its a serious shooter its in 6.5x284 and the rifle is on the slow side. They're a lot pricier than the A7 though. I also have 2 Sako 85's and the actions of the cooper and the 85 are both really nice my wood stocked 85 is in 260 rem and competes with the cooper for speed and accuracy.

I like the safety on the Sako a lot better than the Cooper which is more like a switch the magazine on the 85 is flawless where the mag on my cooper excalibur is not that great I actually sent the firearm back they fixed and it is better but still not as good as the Sako.

The cooper comes bedded into the stock where the Sako does not. In fact it's bedded so tight its hard to remove.

The cooper with the 26"bbl looks pretty heavy better for LR work than the Sako at 24.4" there is 1.5 pounds in the difference. The synthetic stock on the sako 85 that I own is questionable and I an seriously considering replacing it. I read a rumor somewhere that the Sako synthetic stocks were forced on Sako by Barretta and at least one person had issues with them.

You could by the A7 for about 1,100.00 and if you don't like the stock you could get a Mcmillan drop in for it and still be well under the cost of the cooper. The A7 bbl looks like it came off the finnlight which costs about 400.00 more.

In either case you'll be getting a really good firearm.

Good luck and shoot straight

Bob

 

[Rogmay]

Scottishkat, that's some great info, points that lead me to the Cooper are it has a 1:9 twist vs the 1:9.5 in the Sako, I've been wanting to try the 180 bergers and the 1:9 twist should work better! Also the magazine in the Cooper has an I.D. Of 3.66 which we'll fit the 168 & 180's better when loaded to the lands. I did however like the grippy feel of the A7 stock better than the Cooper. The Cooper actually comes in at 7-3/4lbs, so it's not too bad. Another big point is when I talked to Cooper today they said if you are the original owner and burn out the barrel after a couple thousand rounds they'll replace it and set the gun up again for $125, that's good customer service! Doesn't hurt there made in Montana which happens to be where I live!

 

[ramrod79]

I have owned a couple Coopers now and for the money I am really not that impressed I could build a custom to my specs for the same money ( I am in Canada 3200 for an Excalibur now ) . I find they are really heavy and both rifles the barrels fowled really easy ( accuracy fell off after 20-30 rounds). Don't get me wrong they are nice outfits but both of mine have been sold due to a few different reasons one major reason was the clips I could not seat bullets to lands due this.
My buddy picked up a 6.5 284 in a Savage LRH a year ago ,and recently bought a 7mag the 6.5 will shoot .5MOA at 1000yards and so far the 7 Mag will shoot a 3 inch group at 500 yards they are the same weight as a Cooper but way less money . I think if I had a choice between the Savage LRH , ( Sako witch I have never been fond of) or the Cooper I would buy the Savage and buy really good glass with my saved money . OR look on the forum for a custom 7 Mag .

Just on a side note my Cooper M52 did not like 168 VLDS I had to go to the Classic Hunter version ,and the best I could get 180s to shoot were 1 MOA with many different combos powder primers at 1000 with the 168 I could shoot a 7-10 inch group depending on day and the 180s I could not do any better than 12inch I am not sure what anyone else will say but I also found their barrels slower than many other custom barrels I have used in past . Just some food for thought .

 

[bkondeff]

Bottom line, Sako is probably the top end of true production rifles, while the Cooper is a custom, though not made to order. Everything on the Cooper is hand fitted. I'm not sure I would compare to any custom smith's on here, and certainly you don't get to custom design the chamber setting, etc. but they clearly are not the same.

Of course, like many things, the cost to go to the next level in anything is quite high. Not many Remington 700's, Browning's, Weatherby's, Tikka's, or Sako's that can't be made to shoot sub moa, or even close to .5-.75moa with careful handloading.

 

[Rogmay]

Ramrod79, that's interesting to hear, one of the reasons I'm going with the Cooper is that I've talked to a few people that have had good luck with the Berger vld's in 168 & 180's, the 1:9 twist is a good fit for the heavier bullets, I have a 1:9.5 in my tikka which is a little slow for the 180's, (which is what the savage and the Sako have) it does shoot the 168's rather well, 3/4" @ 100yrds, as far as the weight the savage is almost 1 lb heavier than the Cooper! Not sure what the exchange rate is in Canada but Excalibur runs about $2150 in the states. Either way that's good info to know! Also, as far as the seating goes, I know chambers are different but my tikka is loaded .003 off the lands and I had to file my clip I.D. For the longer bullets, OAL 3.440, clip I.D. In Coopers are 3.66.