rezeroing scope

[rufous]

I have a bit of a dilemma. I have a Sarovski 3-9 AV scope that I plan to install on my 300 Win Mag that I intend to use for all of my big game hunting. My other big game rifle (a 7mm Rem Mag) will basically be retired. It has a Leupold 2.5-8X scope with a Stoney Point Target Knob on the elevation adjustment. The problem is that the Swarovski knobs only has 32 hash marks. There are 60 clicks per full 360 degree revolution but the knob is only marked halfway around. Yes I could mount the Leupold on the 300 Winchester but I did buy the Swarovski with the idea of using it on my high end gun. Also the Leupold has failed me twice during hunting seasons. The first time it would not hold its zero back in 1996 on a bear hunt. Then it fogged up internally while out cougar hunting a couple weeks ago. Now I have to sight it in again. Basically I have low confidence in that scope. The Swarovski is unproven so who knows but what it may fail on me at some point in the future. The load I am shooting is the 220 Sierra Matchking at 2830 fps zeroed at 250 yards so that the high point in the trajectory will not be more than about 3". As mentioned before in other posts I hunt on foot, not with the use of a bench and sandbag rests so I do not expect to ever shoot at game beyond about 600 yards. Here is the rub: 32 clicks up will only get me rezeroed at 550 yards (it actually takes 33 clicks up). If I spot an animal at 575 or 600 and have a good solid rest (prone with bipod and sling) and conditions are such that I am confident in putting a bullet into its vitals I would not be able to rezero for that range and still be using the hash marks. I suppose I could just count clicks beyond where the hash marks are but am obviously more comfortable if I can stay on the marks. I could hold over the required amount, but again much prefer to hold dead on with the rifle rezeroed for that range. I could just be content to pass up shots beyond 550 yards (I have only attempted shooting at big game twice beyond that range- once on a cougar at 575 at once on a bear at 600 yards- both were not successful). A couple other options would be to see if Swarovski could modify or replace the existing knob with one that has hash marks all the way around or if some other company can do this. A final option would be to shoot a flatter shooting bullet, which is something I may end up doing. I have some of Gerard Schultz's GS Custom 160 grain HV bullets on order. They have a bc supposedly of 0.515 and he says I should be able to get them going 3400+ fps. With that load I could have its baseline zero at 300 yards and still be only 3.3" high at 150 yards and then 30 clicks up would get me rezeroed at 650 yards. I wonder if any of you have any thoughts or advice. Particularly do any of you know if the elevation knob on the Swarovski scope could be replaced or modified so that it would have hash marks all the way around? Thanks, Rufous.

 

[Darryl Cassel]

Hello Rufous

1. You could stay with the 220 Gr Sierra which has a much better BC (.655) them the GS 160 gr you mentioned plus, it will deliver a lot more energy.
2. If your zeroed or sighted in at 250 yards, you will need 6.2 MOA (25 Clicks up) up from your 250 yard zero for 500 yards and 9.2MOA (37 clicks) up from your 100 yard zero for 600 yards.
3. You can either count the clicks above the point where you don't have any marks or buy the Burris Sigh-a-line rings with the inserts of .005", ,010", .015" or .020".
You should have plenty of clicks available then.

How did the Leupold fog up? Were you in a warm place and then go outside in zero temp. quickly?

Send your Leupold back and let them rework it. You should have it back in 2 to 3 weeks.
One nice thing about have a scope company here in America.

Take care
Darryl Cassel

[ 01-17-2002: Message edited by: Darryl Cassel ]

[ 01-20-2002: Message edited by: Darryl Cassel ]

 

[rufous]

Darryl, the Sierra would have 100 foot-lbs more energy at 600 yards. Not really significant (2040 versus 1940). I do not understand what you are saying regarding the clicks up. First you say with the 220 zeroed at 250 yards and then you say up 25 clicks from 100 yard zero. I zero at 250 and then it would be up 27 clicks to rezero at 500 yards (elevation 900 feet). To rezero at 600 I would need 40 clicks up according to my program. I am using bc of 0.655. Also I do not see how the Burris rings and inserts would help. The problem is not that I run out of available clicks, but that I run out of hash marks. Thanks for your input but I am not entirely following you. I suppose I could go up 10 clicks and then reset the zero and then go up another 30 clicks to get zeroed at 600 yards. Hopefully I would remember to go down the proper amount to get rezeroed at 250.

The scope just fogged up. I do not think I did anything out of the ordinary. They are not supposed to do that, regardless of going from warm to cold environment. I did send it back and they had it returned to me within 1 week. Great service. They replaced the objective lens. Rufous.

 

[Brent]

Rufous, does the scope have numbers around it as the Leopold does, or just hash marks? They're only half way around the dial, what's on the other half, is it defective or are they all like this? Never heard of one like it in my life, I'd sell it and buy a Nightforce for the money the Swarovski's worth. I guess each revolution is 15 minutes and each click is 1/4 min and the hash marks at 1/2 min intervals, like the Leopold VariXIII.

If I were limited to 600 yards, the lighter bullet with heavy construction would be the better choice. The 220gr is only going to out perform it out at 1000 yards as far as trajectory I suspect, and energy, the lighter one has plenty.

 

[rufous]

Brent, I think that all of this particular model Swarovski scopes are like this but I am not sure. Basically I guess it is not designed to be used as a long range scope (it being only a 3-9 without adjustable parallax). It is certainly not the best choice for a long range hunter but then I felt that it would serve me well in the majority of shots I would be taking. As I hunt on foot in mixed terrain most of my shots are well under 400 yards. I do not feel comfortable shooting at beyond 500 yards at this point. There are only hash marks 1/2 way around the dial, no numbers. Each click has a hash mark. Rufous.

 

[Brent]

That is indeed very strange. You're right that would be a hash mark for every click, see, I was already confused with that scope, glad I wasn't in the field. Swarovski just might be able to mark the other half of the dial. Are the hash marks at all longer every fourth one, so you can easily count the minutes by the longer ones? Good luck.

 

[rufous]

Yes every fourth mark is longer. I will see if I can send it in and have it marked all the way around. Rufous.

 

[Darryl Cassel]

Rufous

I typed a wrong zero yargage for you. As I stated at the start, it was a 250 yard zero not a 100 yard zero as, I'm so use to typing for most of my charts and for those that want me to run theirs.

True the 160gr at 3400FPS is within 127 FP of energy at 500 yards and 157 FP at 600 yards compared to the 220 Gr MK going at 2830 FPS. Point is, the 220 outperforms the smaller bullet as per energy.
At 600 yards the 220 really STARTS to shine and will take over from there on out to 1000 yards and beyond. Another example of the bigger, higher BC bullet doing a bit better job at extended range even though it started out 570 fps slower.

I just ran both bullets out to 1000 yards. No comparison from 500 to 1000 yards. The 220 would be my choice.

I don't believe your scope was designed to do what you want to do without looking at it up close. You should be able to make it work though. If your running out of clicks at 550 or 600 yards, a tapored base or Burrus sight- a-line rings with the inserts will give you more usable clicks in your scope to use it.

True, our programs are only within a click or 2 of each other.

Good Luck and sorry for the misprint on my previous response. It has been changed.

Darryl Cassel

[ 01-20-2002: Message edited by: Darryl Cassel ]