Reticles for hunting SFP scopes info/education

[DartonJager]

I have given FFP scopes a good enough try to know they will not work for my style of hunting and the conditions I hunt in 60-70% of the time if not more. A fellow member of my rifle club allowed me to barrow not one but two FFP scopes for me to take home and try out one a MIL Dot WGS and one a Bushnell with I think was a G3? reticle and I absolutely did not like how the reticle looked at lowest power settings and in low light and also in the thick cover in low light I hunt in at least 50% of the time. I will be staying with SFP scopes for now.

I felt I should add my scopes are normally kept at their lowest setting at all times and are used at their lowest setting to make best guess 90-95% of all the shots I have ever taken on deer or elk because I have always been fortunate enough to get close enough that I need not dial up the power on my scope beyond minimum setting. Another reason why I do not like FFP scopes.

I felt I should also add my desirer to become proficient at longer ranges of up to 700 yards is because of two experiences on my last elk hunting trip First one was I spotted a pretty good bull with about 1 hr. of daylight left was beyond the max effective range of my Bushnell LRF so he was way past 1k yards. I gave it my absolute all out do or die effort to close the distance but unfortunately I couldn't get any closer than about around 600-650 yards as my LRF an older Bushnell was having some difficulty giving an exact reading. I sat and watched that bull a beautiful 6x6 bugle and tend his Harim of 7-8 cows until I lost my light. My rifle at that time had a VariX-III 4-12x40 and no way I could make that shot work.
A few days later I found myself below an elk heading up a mountain to the tree line to bed and again **** near gave myself a heart attack trying to close to my effective range of 400 or so yards only to watch him vanish into the trees at about 500-550 yards from me. That was my first elk trip I went home without killing a bull.

Since then I have promised myself my next elk trip if my skills allowed that I would be able to at least make a 600 yard shot if conditions were favorable and I would be equipped with a scope capable of making such shots. I already own several rifles in calibers more than capable to cleanly kill an elk or deer at 600 yards. Now all I need is the skills and the correct scope for the job. And i have to buy the scope to be able to gain the skills.

That said I had posted a request for help in choosing between two scopes and a V4 and a VX5 with nearly identical reticles that featured simple hash marks on the majority of both the vertical and horizontal parts of the reticle.

So I now need some help from experienced long range hunters who use SFP scopes with the type of reticle(s) (I have included a LINK to picture of the reticle) , to if you will clear the air and separate what I have read and based my assumptions on from the real world facts about SFP scopes and tactical types of reticles. So here is my situation.

A member here replied and advised me that because they are SFP scopes such reticles featuring multiple hash marks is not really useful in a hunting application due to the fact to use them in a SFP scope you MUST be at or near the scopes highest magnification as predetermined by the manufacturer, a fact I was and are very well aware of with SFP scopes. And I would be better served with a standard reticle devoid of any hash marks along the lines of a duplex.

I had to admit he caused me to realize I was basing my choice of reticle types on only what I had read by others and not considered if it would actually work for me as I assumed it would. I bought into the concept of spending the time shooting to determine the drop of my reloads at all distances out to XXX yards and then determine how the hash marks and their sub tensions correlated to my reloads performance while the scope was set to the power setting required to do so.

Part of why I was convinced the SFP scope would work as I described above was I always do any longer shooting with the scope set at its max power and I know to take longer shots beyond 250-300 yards you need to get properly set up to do so and that takes time. Although if given the choice I would not and would much prefer to use any kind of a improvised rest but I can and have made more than a few successful shots while standing W/WO sticks, sitting W/WO sticks and kneeling W/WO sticks out to honest LRF confirmed 300 yards but beyond that I would have to get properly set up shooting either from a naturally occurring rest of some kind or prone.

All of which takes time and I feel it is realistic to believe I would have time to set my scope at the correct magnification, after all I have to set it to the correct magnification setting to use the dials in the first place so someone (and I mean this sincerely) please educate me as to how I wouldn't also be able to use the hash marks effectively and if need be the hash marks to aid in aiming if I didn't have time to dial as all the factors that affect bullet flight like altitude, atmospheric conditions, wind, angle etc that will dictate how much I dial for drop or wind should again unless I am wrong here equally affect the application of the hash marks for adjusting for wind and drop as well, or am I wrong?
So am I pipe dreaming here or are my expectations and assumptions realistic in a day in day out hunting situation?

So what I would greatly appreciate is input from those who transitioned from standard SFP non tactual adjustable turret scopes not designed for in the field adjusting wind and elevation to SFP scopes that are equipped with exposed turrets for dialing for wind and elevation adjustments what reticles they use and why and especially if they at one time used a reticle like the the ones I am considering that I have included a link to a picture of and went back to a standard duplex or similar reticle design and why.

Link to reticle example:

https://images.eurooptic.com/images/products/zeiss-sport-optics/reticles/zeiss-conquest-v4-reticle-94-z-m0a-2-non-illum.jpg

 

[BEEMAN]

I also like and only use SFP scopes. Personally I like shooting on high magnification. As far as reticle I like are MOAR, TMOA and NPR2. Got a few vortex as well but don't remember what their reticle is named. For shots 300 yds and farther on maximum magnification I have no problem using the reticle to hold instead of dialing.

 

[K9TXS]

I have 2 Nightforce SHV 5-20 scopes. Both are SFP scopes. I've tried first focal plane several times but they're just not for me due to eye issues.When the power setting is on a low power, it's very hard for me to see the cross hairs let alone seeing the subtension marks. I have an astigmatism in both eyes, floaters and after using a computer screen for many years editing videos, it makes it hard to focus on small details. So, I sold all my FFP and use only SFP now.

If you're using the MOAR reticle for hold over shooting, ranging, etc., the scope is set at the maximum range of 20 power to use the subtension marks. On the power ring you will see a white dot between the 9 and 12 settings, this approximately 10 power.

Using the white dot setting, 10 power, it makes all the subtensions on the reticle half of their value from the 20 power setting. This means instead of 2 moa between the marks it's 1 moa. See the reticle below. This is set for 20 power so for a 10 power setting, each subtension is half of what is shown. This may sound confusing, but it really isn't after a little practice.

This information can be used on any scope. Why power up to 20 power and then dial back down for the shot. Also, the higher the power, the more sensitive the scope becomes where you can see your heartbeat, breathing, movement, etc. in the scope. I only use higher power when I'm at the range on a target. Makes it easier spotting my target.

I only shoot sage rats and prairie dogs now and have found that 10 power works out really well most of the time. I use lower power when scanning the field and will bump it up a little when making the shot.

 

[General RE LEE]

Personally I sold my TMOA and use a duplex and dial for elevation. I like the simplicity of the duplex and the boldness in low light. I have the fire dot duplex in 3 VX5HDs and they work great. I can hold a little over if I need to compensate for wind but thats rarely necessary. I tried the FFP and went back to a SFP as well.

 

[FrogFire7]

@K9TXS

If you're using the MOAR reticle for hold over shooting, ranging, etc., the scope is set at the maximum range of 20 power to use the subtension marks. On the power ring you will see a white dot between the 9 and 12 settings, this approximately 10 power.

Using the white dot setting, 10 power, it makes all the subtensions on the reticle half of their value from the 20 power setting. This means instead of 2 moa between the marks it's 1 moa. See the reticle below. This is set for 20 power so for a 10 power setting, each subtension is half of what is shown. This may sound confusing, but it really isn't after a little practice


I think the above is actually backwards... halving the magnification would actually double the reticle values. I believe?

 

[Tiny Tim]

Tagging in

 

[jimbires]

here is another thread going on now , SFP / FFP

Help me understand. | Long Range Hunting Forum


frogfire , your last sentence is correct . half mag = double moa .


if you look at K9TXS pic of the reticle . you will always see this complete reticle at the same size in a SFP scope . on a FFP scope at minimum power , this reticle will be very small looking through the scope . lets say a dime would cover it . when the scope magnification is maxed out , you might only see to the 10 moa hash mark because the reticle has grown so much the rest is out of view .

on a dedicated long range rifle I use a reticle like K9 has the pic of . on my regular hunting rifles where I could get a 30 yard shot out to 500 or 600 yards , I like the Leupold Boone and Crockett reticle . usually the reticle works out correct, or close enough on max power , to be able to use it as 200 , 300 , 400 , 450 , 500 yards .if I'm shooting past 500 I need to dial . by using this reticle I don't have to try to remember how many moa hold for a certain distance . I think Zeiss rapid 600 would be an equivalent to the Boone and Crockett . I know Zeiss has a rapid 800 and I think another one longer yet . I'm not sure how well these would match up , a lot of things start to add up at longer distances .

 

[HuntnPack]

I much prefer SFP for my hunting use.
I like a simple uncluttered reticle like
the NF MOAR & MOAR CF2 reticles.
Time permitting I use a rangefinder/kestrel & dial for elevation & dial or hold wind for first shot.
If you can spot your first shot & need a follow up just hold for correction & fire.
Stay on same magnification.
typically I'll dial to full power of 20 or 1/2 power of 10. A nice feature on my NF is the power throw lever. I use it for quick visual reference. At 3:00 it's 20 power, & hash mark is 1 moa, at 1:00 it's 10 power, & hash mark is 2 moa.
Depending on hunt terrain I'm either hiking with scope set at lowest setting of 2.5 in thick stuff or 10 in more open country &
Can make a quick shot utilizing reticle holds if needed.

 

[K9TXS]

FrogFire7 & jimbires are correct. I don't know what I was thinking when I posted that. I should have posted the ones below from Strelok to show what I was talking about.