I've been trying to improve my resizing technique and purchased a set of modified shell holders so that I could control shoulder bump. I've been measuring my fired brass with the Hornady tool and my measurements are the same as that of new brass. Should I be seeing the shoulder move after the first firing or does it take several firings? Since my once fired brass chambers just fine , I'm wondering why I shouldn't just neck size. Surely I'm off track somewhere.
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Reloading is so hard!
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Zen Archery
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Depends on the brass and the load.
My Nosler brass is usually good up to 7 loads then I can measure difference.
But I also shoot light moderate to light loads
Out of my .223 I shoot a hot load and misc. brass (ya, judge me) and they are all over the place when it comes to measurements.
The more you reload you'll begin to feel/see difference between cheap and premium brass.
Try not to over think it. It's only had hard difficult as you make it. It's a good precision hobby.
My Nosler brass is usually good up to 7 loads then I can measure difference.
But I also shoot light moderate to light loads
Out of my .223 I shoot a hot load and misc. brass (ya, judge me) and they are all over the place when it comes to measurements.
The more you reload you'll begin to feel/see difference between cheap and premium brass.
Try not to over think it. It's only had hard difficult as you make it. It's a good precision hobby.
Rich Coyle
Well-Known Member
I full length size every time. I check each one as it comes off the press with a headspace gauge. It is nothing more than an electronic caliper with a round attachment that lets the neck and half the shoulder go inside it so I am measuring half way down the shoulder.
just country
Well-Known Member
morning, if u r reloading for an AR, u should FL before reloading. reason,
for smooth feeding into an AR chamber. with bolt guns the reloading
is different depending on the methods of different reloaders. I have to Ar's
and FL for both. in my bolt guns I use different methods. every person
who reloads has his or hers methods. as u progress in ur reloading. get a
book on the process of ammunition reloading. use the pictures and methods
descripted in the book. u will learn alot. all of the major manufactures publish
there own books. lightbulbgun)
for smooth feeding into an AR chamber. with bolt guns the reloading
is different depending on the methods of different reloaders. I have to Ar's
and FL for both. in my bolt guns I use different methods. every person
who reloads has his or hers methods. as u progress in ur reloading. get a
book on the process of ammunition reloading. use the pictures and methods
descripted in the book. u will learn alot. all of the major manufactures publish
there own books. lightbulbgun)
It will often take 3 firings of good stiff loads to get brass to expand to its max for that chamber.
You can tell you are not there yet by inconsistent headspace measurements normally.
IMO forget NS as that will cause you more problems down the road unless you only shoot light loads.
FL size everytime with a die that fits well and do not look back.
You can tell you are not there yet by inconsistent headspace measurements normally.
IMO forget NS as that will cause you more problems down the road unless you only shoot light loads.
FL size everytime with a die that fits well and do not look back.
Mikecr
Well-Known Member
Fire-forming is forming of your cartridge to YOUR chamber. It becomes 'your chamber cartridge', and you want this to reach stable dimensions -quickly.
So don't begin with FL sizing, which is a setback to forming and reaching stable.
Partial NS only until cases are fully fire-formed(3-4 firings), and then decide (if you haven't) on your sizing plan from this established stable condition.
If you're going custom sizing die, this formed brass would be sent to a custom die maker.
So don't begin with FL sizing, which is a setback to forming and reaching stable.
Partial NS only until cases are fully fire-formed(3-4 firings), and then decide (if you haven't) on your sizing plan from this established stable condition.
If you're going custom sizing die, this formed brass would be sent to a custom die maker.
gohring3006
Well-Known Member
Personally I neck size only. I'll do this until they don't chamber. Then I decide if the primer pockets are tight enough to set back the shoulders, or start a new batch of brass. I usually get 8-10 firings before they get to where they don't want to chamber without a lot of force.... So primer pockets are the primary decision maker for me...
The way I look at it is..... If I get a year out of my brass with 8-10 firings I'm happy. I can start over with a new batch every year, it doesn't bother me at all..
The way I look at it is..... If I get a year out of my brass with 8-10 firings I'm happy. I can start over with a new batch every year, it doesn't bother me at all..
MudRunner2005
Well-Known Member
I do the same thing.
bigedp51
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- Dec 10, 2010
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- 1,022
We live in a plus and minus manufacturing world and chambers and dies vary in size. Example I have a standard Lee .223 die if setup per the instructions will push the shoulder back .009 shorter than my GO gauge. This same die will also reduce the case diameter smaller than my RCBS small base die.
Below a fired case from my AR15.
Below the same case after full length resizing and .003 shoulder bump.
Below a new unfired Federal M193 cartridge.
And below the +.004 Redding competition shell holder I used above for my .003 shoulder bump next to a standard RCBS shell holder. And if I had used the standard RCBS shell holder the case would be .002 shorter than a factory case and almost .008 shorter than my chamber.
Bottom line, if your chamber pressure is not high enough the base of the case will not stretch to meet the bolt face. If your primer is flush with the base of the case after firing the base of the case did make contact with the bolt face. Meaning check a fired case, is the primer protruding from the base or is it flush.
The neck and shoulder of the case is the softest part of the brass and should conform to the chamber very easily. The base of the case is much harder and thicker and may take 43,000 to 45,000 psi to cause the brass to stretch to the bolt face.
If your chamber pressure is above these figures I would guess your die is a close match to your chamber.
Below is what normally happens when full length resizing and if the die is set too high you can actually make the case longer than the chamber. And if the die is set too low the will have excessive shoulder bump/shoulder setback.
Mikecr
Well-Known Member
bigedp51's bottom picture shows why a true FL die cannot be used well for partial neck sizing.
And you don't need to size the full length of necks unless you actually want extreme neck tension(including donut added grip).
This is somewhat mitigated with use of bushing-body dies, which are also merchandised as FL dies today, but they're not.
Better still is separate body sizing(with a body die) and separate partial neck sizing (with a bushing neck sizer die).
And the best available option is separate body sizing with a custom body die(fit to your chamber formed cases), and separate bushing partial neck downsizing, and separate mandrel neck expansion (with an expander die).
But no matter what you choose for sizing, it's success is tied to the baseline cartridge your chamber produces. A fully fire-formed, dimension stable cartridge.
Until you reach this point -you haven't. You're tail chasing here, and your trimmings and varied shoulder bumpings are evidence of it.
And you don't need to size the full length of necks unless you actually want extreme neck tension(including donut added grip).
This is somewhat mitigated with use of bushing-body dies, which are also merchandised as FL dies today, but they're not.
Better still is separate body sizing(with a body die) and separate partial neck sizing (with a bushing neck sizer die).
And the best available option is separate body sizing with a custom body die(fit to your chamber formed cases), and separate bushing partial neck downsizing, and separate mandrel neck expansion (with an expander die).
But no matter what you choose for sizing, it's success is tied to the baseline cartridge your chamber produces. A fully fire-formed, dimension stable cartridge.
Until you reach this point -you haven't. You're tail chasing here, and your trimmings and varied shoulder bumpings are evidence of it.
