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This is a thread for discussion of the article, Nightforce Velocity 1000 Reticle Review, By Scott Shreve. Here you can ask questions or make comments about the article.
Nightforce Velocity 1000 Reticle Review
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I Have been following this scope for a long time. rather expensive but so is quality. junk is cheap.
Listed below are some of my concerns.
1. I BELIEVE YOU MENTIONED THE RETICLE IS SETUP TO PERFORM AT THE MAXIMUM SCOPE POWER..... DID I UNDERSTAND RIGHT????? What happens when you want just say 10 x magnification??????? Still accurate????? I have no use for a scope at 3.5 power.
2. How do you test and confirm the horizonal hash marks for wind velocity. Is there a standard for each hash mark? Say example; 10 mph from 9 oclock hold 1 hash on the Left side?????
3. This sounds like a 2nd focal plane scope explain the differences and advantages on both????
4. How thick where the cross hairs at 1000 yds on the target when at maximum magnification??? could you still see a 1 foot steel target enough to make out the target edges. How about a smaller target like a gallon milk jug????
Thank you for sharing your excellent review.
odavid
Listed below are some of my concerns.
1. I BELIEVE YOU MENTIONED THE RETICLE IS SETUP TO PERFORM AT THE MAXIMUM SCOPE POWER..... DID I UNDERSTAND RIGHT????? What happens when you want just say 10 x magnification??????? Still accurate????? I have no use for a scope at 3.5 power.
2. How do you test and confirm the horizonal hash marks for wind velocity. Is there a standard for each hash mark? Say example; 10 mph from 9 oclock hold 1 hash on the Left side?????
3. This sounds like a 2nd focal plane scope explain the differences and advantages on both????
4. How thick where the cross hairs at 1000 yds on the target when at maximum magnification??? could you still see a 1 foot steel target enough to make out the target edges. How about a smaller target like a gallon milk jug????
Thank you for sharing your excellent review.
odavid
Sendero_Man
Well-Known Member
To answer your questions...
1. It is set up to run on maximum power with the reticle. You can run at other powers and dial as well.
2. The wind hash marks are 5, 10, 15 MPH holds for a full value wind from 3 or 9 o'clock.
3. Yes it is a second focal plane scope/reticle. It doesn't stay constant thru the power range adjustment like a FFP.
4. The scope is at 15x and you can see in my article the thru the scope steel picture at almost 1000 yards is easily seen. That steel is 24" diameter for reference. You could easily see those other target sizes you mentioned as well.
Thanks for your comments and questions.
1. It is set up to run on maximum power with the reticle. You can run at other powers and dial as well.
2. The wind hash marks are 5, 10, 15 MPH holds for a full value wind from 3 or 9 o'clock.
3. Yes it is a second focal plane scope/reticle. It doesn't stay constant thru the power range adjustment like a FFP.
4. The scope is at 15x and you can see in my article the thru the scope steel picture at almost 1000 yards is easily seen. That steel is 24" diameter for reference. You could easily see those other target sizes you mentioned as well.
Thanks for your comments and questions.
Sendero_Man
Well-Known Member
Messages replied to.
Please post questions here so all can benefit.
Thanks !
Please post questions here so all can benefit.
Thanks !
HARPERC
Well-Known Member
Good review! Thank you. Looking at the Nightforce site it appears there is also an F1 version (FFP) if that's a persons preference.
So what are the advantages to ffp scopes?? Disadvantages are more cost..... Not sure I can justify paying more to have the cross hairs align the same when the magnification is increased. It seems to me this scope works at the highest magnification settingThat is the way it was designed to work. So no point in increasing the magnification. So Cross hairs will be the same cause there is no change in magnification.
If I have it wrong then let me know.
If I have it wrong then let me know.
HARPERC
Well-Known Member
I may have misspoke about this reticle being available. I went back and looked, and there is a velocity reticle 1000 listed, but it's the LV.5. I sent an e-mail to Nightforce hoping to clarify the point.
I don't wish to open the FFP-SFP debate, it tends to generate a lot of heat. Use the search bar top right corner to read them.
For ME-the velocity reticle in FFP makes sense in one application, I have a semi-auto being built for predator hunting. Coyotes etc. can be shot as multiples, or as a single with the range changing with each shot. For me the scope will likely be on the lowest setting to start with. and not having to dial turrets or power rings seems like the better way to go. Sender_Man has shot a hell of a lot more coyotes than I have, and his opinion should carry more weight than mine. As far as expense, the price of higher end optics keeps going up, and up, and as individuals we all have limits.
I don't wish to open the FFP-SFP debate, it tends to generate a lot of heat. Use the search bar top right corner to read them.
For ME-the velocity reticle in FFP makes sense in one application, I have a semi-auto being built for predator hunting. Coyotes etc. can be shot as multiples, or as a single with the range changing with each shot. For me the scope will likely be on the lowest setting to start with. and not having to dial turrets or power rings seems like the better way to go. Sender_Man has shot a hell of a lot more coyotes than I have, and his opinion should carry more weight than mine. As far as expense, the price of higher end optics keeps going up, and up, and as individuals we all have limits.
Sendero_Man
Well-Known Member
Extremely happy with the scope !
If you get a chance, try one out.... You will be glad ya did.
If you get a chance, try one out.... You will be glad ya did.
THANK YOU FOR ANSWERING MY QUESTIONS.
Can you explain how you would set up this scope if you typically shot at 2800' elevation and randomly hunt at 5000' elevation, the opposite of your review example?????
You stated this in the review:This allows me to do a slight down correction if I travel to higher elevations and I can always dial up a quarter or half MOA from my zero if needed if I go to places that have lower elevation.
For example, I live in Wyoming at about 4650' ASL. I like to go to Montana to shoot and hunt with a friend in Glasgow, which is 2600' ASL. When we shot out to an 830 yard steel, I only needed .25 MOA up correction to put me dead on, which equals about 2 inches at that distance. (.25 X 8 = 2") That shows what a small amount the reticle was off when I changed over 2000' in elevation. Most shooters, myself included, and especially in a hunting type of situation, can't hold .25 MOA.
THANKS IN ADVANCE AGAIN
ODAVID
Can you explain how you would set up this scope if you typically shot at 2800' elevation and randomly hunt at 5000' elevation, the opposite of your review example?????
You stated this in the review:This allows me to do a slight down correction if I travel to higher elevations and I can always dial up a quarter or half MOA from my zero if needed if I go to places that have lower elevation.
For example, I live in Wyoming at about 4650' ASL. I like to go to Montana to shoot and hunt with a friend in Glasgow, which is 2600' ASL. When we shot out to an 830 yard steel, I only needed .25 MOA up correction to put me dead on, which equals about 2 inches at that distance. (.25 X 8 = 2") That shows what a small amount the reticle was off when I changed over 2000' in elevation. Most shooters, myself included, and especially in a hunting type of situation, can't hold .25 MOA.
THANKS IN ADVANCE AGAIN
ODAVID
I was considering the velocity 1000 reticle for my 300 WM Sendero until I realized by their own words that if temperature, altitude, or incine changes, not even considering using a different bullet, I have a very expensive basic crosshair. With the advancements of ballistic computers, PDA applications, and advanced rangefinders that take into account these changes from initial range conditions, a reticle that would follow the pattern style of the MOAR while adding in wider MOA windage holds as you progress down the reticle would suite any shooter under any condition that has the ability to calculate a shoot-to MOA reading for holdover and windage hold using the reticle. It would be the best of both the MOAR and the Velocity 1000 and satisfy any shooter of any cartridge under any condition.
I sent an extensive and detailed e-mail to the folks at Nightforce as well as talked to one of their reps. at length. They agreed completely with the concept but said R&D doesn't work on anything that their administrative management doesn't initiate. Bottom line if we want a different reticle in production, the consumers of their products such as the members of this and other long range shooting sites need to call in to Nightforce and offer their input and support on such a reticle. Threads such as this and customer response caused nightforce to create a finer MOAR reticle called the MOAR-T. Members please call Nightforce.
I sent an extensive and detailed e-mail to the folks at Nightforce as well as talked to one of their reps. at length. They agreed completely with the concept but said R&D doesn't work on anything that their administrative management doesn't initiate. Bottom line if we want a different reticle in production, the consumers of their products such as the members of this and other long range shooting sites need to call in to Nightforce and offer their input and support on such a reticle. Threads such as this and customer response caused nightforce to create a finer MOAR reticle called the MOAR-T. Members please call Nightforce.
Litehiker
Well-Known Member
I really like that reticle but it sounds like a 2nd focal plane reticle. Given my druthers I'druther have a 1st focal plane scope like my Bushnell ERS 3.5-21 X50 with its H 59 "Christmas tree" reticle.
I dunno, do 1st focal plane scopes cost more to make?
I dunno, do 1st focal plane scopes cost more to make?
1st focal plane scopes do cost more, and that would solve the issue of needing to use a specific magnification to get exact MOA increments on the reticle. That being said I would be happy with the aforementioned reticle in either 1st or 2nd focal plane. Vortex optics makes both within reasonable cost, but I don't want to experiment with other brands when Nightforce scopes have been proven. What kind of cost can you place on a missed shot on a guided big game hunt when your scope has been bumped, etc.?
The Nightforce brand is not my favorite. For the cost there are American Manufactured scopes that are every bit as good if not better. A Burris Black Diamond comes to mind. I make it a practice not to buy high end equipment made in Japan or anywhere besides USA. and assembled who knows where. Nightforce used to advertise as an American made scope but, after much discussion and hatred from members of forums towords those who tried to prove they were not
American, Nightforce removed the "Made In USA" from their advertisements. I have several Nightforce scopes and I can't sell them now that people know. My Burris USA scopes are awesome and you couldn't take them from me.
There are a few good USA scopes out there now. The Nightforce is a good scope very comparable to the finer higher quality Japanese scopes. Nikon, andVortex being excellent choices in Japanese and Philippines manufacture and very comparable in quality to the Nightforce for 1/3 the price. The Vortex are very cost effective. The Nikon is also a top choice. I would take either over the Nightforce. The Nightforce is a good scope but definitely not worth the outrageous price for a Japan scope. For one third the price there are alot of fine scopes out there from Japan. Nightforce is just another good Japanese scope nothing more. The price however is nowhere near their value. I would take my Nikon or Vortex any day for 3 to 400 dollars over a 1100 dollar nothing special Japanese scope. By comparison the Burris Black Diamonds I own are obvious extreme quality. Never let me down yet on my 338 Lapua. P.O.A has never changed in 1100 rounds, dozens of years and 1000's of miles of travel. My opinion.. don't hate me I'm old buy American. If your looking for a good value go Japan. If you like being ripped of... go China.
American, Nightforce removed the "Made In USA" from their advertisements. I have several Nightforce scopes and I can't sell them now that people know. My Burris USA scopes are awesome and you couldn't take them from me.
There are a few good USA scopes out there now. The Nightforce is a good scope very comparable to the finer higher quality Japanese scopes. Nikon, andVortex being excellent choices in Japanese and Philippines manufacture and very comparable in quality to the Nightforce for 1/3 the price. The Vortex are very cost effective. The Nikon is also a top choice. I would take either over the Nightforce. The Nightforce is a good scope but definitely not worth the outrageous price for a Japan scope. For one third the price there are alot of fine scopes out there from Japan. Nightforce is just another good Japanese scope nothing more. The price however is nowhere near their value. I would take my Nikon or Vortex any day for 3 to 400 dollars over a 1100 dollar nothing special Japanese scope. By comparison the Burris Black Diamonds I own are obvious extreme quality. Never let me down yet on my 338 Lapua. P.O.A has never changed in 1100 rounds, dozens of years and 1000's of miles of travel. My opinion.. don't hate me I'm old buy American. If your looking for a good value go Japan. If you like being ripped of... go China.
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Litehiker
Well-Known Member
Japanese made or US made, I could care less because "You get what your pay for." (Unless it's Chinese garbage.)
My Bushnell ERS 3.5 - 21 scope is a great scope, easily the equal if not better than the top Burris scopes. I have an older Burris Black Diamond (2nd focal plane) and it's a good quality scope so I do like Burris too.
As for focal plane, these days a 1st focal plane reticle in a variable power scope is essential for many reasons. Just ask the military.
RETICLES:
BDC ->Ballistic Drop Compensated reticles are, as some in this thread acknowledge, limited by altitude/temperature and longer distance, say beyond 400 yards. To quote a Shooting Times article on reticles, "... but when when you really need a BDC reticle that is when they start lying to you."
And again from that article, "That (BDC) reticle is made for ONE ballistic coefficient, velocity and air density. If any of that changes significantly the reticle isn't worth a hill of beans." - not to mention changes in bullet shape and weight.
That's why I like a mil dot reticle for hunting and REALLY like the Horus H59 graduated reticle for competitive shooting. And that is also why I'll never waste my money on a BDC reticle.
My Bushnell ERS 3.5 - 21 scope is a great scope, easily the equal if not better than the top Burris scopes. I have an older Burris Black Diamond (2nd focal plane) and it's a good quality scope so I do like Burris too.
As for focal plane, these days a 1st focal plane reticle in a variable power scope is essential for many reasons. Just ask the military.
RETICLES:
BDC ->Ballistic Drop Compensated reticles are, as some in this thread acknowledge, limited by altitude/temperature and longer distance, say beyond 400 yards. To quote a Shooting Times article on reticles, "... but when when you really need a BDC reticle that is when they start lying to you."
And again from that article, "That (BDC) reticle is made for ONE ballistic coefficient, velocity and air density. If any of that changes significantly the reticle isn't worth a hill of beans." - not to mention changes in bullet shape and weight.
That's why I like a mil dot reticle for hunting and REALLY like the Horus H59 graduated reticle for competitive shooting. And that is also why I'll never waste my money on a BDC reticle.
