new to wildcatting...help!

I know you fellows will sure enjoy your first wildcat. Learn how to anneal brass and you will enjoy wildcats even more. The cream of wheat fireforming method is without a doubt the best method I've used to form with. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif web page 50_BMG This link is a great source of information on case annealing!
 
3 six - Good to here that. I want to try it out. What do you think about fireforming already fired 1x or 2x brass? I don't think it will be a problem but it <u>is</u> a stretch for the shoulders and necks. I've heard read that the necks tend to run short as it is, I would hate to compound the problem.
 
COWBOY, that's why I sent you the link for annealing. If you don't anneal the necks you aren't going to have any fun, It's welcome to crack brass city. This is even more the case with once fired cases. This is the reason I do not care for the .243AI as that crappy short neck on the .243WIN does not get any longer when you AI this case. What does kick is the 6mm REMINGTON AI, it's even better with a 35 deg. shoulder rather than the 40 deg. shoulder. I know there will be howls of hate, I don't remember any hand loader that knows squat that likes a short neck case! The reason I like the 35deg. shoulder over the the 40deg. is the fact that you loose less cases when you load. The 35deg. shoulder means no more brass trimming after the first trim (cases don't grow) You still get the extra powder capacity. The big down side I see about AI in a used barrel is what it can do to a good reamer. The throat in your barrel can be vary hard from the repeated firings. However if the guy doing the work on the re-chamber doesn't care why should I? One thing about re-cambers, the barrel doesn't get anymore accurate, so if it ain't good to start, it ain't gonna get better. And remember if you are going to use brass thats not new, learn to anneal! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif
 
Never had a problem with case neck stretching using the COW method simply because pressures are quite low. The process just uses the COW to push the case to fit the chamber.

The COW might even lap the barrel a bit. Try and prove that one /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

you can use once fired brass. The caveat is don't size the brass anymore then you have to. If you use a case that had a high pressure forming, squishing it down a bunch then expanding again will lead to case head separation in short order.

I just throw once fired brass into the chamber and hope it fits. Then I have no issue to COW them and use them. If the case does not fit, I will partial size so that they are a firm fit when chambered. This keeps everything nice and tight so no case head stretching occurs..at least as little as possible.

I also rarely anneal case necks anymore. As long as there are no splits in the first 3 to 5 loadings, the annealing is good enough.

Jerry
 
Centre Punch: All ctg cases have been annealed from below the shoulder. The reason we don't see the discoloration on most commercial brass as the maker polishes the cases after they final draw and pinch trim. All military brass on the other hand is not polished after the final draw. Cartridge cases are annealed a number of times during all the stages of manufacturing. The head stamp is even important to the hardness of the case as the case has been annealed and the case needs to be hardened at the head. ( a soft head case is deadly) If you can take the time to view the 50BMG link you can readily see the flame bars that stops the flame going any deeper (further down towards the head). Why is this annealing so important to forming? Well brass hardens two different ways. 1. Work hardens 2. Season hardens. The last can be seen in old brass cases that were loaded many years ago, the necks will show cracks. We the re loader do not spend to much time trying to form from 50+ year old military brass (like we did as kids). So the work harding we deal with comes from repeated firings and reloads. This working of the brass hardens it to the point of being brittle. We usually see this after we fire the ctg. Starting with new unfired brass we don't need to anneal. However if we are going to make a lot of change in forming then even with unfired ctg. we do need to anneal! Please read about annealing this is such and important subject that we need to understand the subject to it's fullest! My good friend Dr. Ken Howell wrote the book that covers this subject so vary well. The article on the 50BMG web-site is written by the Dr. and is a great read. Even better is his book. One of many hundreds of books in my collection of firearms books and "one of the vary best"! Hope I have made this clear? If not let me know! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif
 
Well, I might have done one thing right /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gifI am having anew mike rock bbl.put on as opposed to rechamber /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif
 
Jimm ,
What twist barrel ? What projectiles are you hoping to shoot ?
I have a 9 twist and so far 46.5 gns Varget with the 55gn Nosler has been the most accurate load . Currently playing with the 87 V Max and H4350 which is showing promise at 44.7 gns . Need to come back a little on that .
No luck with the 70gn SMK or BT or 95gn Berger VLD at reasonably high velocities. I like speed and accuracy .
 
Bushchook, rate of twist is 1 in 8.Hope to shoot 85 gr. sierra hpbt on the light end and 107 gr smk on the heavy end.Guess I'll have to wait and see what it likes best. Jim
 
Hi Jimm,
What will be my regimen when i receive my AI? Phew! thats a good un, where do i start?
First off there will much admiration, handling and more admiration, /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

After my excitement has died down i'll get down to the serious buissiness.
Having had rifles built by my smith in the past, he will supply me with a dimensioned drawing of my chamber,so i can cross reference measurements between 243 cases and the chamber.
Using Redding Competition neck bushing dies i will take 110 new Lapua cases(i bought a case of 500 when i bought the 243) the ten will be for setting up purposes and benchrest prep them consisting of:

1.Run all the cases into the neck sizing die to size them enough to be expanded.

2.Expand all the necks on the neck expander mandrel.

3.Trim cases to length of the shortest case. de-burr case necks and remove sharp edges with wirewool.

4.I will then de-burr and chamfer the flash hole and uniform the primer pocket depth ( this may have to be done several times before the brass settles down).

5. At this point i will neck turn because i will have specified a chamber tighter than saami specs. You may not need to or want to neck turn but i think it is essential for consistant neck tension.

6. After neck turning i will de-burr the outside of the neck very gently and cut a VLD chamfer on the inside and once again remove sharp edges with wirewool.

7.After selecting the appropriate neck bushing, i will size the necks to give approx. 002" to 003" of neck tension.

8.Priming will be carried out with Federal 210 Gold Match primers.

9.For a fireforming charge of powder i will select a top end load of medium burning range for 243, from the tables out of one of my manuals, something like W760, H380 or H4350

10.Using the rod down the bore method, i determine the cartridge overall length and then seat a bullet so it is hard into the lands.

We are now ready to start fireforming and enjoying ourselves at the range. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif
My barrel break in process is a little different, ie, i zero my scope first, i can usually do this in 3-4 shots after boresighting, i quote "usually". /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif
Watch those beautifully fireformed cases pop out each time you work the bolt! More admiration. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif
From then on, one shot and clean five times, three shots and clean three times and finally five shots and clean two times.
As i usually spend two days at the range, overnighting in the Clubhouse i will most likeiy get all of my fireforming done and can start load developement, although i will be taking chrono readings and notes while fireforming.

I hope this gives you some insight into how i would do things and even though the case prep can be very time consuming ite all worth when you are out in the field or on the range. Enjoy your shooting.

Ian.
 
Centrepunch,Thanks for the effort,man ,that was alot of work!The only real difference for me is that I did'nt order tight neck.I just dont want to neck turn.After the initial fireforming I plan on using the ladder method as described by Abinok to develop loads.BTW where is your range?Although I spent a lot of time in Scotland I did'nt go to England very much.Scotland has some lovely long range vistas,you ever get up that way to shoot or is it not that simple?Since I was in the military while there the ins and outs of what civilians could was never clear.Thanks for the info., look forward to exchanging load development news. Jim
 
Centrpunch, Are you saying you will use your chamber dimensions to order the appropiate size bushings to neck size initially?Also , just received a batch of lapua brass,man!, I've checked these things nine ways to sunday and I'm not sure I should do anything to them but neck size then load /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cool.gifI obviously, have never used lapua before so this is a revelation .They are all the same length,weight within .2 up or down ,case head size,and zowie! inspection with a strong light source and magnifying lens of the flash hole reveals perfectly clean,clear holes,magnifique! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/laugh.gif Oh well going back and do some more drooling, Jim
 
jimm: welcome to European made shooting products. I'm willing to bet U.S manufacturers pray the shooting public never finds out what has been missing from them for low these many years. It's not that they are not capable of these standards, they just don't think the market is big enough to justify the cost. Once again the rush to mediocrity rears it's ugly head. But don't we see this in most U.S. made products? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif
 
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