new to the site, questions about my rifle

Discussion in 'Rifles, Bullets, Barrels & Ballistics' started by cummin_un_glued, Nov 27, 2010.

  1. cummin_un_glued

    cummin_un_glued Well-Known Member

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    hi everyone my name is Dustin and im from north central arkansas. i am new to this site and new to shooting over 500y but i have allways been interested in long range shooting just never had a rifle set up for it. currently i have a weatherby vanguard in 7mm rem mag that my dad bought for me years ago. over the last few weeks i've been doing alot of research and i have found a few upgrades for my rifle but i know that its not a very popular gun. not nearly as popular as the rem 700. my question is should i mess with this rifle at all or should i leave it alone and start all over with a rem 700? i'm going to guess that the answer will be start with a rem 700 and even if i do that i still want to improve this weatherby as well because it shoots well now for a outta the box hunting rifle. it is holding 1 moa out to 400y and honestly i have not shot it much past that very many times. all opinions and advice will be great.

    thanks

    Dustin
     
  2. SBruce

    SBruce Well-Known Member

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    Welcome to LRH,

    Sorry, but have to answer your question with a question.

    Is your rifle shooting moa with factory ammo? Or is that with the best most precise handload you can develop??

    Have you modified the gun any at all yet? Bedding the action, trigger job or Timney replacement, ect.??

    What kind of optics are you using to shoot 4" groups at 400 yds??

    If you're shooting factory and the rifle hasn't been modified or improved any by a good gunsmith........I think it's got potential. If you're shooting with a 3-9 scope that has thick crosshairs and no parallax adjustment.....I think it's got potential.

    My longest successful shots out hunting have been made with Ruger 77's. They needed a little minor improving and well tuned handloads, but it didn't cost me as much as a new rifle would have, and I eventually shot the barrels out of them after many years.

    Yes, the Rem 700 is like the 350 Chevy engine used to be; everyone made performance parts for it. But that didn't mean it was always the winner of the race.

    Best of Luck!
     
  3. cummin_un_glued

    cummin_un_glued Well-Known Member

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    those groups were with 150gr hand loaded barnes X...i had them loaded for me so not sure about the details exactly of the rounds...the optics suck that i am changing soon, i had a bushnell 4-12 with a thick crosshair i didnt like it at all

    as far as mods it has none at all, bone stock outta the box
     
  4. Willys46

    Willys46 Well-Known Member

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    The weatherby vanguard is a good starting point. Its the same as the HOWA 1500.

    As for after market parts, yes there are not as many, but what do you really need?
    Stocks--Joel Russo,B&C,McMillan,and Manners
    Triggers--Timmney, Tuned Factory(pretty good),
    Bases--EGW offers 20 MOA
    The only issue if you can call it one is the barrel threads are metric. No big deal for most smiths.

    The action is very strong and usually tighter tolerances than Rem 700. Extractor is better.

    As you can tell I am a fan, I just put a 308 together for my brother to shoot tactical matches..The thing holds .5-.6 MOA ALL DAY!

    If i were you i would start hand loading first. With anything you build, to get the best out of it, you will have to hand load.

    After that, I would look at a better stock or having yours glass bedded. The weatherby vanguard will not have the resale value of a Rem, But i believe you will have a better system than a Rem.
     
  5. RDM416

    RDM416 Well-Known Member

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    Dustin,

    Welcome to the LRH site. Where are you in north central Arkansas? I live in the Searcy area.

    If you are close and want to bring your rifle out sometime I would be happy to look it over and offer some advice on how to set it up for long range shooting. If the rifle shoots well and you are happy with the 7mm caliber you would probably be better off working with it for now and using the money you would spend on another rifle on better optics or other "necessities" for long range shooting. I assume here in AR you are mainly hunting whitetails. The 7mm rem mag is plenty of rifle for whitetails at well over the 500 yard mark you mentioned. You are correct that the WBY action is not all that popular for building a custom rifle, but that does not mean they do not or cannot be made to shoot well. I have a custom rifle built on a MK IV action and many others on this site have customized and factory WBY rifles that shoot very well indeed.

    just post me a reply here or send a PM if you want to get together sometime and check out your rifle. I have a range here at my house where we can shoot to 1000+ yards. I am headed to KS for a deer hunt next week, but after that I should be around.
     
  6. cummin_un_glued

    cummin_un_glued Well-Known Member

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    yeah i have allready found all those parts on midway usa's website and allready plan on buying those parts...just havnt figured out which rings to go with the base....so that settles it i will be building this rifle....also i like the Bell n C medalist stock but its for short action only

    RDM i am from Ashflat so searcy isnt that far away its like 1.5 hrs so yeah we will get together sometime

    also i am looking at loading equipment also because i know that i will have to load my own for consistancy.....yall have any sugestions for equipment?.....from what i hear the 140gr bullets shoot the best in a 7mm so i'm looking at 140 bergers
     
  7. RDM416

    RDM416 Well-Known Member

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    Dustin,

    If you are not familiar with Sinclair you should check out their site, request a catalog it is easier to look through and mark things.....

    You will need at minimum:

    Press............ RCBS is hard to beat, but I have a Forster co-ax as well and like it better for most applications.

    Calipers........ get a digital set they are not that expensive

    Case Trimmer........ RCBS is good. Wilson is the best (IMHO)

    Powder measure....... I like digital and use an RCBS loadmaster, balance beam type will work just fine for starters though.

    Case neck de-burr tool.......... about any will do.

    Case lube...... I use Imperial Sizing Die Wax, Hornady One Shot is an easy to use spray lube. I don't like the RCBS lube with the foam pad.

    Primer tray, case holders, shell holders, and of course dies.

    That will pretty much get you started, but there are many more things you will need to accumulate. Here are a few more things I use on a regular basis.

    Hand primer seating tool............ go with the Sinclair, expensive but worth it
    Primer pocket uniformer
    Flash hole de-burr tool
    Neck trimmer
    Hand de-priming tool
    Device for measuring "run out"
    Various other measuring devices for measuring neck thickness and other things as you get more precise in you loading.

    Probably leaving something out, but that is all I can think of right now. Everyone develops their own style, so some of the other guys may have some "essentials" that I forgot or don't use.
     
  8. BigSkyGP

    BigSkyGP Well-Known Member

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    Calipers, yeah don't go too cheap on those. I prefer Starett, they seem to be resonable and they apear to have a more consistent repeatable zero.

    I've seen some real crappy blue-point, and many others. They will keep you in the ball park, I'm just a little picky in the measuring instrument dept. There are a lot of different brands, and I'm sure better than even Starett.
     
  9. cummin_un_glued

    cummin_un_glued Well-Known Member

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    thanks for the info guys

    so far this is what i have came up with

    timney trigger - Timney Rifle Trigger Weatherby Vanguard, Howa 1500, Mossberg 1500, S&W 1500 with Safety 1-1/2 to 4 lb Blue - MidwayUSA

    egw 20moa base - EGW 1-Piece Picatinny-Style 20 MOA Elevated Base Howa, Weatherby Vanguard Matte Long Action - MidwayUSA

    stock? i would like this bell and carlson but they dont have it for long action? Bell and Carlson Medalist Light Tactical Rifle Stock Howa 1500, Weatherby Vanguard Short Action with Aluminum Bedding Block System Varmint Barrel Channel Synthetic Black - MidwayUSA

    havnt settled on optics or rings yet suggestions that dont break the bank?

    as far as reloading for now there are a couple guys around here that i know that i'm just going to have load me up like 100 rounds or so while i'm figuring out how to reload, but i was looking at this starter kit, i know i will have to add more to it but what about it? RCBS : RCBS Rock Chucker Supreme Master Reloading Kit -
     
  10. RDM416

    RDM416 Well-Known Member

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    Dustin,

    Burris makes some rings that are pretty good and not real expensive. Don't really know what to tell you on scopes. I have gone to Night Force scopes on all my long range rifles because I prefer to "dial" rather than use multi line reticles. There are some pretty good Leupold scopes out there that have multi reticles. You will need a multi line reticle scope or one with dial up turrets. Guessing at holdover is simply not a viable way to do long range shooting. Some of the other guys here may have some specific scope models for you to consider.

    The RCBS Rock Chucker kit is an OK way to go, I and many others started our reloading journey with one of those. Knowing what I know now, I would not buy that though. The press is about the only thing in there you will end up using very long. In my opinion, that kit is perfect for "reloading" but for long range shooting you need to be "handloading". You will eventually end up buying better versions of almost everything in the kit except maybe the press.

    Tell you what, I just thought that I still have my old rock chucker press (from my kit 25 or 30 years ago) I replaced it with another press a couple of years ago and I will give it to you if you want it. It may be old, but it is still perfect working order. You could use the money you would have spent on the kit to set yourself up with some more precision tools. Just let me know if you want the press and I will have see if I can remember where in the garage that I stashed the thing.....
     
  11. cummin_un_glued

    cummin_un_glued Well-Known Member

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    optics - yeah i know i need adjustable target turrets that's what i've been looking at midway has a BSA scope on sale right now, its a really cheep scope but the reviews are pretty good about it and i figure it would be a decent start untill i can get something like a nightforce

    BSA Tactical Mil-Dot Rifle Scope 30mm Tube 6-24x 44mm Side Focus Glass Etched Mil-Dot Reticle Matte - MidwayUSA

    was looking at these rings also, the reviews say that the rings that come with the above scope are not that great and they are too tall, again cheep i know but like i said i'm just gettin started and i'm not lookin to spend 5k on a setup just yet...kinda sucks tho that i cant use my leupold rings with that 20moa base

    http://www.midwayusa.com/viewProduct/?productNumber=381092

    yeah! i'd take that press if your not using it and i will use the $300+ on the other stuff that i need in better quality
     
    Last edited: Nov 28, 2010
  12. Camshaft

    Camshaft Well-Known Member

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    Pass on the BSA. You will need a good tracking scope with repeatable click values. I currently use a Nikon monarch and for the money I don't believe it can be beat, except maybe by the the vortex vipers. Check camera land, they are having a big sale on vortex vipers. Also check out stockysstocks.com they are my number 1 resource when I need a stock.
     
  13. cummin_un_glued

    cummin_un_glued Well-Known Member

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    pass on BSA...noted i dont have a huge budget so what would you suggest for around the $250 range for optics?

    thanks for the link to the stocks they have plenty of options for my action

    what about barrels for this vanguard/howa action?
     
  14. Camshaft

    Camshaft Well-Known Member

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    There is a thread in the vendors section on the deal cameraland has on vortex Scopes. You should have no trouble finding somthing in your price range. Barrels are a big topic, I will defer to a higher knowledge on that.