Hi all, I'm new here. This has probably been answered and discussed already but I couldn't find where. I want to hunt deer out to ~1200 yards. My dad bought a Winchester Model 70 Laredo LRH in 7mm Mag NIB for about $700. Should I test the 7mm and see how it shoots accuracy wise? Should I get an aftermarket stock/barrel/action? Or should we sell it to put the money into something else? I don't have money to burn on this project unfortunately, so spending less is better, and I'd like to keep the whole thing under $2000 including the scope (thinking vortex). Any guidance or direction would be appreciated. Thanks
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Canhunter35
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Honestly...it's tough to get to 1200 yds on that budget. If you're just starting out, you need a practice rifle and to start reloading. Get a 308 or a 6.5, a decent tactical scope, sightron are a good value scope, a decent range finder that will range to 1200 yds and a kestrel...along with bipods and a rear bag. Then get shooting. Buy accuracy 1st long range DVD. Once your banging steel at 800-1000, work on a magnum that can kill things at those ranges. That 7mm might work, hard to say without tuning up a load
Canhunter is exactly right. 1200 yards is light worlds away from 400-500. Its not something you just "do", its a learning process you work into. That being said, a M70 in 7mm is something to build off of, and you have a legitimate tool to start with. Good luck!
Not being a wise guy but, you may "want" to hunt deer at 1200 yards, but you have a lot of work ahead to get there. And as already stated, it's going to take some coin and a ton of practice. I'm guessing that you don't hand load ammo, so you're at the mercy of finding a store bought ammo that shoots exceptionally well in your rifle. The first thing you need to do is find some ammo that will shoot somewhere near 1/2 MOA @ 100 yards if are going to have any hope of harvesting a deer at 1200 yards. If you find that ammo, then you have to start stretching the range out and see what happens. You are going to need decent optics to achieve your goal. You asked about different barrel, stock and action. The best money spent is a custom barrel if you determine that your rifle "won't shoot". Action probably not going to help much, but certainly you will want to bed it. I am not familiar with the stock that you have, so I can't comment on that. Unless you already are an acomplished marksman, you will be spending a lot of extra coin practicing with that 7 mag. I would recommend that you get a quality 223 and practice your shooting with that, then see how well that 7 shoots. As a practical matter, you may be further ahead to search the classifieds for a used custom LR rig already proven to be accurate. The owner can likely show targets shot with that rifle and provide load information. It would be fantastic if there is someone near you that has been successful at Long Range hunting to mentor you. That greatly shortens the curve. You are embarking on a fairly expensive quest. Good luck and enjoy the journey!
Thanks for the comments everyone. I should clarify that my dad has already has a model 70 in 7mm with a leupold cds that is set up out to 700, and the gun is a little light for my taste. But where we hunt a lot of places are like 600-1400 yards, so I'd like to expand that range. Which, yes is probably unnecessary. But I would like to anyways. We do reload and have a bunch of stuff for reloading like bullets, primers, powder, etc. Idk how to objectively or quantitatively explain how "good" I am at shooting, but I've been shooting for about 10 years. I can get MOA groups with my Tikka T3 from the bench but we haven't done a whole lot of serious reloading for it. I've shot at targets at 400 and took my best buck so far at about 375. Hopefully that clarifies some things. It sounds like it may be worthwhile working up some loads to see how it shoots and go from there.
Canhunter35
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I was thinking about your rifle and thought I would relate a story of one of mine own rifles.
I got a sako av chambered in 300wby from my dad, standard sporter barrel, nice laminate stock. The trigger is quite good in those sako so I lightened it and left that. Then I installed pillars, bedded it and free floated the barrel. The recoil was manageable with 150gr factory loads, the 180s were stiff and I wanted to shoot 212 eldx. So I installed a brake and a 20moa picatinny rail, I was putting on an old Zeiss scope with turrets but had a 1" tube and I'd ran out of elevation adjustment before so just installed the 20moa rail immediately. At that time, h1000 couldn't be found so I bought a can of imr 7977, found a load that shot .7-.8 Moa, but the velocity spread was terrible like 58fps or something. I had some imr 7828, made a load at same velocity and it had a velocity spread of 8fps. Except imr7828 is temp sensitive and I didn't want to chart the change in velocity...that's a lot of dope cards you need to carry. My loads were good to 400-500yds, maybe 600 if I pushed it., I've now got some h1000 and am gonna try maybe this weekend making a new load with a tighter es and sd on the velocity. Still won't be capable of 1200 yds shots, but maybe 700-800 yds if I get everything working good. Moral of the story: with factory ammo you need one that groups and shoots consistent velocity...that's hard to find. Not to mention everything else that goes into equipping a lr rig.
It's kind of long winded and apologize for that. Best of luck it's Lots of fun when that steel rings way out there!
I got a sako av chambered in 300wby from my dad, standard sporter barrel, nice laminate stock. The trigger is quite good in those sako so I lightened it and left that. Then I installed pillars, bedded it and free floated the barrel. The recoil was manageable with 150gr factory loads, the 180s were stiff and I wanted to shoot 212 eldx. So I installed a brake and a 20moa picatinny rail, I was putting on an old Zeiss scope with turrets but had a 1" tube and I'd ran out of elevation adjustment before so just installed the 20moa rail immediately. At that time, h1000 couldn't be found so I bought a can of imr 7977, found a load that shot .7-.8 Moa, but the velocity spread was terrible like 58fps or something. I had some imr 7828, made a load at same velocity and it had a velocity spread of 8fps. Except imr7828 is temp sensitive and I didn't want to chart the change in velocity...that's a lot of dope cards you need to carry. My loads were good to 400-500yds, maybe 600 if I pushed it., I've now got some h1000 and am gonna try maybe this weekend making a new load with a tighter es and sd on the velocity. Still won't be capable of 1200 yds shots, but maybe 700-800 yds if I get everything working good. Moral of the story: with factory ammo you need one that groups and shoots consistent velocity...that's hard to find. Not to mention everything else that goes into equipping a lr rig.
It's kind of long winded and apologize for that. Best of luck it's Lots of fun when that steel rings way out there!
Hand Skills
Well-Known Member
Welcome tmohler. You picked a great forum to participate in. They guys here speak with experience, and offer solid advice.
I'm not sure what kind of a shooting background you have, but my advice would be get out there and shoot. Shoot what you've got. 7mm RM ammo is actually pretty affordable, probably more so than any other magnum.
Get some dummy rounds, and dry-fire a LOT. I would suggest 5-10min daily. Practice breaking the trigger without moving the gun. Aim at the smallest target to can make/find.
If after a few weeks you find yourself feeling limited by the trigger, you are likely gaining interest. By this point you will have found out how well the rifle shoots and will be better equipped to decide if you want to start tuning ('accurizing') the M70, or want to go another direction. The rifle is already 'used' so you will not affect it's value much by putting 100rnds down the pipe!
Hold onto your brass. Even if you switch to a different caliber you will be able to trade it. It has value!
I'm not sure what kind of a shooting background you have, but my advice would be get out there and shoot. Shoot what you've got. 7mm RM ammo is actually pretty affordable, probably more so than any other magnum.
Get some dummy rounds, and dry-fire a LOT. I would suggest 5-10min daily. Practice breaking the trigger without moving the gun. Aim at the smallest target to can make/find.
If after a few weeks you find yourself feeling limited by the trigger, you are likely gaining interest. By this point you will have found out how well the rifle shoots and will be better equipped to decide if you want to start tuning ('accurizing') the M70, or want to go another direction. The rifle is already 'used' so you will not affect it's value much by putting 100rnds down the pipe!
Hold onto your brass. Even if you switch to a different caliber you will be able to trade it. It has value!
That helps, you have a running start. From the way you asked about replacing barrel, stock and action, I was thinking that you may be completely green. If you and dad are knowledgeable about load testing, you should be able to find a load that will make that 7 mag shoot. If it doesn't respond, invest in a custom barrel and you'll be off to the races!
Hand Skills
Well-Known Member
...just read your second post. When you say the gun is a bit light for you, do you mean physically light or chambering light? Pretty easy to add some weight or thread a brake.
Once you try a braked magnum, it's pretty hard to go back!
Once you try a braked magnum, it's pretty hard to go back!
The most important element in LRH/S and often overlooked is the NUT behind the trigger. The ability (of the nut behind the trigger) and capability (of the instrument, i.e. rifle set-up and other supporting equipment) to successfully hunt deer at 1200 yards does not happen overnight and there is no shortcuts - PRACTICE, PRACTICE, PRACTICE ... just saying.
