Neck tension...my delusion

Discussion in 'Reloading' started by blackbrush, Mar 18, 2010.

  1. blackbrush

    blackbrush Well-Known Member

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    It is rather embarrassing admitting this, but so what. How is one to learn? This kind of chaps me as it is error number 300,000,000…

    For the purpose of this example I will use the 22-250 caliber.

    With Redding Type S Full Length Competition Die, I was decapping AND neck sizing on the same pull of the handle…at least I thought I was.

    The decapping plunger is .222” diameter and I had a .243” neck size bushing installed in the die. I have obviously come out of my coma and can see now that I thought I was varying neck size with different bushings in the past but most certainly I was sizing one dimension on the downstroke and when the plunger/decapping holder exited the case it resized the ID back to approximately (considering spring back) about .222”.

    So just to confirm my understanding of my error, I must decap and then neck size, in that order, correct?

    If my understanding is realigned, I guess I better start all over in load development as I was never varying any neck tension.

    Thanks!
     
  2. gunner45

    gunner45 Active Member

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    I THINK, and I'm sure someone with more experience will come along, that you need a spindle that is smaller than your intended final inside diameter. Redding makes them. So when you pull the case back out of the die, it doesn't even touch the inside of the case and leaves it as sized by the bushing.
    If you call either Redding or Sinclair, they will be very helpful and walk you through what you need.
     
  3. Warning Shot

    Warning Shot Member

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    Thank you Blackbrush- after reading your post, I realize I'm doing the same thing with my Redding NS die, only with a different caliber.

    Some folks have a tough time recognizing their own mistakes. Not I and apparently not you.

    THANKS !!
     
  4. boomtube

    boomtube Well-Known Member

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    Your precess sounds fine to me. And the .222 diameter of your expander is perfect for good bullet tension and seating.
     
  5. MSU Marksman

    MSU Marksman Well-Known Member

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    What you're doing isn't completely wrong though. As mentioned above, the .222 diameter of the expander still provides adequate tension to hold the bullet. Not to mention that as long as your .243 outer neck bushing minus case walls is smaller than .222, you might even get a little spring back from your running the neck past the expander.


    On a side note, I just picked up a Lee decapper die and avoid the whole expander ball issue. I only use my bushing die to resize the necks of my brass to where I want them.
     
  6. arkrunner

    arkrunner Well-Known Member

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    I bought a redding s fl die set at a pawn shop cheap and when i got it home realized that it only had the full sized expander button installed in die. I called redding and explained the same issue as you have decribed above. They sent me a undersized button to hold the decapping pin. then the bushings can size like they are designed to. Redding was great sent parts for free and I had they in 5 days. thanks elton
     
  7. blackbrush

    blackbrush Well-Known Member

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    OK...this makes sense to me now...it made no sense in going through the recommended neck bushing formula to come up with a number to the thousandths AND THEN have this button expand it on the departing stroke of the press.

    I am calling and see if I can get a smaller button as you did!

    Thanks!
     
  8. woods

    woods Well-Known Member

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    Get a Universal Decap Die (from any manufacturer I use Lee), take the whole expander stem out and get the right bushing to give you the neck grip you want. There is absolutely no reason to buy an expensive bushing die to squeeze the neck down too small and then re-expand it with an expander ball. Might as well buy a much less expensive Full Length Die.

    In your example, a 22-250. Measure the outside diameter of a loaded round, say it measures .246", then your .243" bushing will size the outside of the neck down to that size and you will have .003" bullet grip. No expander needed.

    Or if your OD on the loaded neck is .250", then get a .247" or .248" bushing and you can try a .002" or .003" bullet grip.
     
  9. LRHWAL

    LRHWAL Well-Known Member

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    My understanding was that the Type S dies except for .17 are shipped with the expander and with a decapping pin retainer, to allow use without the expander ball on the decapping rod. You should have all you need without buying another part.
     
  10. blackbrush

    blackbrush Well-Known Member

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    Thanks guys!

    Each one of you have been great help...I am ready to go at this in the correct fashion now.

    Cheers!