My 308 has me baffled

westTXcrd

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As stated above, I would suggest simply asking your smith if he removed the barrel for threading. If so, then head spacing is your likely culprit. A phone call is all takes to explore this.
I called the smith and the guy that did my barrel is out on vacation. I figure at this point it doesnt matter much because that load is no good. I tried several primer and 4895 combos with no luck, so i reached way back on my shelf, and gave imr 4320 a whirl. Second load attempted got her under a half inch at 100. No pressure signs. I reckon i will play with this load a little more. As for measuring, i dont own a headspace gauge and any brass fired from before has all been resized so i dont have any way to compare. This forum is awesome, thanks for all the input yall!
 

westTXcrd

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I'm a custom Smith of 30 yrs so I will give you my take on this.
Got a break.
Got ceracoat
You can eliminate the ceracoat by looking in bore by the crown with light and magnifier. I have seen ceracoat and ceracoat in bores.
Nobody I know would dial a barrel in for threading and not taking the 1 extra minute to touch the crown. This wouldn't raise pressure anyway. As far as getting setup for threading for the brake goes as long as the barrel will reach through the chuck there is no reason to take it off. Shorter barrels are much harder to do in the headstock so I take them off and do them in a custom figure. Basically a double spider setup. None of this would give more pressure. Now here is the only thing I think could. The barrel was removed and put back on with less headspace. This would be able to raise pressure. If the barrel was put on with more headspace it essentially would have more volume.
When loads were put back in gun after all the work were they very hard to close the bolt on? Or maybe the loads were right on the edge of being hot and there is a temperature rise causing the excess. All I got for this.
Shep
Yes they seemed a little tight closing the bolt. I think your barrel removal and slightly tightened headspace theory is the most likely at this point. Yes the load was close to max and i guess thats what put it over the edge. I looked all over and wasnt able to find any cerakote where it didnt belong. Thanks for your time, input, and experience!
 

John 264

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First post so bear with me. Rifle is model 10 savage in 308 with heavy contour 20" barrel. I have had the gun for around ten years. It was finicky but i finally found a load she loves. LC brass, rem primer, imr 4895 @46gr. 155gr amax. Shot lights out. I did two things recently to give the ol gal a facelift, she got cerakoted. I also have a can coming (Q trash panda), so i had the barrel threaded and put on a cherry bomb break (Q's version of quick detach). Grabbed some of my loads off the shelf when I got the gun back and first round, the primer spit out. After a few more showing signs of pressure, i went back and stuffed some more trickling each etc, and still showing signs of pressure. The load shoots well still, but dangerous. Can a break change the pressure that much? also, i screwed my buddies can onto my break and had a poi shift of 7" which i thought seemed a little excesive but i am new to whisper pickles.. any ideas yall?
did they take your barrel off to thread it if so the gun is probably out of head space
 

freddiej

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From what you have said: here are my deductions on POI shift and your pressure signs.
first Cera-Kote adds to your dimensions, so if you have the action bedded to the stock your stock might be bending your barrel up slightly. that is one thing to check.
second, if the 'smith used a live center instead of a 4 jaw chuck to thread; your crown is AFU (all F-ed up) . I have had model 10 FP's 223 and 308 their crowns are target 90 Deg crowns and are easily ruined by certain machining processes so I would take a really close look at the crown, if it looks like it's had a 60 Degree cone shoved into it hard; get it recrowned. this could also be why you have pressure signs, the crown could be a bit of a choke at the end bringing your pressure up or the 'smith took some of your headspace away by giving you an even tighter chamber when he put the barrel back on.
In the past muzzle brakes have only helped any of the rifles I have added them to. your problem in my mind is not with the muzzle device. Experiment time; take it off and things go back to normal then we have problems with the muzzle device.
I have no experience with suppressors. I do know that they make an AR-15 need more maintenance, after that I have only shot some of my friend's cans on AR's and one bolt gun.
 

Mram10us

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any good smith will remove the barrel so it spins concentrically on the lathe. Then the barrel would be reassembled on the action. So most likely it's a headspace issue. It might even be that the rifle was oversize from the factory without you knowing and put back to proper spec - I've seen a few like that, most recently a m70 300WM.

try to chamber some of your fired brass from before the operation. I bet they'll be very tight.
False. You do not have to remove a barrel from the action to have it spin concentrically. Take the barreled action out of the stock and the trigger off. You are threading at slow speeds (90-200) and don’t need to worry.
 

freddiej

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I forgot to look at the pictures before I wrote my first post. I have a very big concern.. the almost case head separation in your pics. grab a resized case, put a primer in it and fire the primer outside, measure the protrusion of the primer before you do anything else. if it is over 0.010" you have too much headspace and need to have the barrel re-headspaced.
 

skipglo

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First post so bear with me. Rifle is model 10 savage in 308 with heavy contour 20" barrel. I have had the gun for around ten years. It was finicky but i finally found a load she loves. LC brass, rem primer, imr 4895 @46gr. 155gr amax. Shot lights out. I did two things recently to give the ol gal a facelift, she got cerakoted. I also have a can coming (Q trash panda), so i had the barrel threaded and put on a cherry bomb break (Q's version of quick detach). Grabbed some of my loads off the shelf when I got the gun back and first round, the primer spit out. After a few more showing signs of pressure, i went back and stuffed some more trickling each etc, and still showing signs of pressure. The load shoots well still, but dangerous. Can a break change the pressure that much? also, i screwed my buddies can onto my break and had a poi shift of 7" which i thought seemed a little excesive but i am new to whisper pickles.. any ideas yall?
I'm thinking like others residue (paint) in the chamber. Have dozens of breaks and no problems from any of them
 

westTXcrd

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I forgot to look at the pictures before I wrote my first post. I have a very big concern.. the almost case head separation in your pics. grab a resized case, put a primer in it and fire the primer outside, measure the protrusion of the primer before you do anything else. if it is over 0.010" you have too much headspace and need to have the barrel re-headspaced.
No primer protrusion
 

Riflehunter1776

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False. You do not have to remove a barrel from the action to have it spin concentrically. Take the barreled action out of the stock and the trigger off. You are threading at slow speeds (90-200) and don’t need to worry.

its the best way to do it
 

Riflehunter1776

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Not trying to do anything except correct a false statement. I have nothing personal against you but your statement is wrong. Why are you getting offended? I’m wrong about things all the time
no barrel is perfectly straight. they all have some amount of run out. that is why all quality smiths that I know remove the barrel before threading rather than ramming it through the back of the lathe and cranking it down into a chuck with the action spinning around. especially if the threads are for a silencer and any degree of error could cause a baffle strike. But that's fine if we agree to disagree. I'll stick with the people who do work I can count on; there are plenty of gunsmiths I would not take work to.
 

Mram10us

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no barrel is perfectly straight. they all have some amount of run out. that is why all quality smiths remove the barrel before threading rather than ramming it through the back of the lathe and cranking it down into a chuck with the action spinning around. especially if the threads are for a silencer and any degree of error could cause a baffle strike. But that's fine if we agree to disagree. I'll stick with the people who do work I can count on; there are plenty of gunsmiths I would not take work to.
Now you are the one being rude. Quality gunsmiths do this all the time and it makes zero difference. It’s obvious you don’t build rifles, and that’s ok, but you shouldn’t call me and many others that don’t take the barrel out of an action wrong for not adding in many more potential problems. See headspace :)
 

Riflehunter1776

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Now you are the one being rude. Quality gunsmiths do this all the time and it makes zero difference. It’s obvious you don’t build rifles, and that’s ok, but you shouldn’t call me and many others that don’t take the barrel out of an action wrong for not adding in many more potential problems. See headspace :)
if someone is worried about not being able to get the headspace set correctly when they rebarrel a rifle.....well then, my point stands about people who know their craft. It's obvious you are just trying to be disagreeable, and that's fine. You are welcome to spend your time arguing about who is right on the internet if you don't have any customer's rifles to build.

I've been through the trial and error of seeing who builds fine rifles and who is a basement bubba. And to be fair, I'd have to see your work to know which one you are. But after years of seeing crap work, I have become very careful about who I take rifles to, and since this is a point which has come up before in talking with them, I am saying that the 2 best gunsmiths I know both take the barrel off when they thread. And they also reinstall it to the proper headspace.

that's all I really care to argue about the topic.
 
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