MOA at 400 but can't get on target at 650?

Discussion in 'Long Range Hunting & Shooting' started by Tommy1984, Sep 19, 2019.


Help Support Long Range Hunting by donating:


  1. Tommy1984

    Tommy1984 Member

    Messages:
    15
    Joined:
    Sep 19, 2019
    Hey guys, so I have browning stainless stalker in 300 WSM topped with a Leupold VX-5hd and shooting 180 grain trophy grade accubonds. I have a 100 yard zero and chornographed the speed im shooting. Im also using a gunwerks br2500 to get my elevation dials, and it worked perfect out to 400 or so yards where it was still holding MOA.

    The issue is when I tried to take it out to 650, I spray painted a large rock about 3 feet by 3 feet orange and set up on it, made my dial and took aim slowly squeezing the trigger, each time I shot id raise my head to see a puff of smoke drifting in the wind near the rock thinking I made a hit..

    Well after about 10 rounds I drove to my target to see I didn't make contact a single time! I hit ALL around it tho but could not even touch a 3ft by 3 ft target..

    I also had another shooter with me who was also making Moa size hits at 400 yards with the rifle and they too had the same results as me at the 650 range..

    Does this sound like a shooter issue or is it possible for the rifle to open it groups up that big over an extra 250 yards?

    Thanks for any input.

    Tommy
     
    Last edited: Sep 19, 2019
  2. cohunt

    cohunt Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,460
    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2016
    wind?
     
    vancewalker007 and 30BR like this.
  3. Tommy1984

    Tommy1984 Member

    Messages:
    15
    Joined:
    Sep 19, 2019
    I made a mental note that it was very calm, even the dust cloud from the bullet impact was lingering for a couple seconds, plus the impacts seemed to move all around not just to the left or right. Some high, some low, some left, some right type of deal.
     
  4. Plinker147

    Plinker147 Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    539
    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2015
    Wind, correct ballistics, and possibly larges ES and SD causing load to fall apart at distances. I would think you would still hit the rock but it might contribute. At 600+ is where these things really start showing more.

    And possibility you were try to see your impact too much and lacking follow through.
     
  5. ShtrRdy

    ShtrRdy Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    2,252
    Joined:
    Jan 14, 2012
    It does sound like air movement that could cause that behavior. Would you mind describing what the landscape is like between the shooting position and the target?
     
  6. CVCOBRA1

    CVCOBRA1 Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    388
    Joined:
    Sep 20, 2014
    Sounds like something is loose. Retorque stock screws and scope mount screws.
     
  7. Tommy1984

    Tommy1984 Member

    Messages:
    15
    Joined:
    Sep 19, 2019
    It’s a reclaimed strip mine, I wasn’t shoot across a deep canyon or anything.
     
  8. ShtrRdy

    ShtrRdy Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    2,252
    Joined:
    Jan 14, 2012
    Are you shooting across a flat surface with no mounds on either side within 100 yards? And no mounds underneath the bullet travel?
     
  9. cohunt

    cohunt Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,460
    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2016
    could you read mirage? my 7rem mag has a difference of almost 7" of wind drift between 400 and 650 with a 4-5mph wind (which is pretty light)-- add a degree or 2 of scope/rifle cant to that and it can be around a foot--slight differences can cause large changes when you get out over 400 yards --shooting angles, slight wind, rifle cant, slight differences in velocity, slight changes in wind, even a zero that is off by a 1/4" at 100 yards can change your poi at distances

    have you confirmed muzzle velocity/drop out past 400 yards before?
     
    Last edited: Sep 19, 2019
  10. Tommy1984

    Tommy1984 Member

    Messages:
    15
    Joined:
    Sep 19, 2019
    Imagian a v and I’m shooting across the narrow part of the v where it steps down in benches if your Familiar with the way strip mines bench slopes when they put them in.
     
  11. Tommy1984

    Tommy1984 Member

    Messages:
    15
    Joined:
    Sep 19, 2019
    No not that day, it was later in the evening after it started to cool down a little.
     
  12. Mach 1

    Mach 1 Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    595
    Joined:
    Jan 11, 2018
    If your gun shoots an moa at 400 yards it should be fine at 650. The wind isn’t doing that to you providing your shooting all around the 3’ by 3’ target. If I were you I’d put up paper every 50 yards and start by shooting at 400 yards. Look to see if the bullets are key holing the paper. I wouldn’t think the accubonds would destabilize from 400 to 650 but weirder things have happened.
    It may just be the shooter too. Take someone with you that u know to shoot well. Shoot from a very sturdy platform. I test off of a Sinclair fclass bipod and a rear eared bag filled with heavy sand. Also chrono all of your shots when testing and look for fluctuations.
     
  13. Tank308

    Tank308 Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    61
    Joined:
    May 4, 2019
    Barrel fouled or barrel got to hot. Maybe. Or as stated above something is loose. Hope you find it soon.
     
    floyd kittrell likes this.
  14. Tommy1984

    Tommy1984 Member

    Messages:
    15
    Joined:
    Sep 19, 2019
    Barrel may have been hot, we had just fired 10 rounds or so at 400 yards.
    If I could find a smith to do it, I have a carbon wrapped barrel installed but they don’t seem to like working with Browning’s.
     
    floyd kittrell likes this.