Mass Shootings - Why?

Being in law enforcement, I see these problems often, and I can tell you, it generally has nothing to do with LE. When we get an individual that is a threat to themselves or others, but has not committed a crime, in this area they are held on what's called a title 25, different states may have different names for it.

After that, they must be "evaluated" by a mental health physician, within 24 hours of their detainment.

Essentially all a person has to do is act relatively "normal" and tell the evaluator that they are fine, and make it seem like it was a temporary laps in judgement, or they only said what they said or acted how they did because they were under the influence of something. After that, the title 25 is generally dropped, and we must release them, often times with no follow up from the evaluator.

This loop continues until they break the law in some fashion. Then they may be brought in on charges as well as a title 25, or simply just charges.

Once they go to court, if they try to say they are not mentally stable, or if they act mentally unstable, then they have to be evaluated by a state run hospital, in our case. We have had people in our jail for over 7 months at times in limbo, simply waiting to get evaluated. People that very possibly don't belong in jail, but instead a permanent mental facility, and seriously need help, and jail is only making their condition worse. Then once they finally get in for evaluation, who knows what happens. I have seen them say someone was "unrestorable", then the judge says "well, they did 6 months jail time waiting for evaluation, that is likely as much time as they would have done for these misdameanor charges. Release them, time served". With little if any mental follow up. And they are back on the streets, unsupervised, or put on a supervised probation that everyone knows they will fail, because they are mentally unstable, amd are only going to self medicate with drugs and alcohol, which is obviously a violation of their probation.

Then, when they get arrested again a few weeks/days after getting out, the process starts over. But it gets worse.....

They finally, 6-7 months or more later, get back in for another mental health evaluation. The same mental health doctor does the evaluation. The same evaluator that, 6-7 months ago, said this person was "unrestoreable". But on this evaluation, they say this person is mentally fit to stand trial. But again, this person has done 6 months for their crime, which in this case, is sufficient. So they are let go on the streets, again. And again, arrested a week or two later, and again, wait on another mental health evaluation.

The biggest problem is the broken mental health system, which is exacerbated by the fact that they are being inundated with more and more patients due to all the drug use problems in the country, drug problems that are being advocated by certain states such as Washington, California and others, where one can get on disability because they are addicted to drugs, and get paid by the state so they can continue to buy more drugs with their tax payer funded dollars. All the while, law enforcement across the country can't keep their departments staffed, and government ran mental health facilities are functioning sub par due to a lack of proper management, funding and staffing.

Hopefully that wasn't too political, but that is the problem as I see it from where I stand, dealing with people like this directly, on a regular basis.
^^^THIS^^^
Same story here on the "East Side". I can't recall the number of people I've picked up on "202A Petitions" (what we call it here) OR directly taken into custody based on my own observations….only to sit them down in front of a computer screen for a 'Zoom Meeting' evaluation and then take them right back to where I got them because they weren't deemed an immediate/imminent threat to themselves or others…..for whatever reason.

And I quote Alfred Lord Tennyson, "Ours not to reason why, Ours but to do and die". 😐

I won't attempt to speculate or quarterback events that I did not witness or take part in, but having been a SRO (as well as SWAT and K9) and currently just a regular 'road deputy' I will say this. In the event of an active school shooter scenario here if I'm the first on scene…..I go in….weapon(s) "hot". If 2 or 3 of us arrive on scene at the same time….we quickly formulate a plan based on whatever intel we have at the moment…and we go in…weapon(s) "hot". If the "situation" changes upon entry then we have to adapt/adjust to those changes accordingly, but the main goal is to put down the threat as quickly as possible and save as many lives as we can. Even the most advanced and spectacular school security in place is rendered totally ineffective when "somebody" props a door open. There's "Next Level" human error at work in every aspect of these kinds of situations…it's just Tragic.🙁
 
The training didn't take in those in a appointed or elected leadership role. Had any officers done one thing against orders even if it saved lives they would have been hung by their leaders to have their entire life and family's live devoured by.....see above.

Ok ok ok....I posted my thoughts....done.
That is why few want to be in law enforcement….dammed if you do damned if you don't So many are playing "Monday Morning Quarterback" and boasting as WHAT THEY WOULD HAVE DONE. In reality, they probably would have sh-t their pants and ran. It makes me sick to see the media deflecting what happened to any one else other than the person and reason why he committed this devilish act. This shows you how the media/society will do whatever they can to further erode AUTHORITY.
 
That is why few want to be in law enforcement….dammed if you do damned if you don't So many are playing "Monday Morning Quarterback" and boasting as WHAT THEY WOULD HAVE DONE. In reality, they probably would have sh-t their pants and ran. It makes me sick to see the media deflecting what happened to any one else other than the person and reason why he committed this devilish act. This shows you how the media/society will do whatever they can to further erode AUTHORITY.
Amen.
 
We need answers on this egregious system failure before anything else can be considered IMO. We need to push our representatives to get answers. What corrective preventive actions MUST be taken by those Agencies and Education to stop a potential shooter?
It's has all gotten to political, to many lawyer and judges who release criminals but don't throw out frivolous lawsuits. A certain three letter agency doesn't do there job for the public but they'll d**n sure go after unarmed protesters for the political regime. They don't want to do their job, for political reasons, fear of lawsuit or just plain aren't cut out for the job if you're afraid to go in, get another job! We as the people that this country was founded for should have the power to fire the people responsible for the debacles at Waco, Ruby Ridge and other stupid incidents that could of been handled a lot better. We should also be able to fire the ones that will go after peaceful protesters but will do nothing about the blm riots and others that destroy communities. Do Your Job The Right Way And Not Politically Or QUIT THE JOB! This Political Correctness In A Free Society Is Not Politically Correct!
 
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I can tell you one thing as a retired Houston Fire Fighter , I have had too follow a lot of orders on scene some good some bad . In a situation like this I would be going in like I didn't hear the orders not too . I've been in the situation we're a Captain and his authority with lack of experience wasn't close too what I knew was right, giving stupid orders . I know things can go bad , but with that much life at stake believe me I would have been at the head of the pack, others would have followed. Captain , Chief man with all the confusion I didn't get the message, that's the time too let your experience and training take over and do all you can do at all cost and pray along the way. Who knows they may have been a bunch of rookies but I doubt it , I hate too be a Monday morning Quarterback , but my nature would have had me going in, one way or the other
 
That is why few want to be in law enforcement….dammed if you do damned if you don't So many are playing "Monday Morning Quarterback" and boasting as WHAT THEY WOULD HAVE DONE. In reality, they probably would have sh-t their pants and ran. It makes me sick to see the media deflecting what happened to any one else other than the person and reason why he committed this devilish act. This shows you how the media/society will do whatever they can to further erode AUTHORITY.
True it is all to political we need people that will do the job first and then worry about the fallout. That's when we need judges that will look through the stupid stuff and throw out cases with no merit. I'm all for law enforcement so please don't think I'm not from my previous post but the way they went after Koresh with the media that was all political, the fbi should of had information on the Uvalde murderer he had been in trouble in another state that failed to report it. Not going after criminals or just releasing them with no repercussion is not working. Also didn't we used to have mental facilities to keep an eye on some of these people now they put them on the street and say take your medicine, people with mental problems we are counting on them to take their medications how moronic is that?
 
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To me your answer is found in one word LAWYERS. Today LAWYERS make our laws/rules. Judges who must be LAWYERS by law entrench the laws. LAWYERS talk with other LAWYERS to pervert and make large sums of money from the laws/rules made by LAWYERS.


Just my perception and opinion.
Agreed. But lawyers are just doing their part in lawsuits filed by frivolous people. Everyone wants to sue for everything because everyone feels entitled and as if they've been wronged. Not to get political, but how many lawsuits has Trump been in? It's how some people do business.....
 
When we were talking about this the other day my granddaughter, who is in high school, was telling us (besides what I stated in the previous post) that besides the main door being locked and each classroom door locked, each room has some type of what she called a fire door lock that can be installed in seconds over the inside of the door that makes it virtually impossible for the door to be opened from the outside. Additionally, and don't laugh, each seating has either a couple rocks, 1/2 bricks and other fairly heavy objects that are used to throw at an intruder to keep him distracted as they mass attack him and subdue him.
 
Agreed. But lawyers are just doing their part in lawsuits filed by frivolous people. Everyone wants to sue for everything because everyone feels entitled and as if they've been wronged. Not to get political, but how many lawsuits has Trump been in? It's how some people do business.....
Just because someone files a lawsuit doesn't make it frivolous. Some ar and some are not. Why don't you take your own advise and not make this one political. If you do you are no better than the politicians. The victims deserve more than your TDS kicking in.
 
When we were talking about this the other day my granddaughter, who is in high school, was telling us (besides what I stated in the previous post) that besides the main door being locked and each classroom door locked, each room has some type of what she called a fire door lock that can be installed in seconds over the inside of the door that makes it virtually impossible for the door to be opened from the outside. Additionally, and don't laugh, each seating has either a couple rocks, 1/2 bricks and other fairly heavy objects that are used to throw at an intruder to keep him distracted as they mass attack him and subdue him.
It's tragic that they need to do that and think that way when they're in a place to be learning, but good for them for doing it.
Just because someone files a lawsuit doesn't make it frivolous. Some ar and some are not. Why don't you take your own advise and not make this one political. If you do you are no better than the politicians. The victims deserve more than your TDS kicking in.
I agree and yes, some are frivolous and some aren't. Trump's just the example that came to mind. There are plenty of people out there filing frivolous lawsuits, like the person who sued McDonalds for the coffee being too hot. My point is that we now feel like everything is someone elses fault and we'll sue them for it.
 
Those guns retail for $1800.-$2000
Nobody should sell an 18 year old kid those guns.
If a bar tender can be held accountable for selling to much booze to a drunk why not a gun shop owner?
OH I know he has rights ,Bull ****!
 
This may win the award of the dumbest post ever.
I Agree , but working in gun sales , it would have raised a eye brow . I sold guns before the 1968 gun control act and after , if you sold a gun too someone that filled out everything right but something raised a red flag it might help us too keep our gun rights if it was reported too the local authorities. I think a 18 yr old 2000 rds of ammo 50 magazines , 2 Daniel defense AR s , might have raised my eye brow . I don't know all the details , but someone dropped the ball on this one. Believe me I think we have all the laws we need but with stricter enforcement. If we are too keep our gun rights , we have too figure out a way too keep them out of the wrong hands as much as possible.
 

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