legality question

royinidaho

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 20, 2004
Messages
8,938
Location
Blackfoot, Idaho
Am I correct in understanding that if an action is purchased that has never been part of a rifle it may be used to build a pistol without any legal issues?
 

buzzgun

Well-Known Member
Joined
Aug 30, 2006
Messages
173
Am I correct in understanding that if an action is purchased that has never been part of a rifle it may be used to build a pistol without any legal issues?
Yes, you are correct.

Oct 29 1992
Dear Mr. XXXXX:

This refers to your letter of October 1, 1992, in which you inquire
about the legality of manufacturing a handgun which utilizes a rifle
type receiver.

26 U.S.C. Chapter 53 # 5845(a)(4), the National Firearms Act (NFA),
defines the term "firearm" to include a weapon made from a rifle if
such weapon as modified has an overall length of less than 26 inches
or a barrel or barrels of less than 16 inches in length.

Utilizing the receiver of an existing rifle for the purposes of
manufacturing a handgun would constitute the making of a firearm as
defined above. Individuals desiring to make such a firearm must first
submit an ATF Form 1, Application To Make And Register a Firearm and
pay the applicable $200 making tax.

If an individual were to obtain a rifle type receiver that had not
previously been utilized in the assembly of a rifle, a handgun could be
made and not be subject to the provisions of the NFA. Verification
must be obtained from the manufacturer of the receiver to establish
its authenticity.


We trust the foregoing has been responsive to your inquiry. If we may
be of any further assistance, please contact us.

Sincerely your,
(signed)
Edward M. Owen, Jr.
Chief, Firearms Technology Branch
 

buzzgun

Well-Known Member
Joined
Aug 30, 2006
Messages
173
I've been seeing this talk about a dealer "designating an action" on a couple of forums........might be required by state law, but NOT by federal.

The current form 4473, that you fill out when buying a firearm from an FFL, lists 3 possible types of firearms.....specifically, handgun, long gun or "other firearm"......the form explains that "other firearm" definition includes "frame, receiver, etc"........the dealer does not "designate" anything.......if you buy a bare receiver......it should be listed on the 4473 as an "other firearm".......it is not legally a handgun or a long gun until it is assembled as such......that's why a person MUST be 21 to buy an "other firearm".......


http://www.atf.gov/forms/download/atf-f-4473.pdf
 

royinidaho

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 20, 2004
Messages
8,938
Location
Blackfoot, Idaho
Roy, Roy, Roy,,, One project at time....OK?:D
Just dreamin' about this one. Something like a 270 WSM or 270-375 Ruger with a 160 class high bc bullet.

Assembling a 6 BR as one project.
Still designing components for the bullet project. Its coming along. Learning machining is the critical path item. Plenty of time while the bedding on the 6 sets up to do other things.:)
 

eddybo

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 5, 2007
Messages
1,651
Location
MS
I think brownells has rem 700 short actions again....just saying
 

buzzgun

Well-Known Member
Joined
Aug 30, 2006
Messages
173
I think its better safe than sorry, if its going to be a handgun anyways... you dont want to travel to a different state and find out your gun is not registered right. Besides, if you wanted to turn it into a rifle later there is no issues going from a pistol to a rifle...

I went with a 7wsm and with r17 it is pushing 168's @ 2850 :) Still need to play with the 180's I've got.
You missed the point.......if you list a bare action as a handgun on the 4473, you have made a false statement on a federal document!!

A bare action is not legally a handgun or a long gun until it is assembled as such.....if your dealer states in a federal document that he is transferring a handgun to you, when, he is actually transferring an "other firearm", I can see potential legal problems for him and possibly for you too.

As far as the idea of "you dont want to travel to a different state and find out your gun is not registered right".......well, don't know where you live, but most states don't "register" firearms......besides that, how would you "find out your gun is not registered right" while in another state??? The only way law enforcement would know is to run a trace through BATF and the only way that is going to happen is if your handgun is involved in a crime.......at that point, you have bigger problems than whether a local law enforcement officer understands the difference between a bare action and a handgun and how one becomes the other legally.........
 

buzzgun

Well-Known Member
Joined
Aug 30, 2006
Messages
173
First, Look in box #18 ATF Form 4473, July 2005 revision It's handgun, long gun, or BOTH, not "other firearm". I do not see "other firearm" anywhere on the form 4473 you "quoted"...
Second, When My FFL went to check BOTH the guy on the phone from the ATF said when it got transfered to an individual it had to be designated as either a handgun or a long gun. According to you, when a guy buys an action for a rifle build he would have to mart the BOTH box, and wait 48 hours just like a handgun? Because that would not
Third, How many bolt action pistols do you have that have been built on undesignated actions? Cause I still love MINE

First, go click on the link I posted........it is the current 4473 posted on the OFFICIAL ATF website.......NOT something posted on ocshooters.........look at box 18 on the current 4473 listed on the ATF website........or, maybe you think ocshooters is a more reliable source for current info??? (the one posted at your link is the 2005 version)

Second, if you had read my post that included the link, you would have seen where I said it is not legal to sell a bare action (other firearm) to ANYONE UNDER 21.......that's because it can legally be assembled into a handgun.

Third......as I explained earlier.......when a person buys a bare action.......it should be listed correctly on the 4473 as an "other firearm"........not both handgun and long gun.......I never said anything about marking both and waiting 48 hours........I don't know where YOU live, but there is no waiting 48 hours to receive a handgun in most states.........most places, you walk in, fill out the 4473, dealer does NICS check and, if you are cleared, you walk out with your handgun........that's the way it's done in most of the states.

I personally haven't built a single handgun on an "undesignated action" because there is no such thing.........there are long guns, hand guns and "other firearms"........there is no such thing as an "undesignated action"......that is a meaningless made up term that seems to have originated over on Speciality Pistols........

You are arguing with the wrong guy here.......I have spent hundreds of hours studying firearms laws......I KNOW what I'm talking about.....

I'm still waiting for you to explain how you would "find out your gun is not registered right" while in another state"???
 
Last edited:

zuba

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 21, 2007
Messages
601
Location
Grafton, WI
I'm pretty sure it says where I'm from right across from my name... I thought that was obvious... All I tried to do was tell how My father and I had to do it. TWICE. but that was a few years ago, I didn't say he had to do it that way. I did do it around 2005 thats why I posted it. When I did it there wasn't an other option. I have better things to do than check if something I did a few years ago changed, like actually shooting... I'm done here
 
Last edited:

Recent Posts

Latest Classifieds

Nightforce has great tracking capabilities, they are rugged, a bunch of elevation, holds zero forever, and reticles are designed for long range shooting. So if you are looking to shoot long distances constantly, then you need a scope that can take the abuse. -- gilmillan1


Culture Of Excellence At Nightforce Optics
By Len Backus

A high level of quality both in production and in service. Read More


Nightforce is such a solid combo of reticle, available elevation, glass that is good enough to shoot at the longest range you can dial. Nightforce has bullet proof construction that can handle the incidental horse rolling or some other rodeo action. -- bigngreen


Nightforce ATACR Scope Review
By Jeff Brozovich

The new NightForce ATACR is for sure a top choice for any long range shooter. Read More


The total package. Nightforce is the best I have used as far as turret feel and solid detents. I have never had one that didn't track right on and always return to zero. Nightforce NXS is the best value for everything I need. -- Broz


Nightforce Velocity 1000 Reticle Review
By Scott Shreve

I think Nightforce knocked it outta the park with this reticle! Read More

NightForce


Top